A Perspective From Over There

[Dundee Slaytern]

I guess we'll just have to wait for riverbend to install a webcam while wearing a burka( for anonymity) and standing next to an American soldier waving his hands and saying, "Howdy-do", while tanks rumble in the background.



Or maybe she is a fraud. Who knows?

[Timber Loftis]

"Henna Aziz" + engineering + bagdad

That's a lousy search construction that probably wouldn't turn up anything. Especially just tossing it out in the web. It's about as likely to get results as trying to shoot a fly with a .22 in a dark room. Didn't you say you were a programmer? Surely you realize you should have done several permutations of this, including other words and phrases, to really be able to challenge this bloggers identity. You've taken some really speculative arguments and done a fine job of puffery, but in the end you're just left with puff.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by pritchke: I personally think arguing if the author of the blog is genuine or not is quite pointless and tiresome. Wouldn't it be better to attack/discuss her views and facts of the blog and not her personally. Even if she was a fake would that make all she said wrong?

I think the issue of whether this person is who they say they are is actually quite pertinent.

I personally have no opinion either way on her actuality, but until it is ascertained she is who she claims, her views can't be taken with total seriousness.

We had a case in Australia of a woman who wrote books, autobiographical ones, about life as a minority... a Ukrainian Jew or something, can't remember which. It turned out she was making the whole thing up. Complete fiction.

Now, if there is no "paper trail" that is of some concern. Rather than simply dismiss Prometheus right to assert his doubts, why not argue a case for her genuinity. All I've seen are people attacking his doubts, rather than present evidence to the contrary.

Even if every one of Prometheus doubts are unfounded, it doesn't prove she is who she says if no affirmative evidence is offered.

The internet IS an anonymous zone. I praise Prometheus' scepticism. He didn't simply accept the words put before him, but questioned them. Even if she turns out to be who she says she is, and his concerns unfounded, the fact that he questioned is justifiable in my eyes.

Just my 2c.

[promethius9594]

1) reference to Allah:
Allah is a proper name, its like when a jehovah's witness calls God Jehovah. It IS proper to say Allah is good if you are refering to the proper name: ALLAH. even Christians recognize that our God's proper name is not "God" but rather one of several names (Jehovah, Yeshuah, Jesus, I Am). If I were translating from english to aramaic and discussing christianity i wouldnt translate who i was talking about into simply "God" because it is non descript. Now, taken simply by itself, yes, it is a dubious arguement.

2) Falloojeh, im not going to argue any more about this one after this because i think we've beaten it to death. what i will say is this: there are 24 million iraqis. There IS internet in Iraq, or was, prior to the war. there are LOTS of web blogs with others who "claim" to be iraqi's. you would think that of the probably at least one million iraqi's on the web that ONE of them would spell it the same. i've tried about fifty different queries on several search sites and it does not exist. I even searched it on al jazeera's search site, looking in all the iraq pages.

What does that mean? well, you say, just because we havent SEEN another iraqi who spells it quite the same way... But if you would take a class in logic (or look up logical fallacies online) you would know that denying evidence is a form of logical fallacy. The comment "just because it hasnt been seen" is fallable in that after significant cases have been shown (ie-- searching via an iraqi search page) it is entirely reasonable to doubt the as yet unproduced evidence. if you want to prove me wrong, produce another site by a verifiable iraqi who spells fallujah in the same way. until that point i have to doubt your claims that her spelling which is so counter cultural is actually proof of anything other than that she spelled it wrong the first time and must continue to do so or call more doubt upon herself.

2) Henna Aziz is a flipping joke. no, that search isnt the only parameter i ran. i tried less parameters, but when i removed bagdad i got one who lived in the united states. press releases nearly always include the location of where the story occured. i tried both the word engineer and engineering because when the premiere engineer in your country is assasinated, you generally print SOMETHING in regard to that. But even the name seems a little made up. Henna is the name of a type of temporary tattoo. aziz is one of the most common names used in movies for arabic people. both are dubious proofs in themselves, but combined with the fact that no major news releases seem to know about this person makes the story all that much more doubtful. want to prove me wrong? provide IMPERICAL evidence. post a link to the site where you find evidence that Ms. 'Aziz' DOES exist. THATS how you prove me wrong, not by just nitpicking one of my MANY points.

