Samurai kit--opinions wanted

[LennonCook]

Six, as long as they're rangers, they will get the two points in dual wield. Nothing can be done about it, which I think is one of the reasons that the generic archer came into existance...

EDIT: Same, I think, with choosing a racial enemy...

[ 04-17-2004, 10:26 PM: Message edited by: LennonCook ]

[SixOfSpades]

Originally posted by Lord: I think it seems fair to gain a +1 bonus to thac0 every 5 levels, but +2 bonus to damage every 5 levels as well?

From where did you get that +2 to damage? It's only +1. The Kensai, by comparison, gets +1 to hit and damage every three levels, and those are Fighter levels. At the ToB EXP cap, a Kensai will have accrued a total of +13 THAC0/Damage, and the hypothetical Samurai only +6.
But comparisons with the base class are the most valid; since the straight Ranger cannot Grandmaster, the Samurai effectively gets a -8 THAC0 bonus and +1 ApR. Then again, the pure Ranger whomps the Samurai's butt on the defensive side of the coin: Since Samurai must give up the RoP+2 in order to get a decent AC, they effectively suffer a permanent +2 penalty to their Saves. And the Ranger can always slap on a good Shield (thus narrowing the Samurai's +8 THAC0 lead to +3) and augment their Hardiness with the Defender of Easthaven or Armor of Faith--all of which are off limits to Samurai.

Why does the Samurai kit gain the ability iron skins? I don't see how it's in the least related to the Samurai.

If they're going to charge headlong (and relatively unarmored) into a fray, heedless of all the threats of imminent death, they should have a fighting chance of getting within striking distance before getting shot full of arrows. Basically, I added this to further separate the Samurai from the Kensai: The latter can only strike from behind somebody else, while Samurai would consider such behavior cowardly, and would much prefer rushing out to Tank.
Also, don't be misled into thinking Samurai can just pop off an Ironskins whenever they want to, willy-nilly. The rate of 1x per day per 15 levels means it'll be Chapter 6 or so before they gain the ability, and they'll never be able to cast more than 2 per day.

Originally posted by LennonCook: Six, as long as they're rangers, they will get the two points in dual wield. Nothing can be done about it.

Sadly, I think you're right. I was going to cast a level-based spell on them that set their proficiencies in 2-Weapon Style to 0, but that would mean players who wished to have a Dual-Wielding Samurai right from the get-go would be unable to. That plan will have to be scrapped, then....but I still wonder if it's possible to script their Racial Enemy to be set to Faerie.

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Should their armor restrictions be made harsher, to rule out all Plate armor (including Dragon/Ankheg Plate)? What about forbidding Chain and Splint as well?

Should the Ironskins go?

As for their Weapon proficiencies, should their starting skills in Samurai weapons be forsaken in favor of having them start out with maxed proficiencies in all of their available Weapon Styles?

[Lord]

Originally posted by SixOfSpades: quote: Originally posted by Lord: I think it seems fair to gain a +1 bonus to thac0 every 5 levels, but +2 bonus to damage every 5 levels as well?

From where did you get that +2 to damage? It's only +1. The Kensai, by comparison, gets +1 to hit and damage every three levels, and those are Fighter levels. At the ToB EXP cap, a Kensai will have accrued a total of +13 THAC0/Damage, and the hypothetical Samurai only +6.
But comparisons with the base class are the most valid; since the straight Ranger cannot Grandmaster, the Samurai effectively gets a -8 THAC0 bonus and +1 ApR. Then again, the pure Ranger whomps the Samurai's butt on the defensive side of the coin: Since Samurai must give up the RoP+2 in order to get a decent AC, they effectively suffer a permanent +2 penalty to their Saves. And the Ranger can always slap on a good Shield (thus narrowing the Samurai's +8 THAC0 lead to +3) and augment their Hardiness with the Defender of Easthaven or Armor of Faith--all of which are off limits to Samurai.[/QUOTE]First, that was a typo on my part. In my argument, I still meant to write +1 damage every 5 levels. My fault there.
The Kensaid does have a ridiculous bonus to thac0 and damage, but keep in mind that a pure kensai can't wear any armor at all. A kensai can't use missile weapons either to get insane amounts of damage from a distance. That leaves them to have to fight using their melee weapon, and although a kensai is a great fighter, he still will get clobbered if he is surrounded. There are some pretty powerful leather armors and such in the game, so a Samurai can still get very low AC. Infact, with ToB, you can get a leather armor that has the same AC as Full Plate Mail.