3)Burka. she got it wrong. she mentions klashkinov rifles, and heat (LOTS of heat). these are both things that are readily available factors on the news. other things she is MUCH less clear on. she can tell if its an appache or a chinook attacking the city? doubtful, chinooks arent used for assault, theyre used for transport. she knows if its an F-16 or a helicopter? Well, theres alot more than F-16's attacking over there, and pretty distinct planes at that. It might also be pointed out that planes havent dropped bombs on bagdad since the end of "armed conflict" though i dont doubt that helicopters MAY have been used for supression. One more reason to doubt on the heap of small factors that make her story incorrect.

4) Yorick is right. if her story is invalid, then her whole arguement is incorrect and therefore bunk. I'm willing to admit that i'm wrong, provided someone can provide definative proof that she exists... not some made up stories that she produces because she assumes "other people will accept them since so many of my other stories agree with the news" but hardcore proof that shes real: IP address would be perfect.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by promethius9594: 1) reference to Allah: Allah is a proper name, its like when a jehovah's witness calls God Jehovah. It IS proper to say Allah is good if you are refering to the proper name: ALLAH. even Christians recognize that our God's proper name is not "God" but rather one of several names (Jehovah, Yeshuah, Jesus, I Am). If I were translating from english to aramaic and discussing christianity i wouldnt translate who i was talking about into simply "God" because it is non descript. Now, taken simply by itself, yes, it is a dubious arguement.

Actually Melusine is correct. Allah literally means "the God" Al lah. From Elohim in hebrew, or El loah. (Which means "most high") It's certainly not a proper name, for in Arabic Christians bibles, Allah is the word used.

"Theos" is Greek
"Yhwh" is what he called himself - I am. (not the incorrect derivation Jehovah)
Elohim was one of the "names" the hebrews gave to Yhwh. More like descriptions, than proper names.

And so it is in Arabic. Allah is the Elohim equivalent.

[Timber Loftis]

Totally [img]graemlins/offtopic.gif[/img] but I like Yorick's response regarding Yahweh. It's a philosophically cool name. There's so much contained in it. It ended up taking Western philosophy centuries to get to Descartes and other philosophers who put forth the notions contained in God's statement (via burning bush) to Moses that, "I am I am." Very cool stuff.

Anyone seen the movie Pi?

Okay, back to regularly-scheduled programming.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: Totally [img]graemlins/offtopic.gif[/img] but I like Yorick's response regarding Yahweh. It's a philosophically cool name. There's so much contained in it. It ended up taking Western philosophy centuries to get to Descartes and other philosophers who put forth the notions contained in God's statement (via burning bush) to Moses that, "I am I am." Very cool stuff. Anyone seen the movie Pi? Okay, back to regularly-scheduled programming.

It is cool. I like that element also.

No I haven't read Pi.

Have you read the book Ecclesiastes? It may take your fancy.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: Totally [img]graemlins/offtopic.gif[/img] but I like Yorick's response regarding Yahweh. It's a philosophically cool name. There's so much contained in it. It ended up taking Western philosophy centuries to get to Descartes and other philosophers who put forth the notions contained in God's statement (via burning bush) to Moses that, "I am I am." Very cool stuff. Anyone seen the movie Pi? Okay, back to regularly-scheduled programming.

Yeshua is on record as saying "before Abraham was born, I am".

[Skunk]

Originally posted by Ronn_Bman: I don't know if the blog is real or not, and I've read through quite a bit of it, but it still seems a bit too good to be true. There are those on this board whose first language is not English yet they use it better than some of the English or American members of this board(Mel comes to mind ), so speaking perfectly doesn't mean the blog isn't real, but it's one of many things that makes me wonder. I though there were problems with basic power and water in Iraq, and I thought people's jobs were gone, so they didn't have money for basic items and yet she still has an internet connection? Of course it's possible, just seems a bit.... off.

Not really Ron, there are mobile phones and landlines in Iraq by which a computer can connect in the good 'old fashioned' 56K modem style. We tend to forget how we did things in the past...

However, like you I remain sceptical of 'anyonymous' bloggers - with the exception of the original 'Bagdad blogger' whose existence and credentials were physically confirmed - so I tend not to quote them myself.

[ 04-23-2004, 04:35 AM: Message edited by: Skunk ]