About your problem with dual wielding, try the 'casting a spell' idea by setting a restriction on Samurai on not being able to put 3 proficiency points in dual wielding until you have reached a certain level. That way, you can erase the 2 starting proficiency points at the very start of the game before you level up without having to worry about someone putting 3 proficiences in there. Justification of the restriction, kinda: As you practiced more with your dual wielding technics, you decided it's time to move on to the next step.

[gerr]

Looks like I am reviving an old thread..

First of all, yes, I am nuts and crasy [img]smile.gif[/img] .
Ok, with that out of the way, I have an idea for a special ability:

Sephuku (also known as "khara-kiri" in some countries).

Special ability, available at level 15
(may be once per day per 15 levels? But who needs it more than once a day anyway [img]smile.gif[/img] )

Samurai is a true warrior of honor devoted in serving his suseren and perfecting his warrior skills. Years of concentration grant his soul a special position - in that completion of certain rituals allows him to leave this live without betraing his beliefs and breaking his concentration. This lets his soul follow the chosen path tovards divinity: he gets reborn under circumstances allowing him to continue on his path with partial memories of his purpose and certain skills easily and preferentially relearned.

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Well, it would be cool to implement *that*, he-he. But I think its impossible within any given game and all but useless for any purposes of this story, so follow on...
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CHARNAME, being a godchild, has a special connection to deity that gives him exclusive puriness of purpose and concentration. Thus not only CHARNAME is reborn maintaining his purpose, he is also able to keep his memories to a larger extent. What's more, in these troubled times when attention of many gods is concentrated on Bhaalspawn, he is able to draw upon all the released energy and get reshaped into the adult and active form, essentially picking up where he left off. All that of course given successfull completion of the ritual while being concentrated on his purpose.
Unfortunately material belongings and his mere mortall companions cannot follow him...

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Well, what does that all mean?
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Implementation particulars:
Upon completion of *uninterrupted* sephuku
(well, this part should be easy as special abilities are quick, but in the middle of the battle, who knows...) CHARNAME disappears from the battle. His armor/weaponry/loot gets dropped. His party is disbanded; all the participants supposedly flee immediately making their way to their normal locations (Copper Coronet, etc. Should they loose any loot as well? I don't think it is necessary or easy to do anyway).
CHARNAME is teleported to a random area (this may take some work in case the party was in the underdark, Brinlaw, underwater city or some other restricted area). Time is adwanced by a week (month?, that would be too severe IMHO, plus a week should be plenty of time for him to "reassemble").
The dropped stuff is distributed at random to various merchants (the rationale is that stuff of such level is unlikely to be lying down for weeks) or is picked up by the enemy whom the party was facing at the last moment.

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Ok, how's that?

I must admit - this is still not very usefull for any regular game, but those doing no reloads should appreciate this addition.

Although I am not convinced this is really doable. Plus then there is a part of "picking it up from there":
The thing is, you got dropped to a random area, quite likely hostile environment and you have no weaponry or armor and no money... For just that purpose, should the CHARNAME keep like 100 gold? This would be enough to get some basic armor/weapons, but would be quite unnatural.. It would be nice to see if he can defeat anybody barehand [img]smile.gif[/img] . But that shouldn't be necessary actually. If he is worth anything he surely has some stuff stored some place away. Basically he only needs to make it into a stronghold...

Then the issue of health. Would it make sense to have only 1 hitpoint upon "resurrection"? Again, given no armor/weapons that would be too harsh IMHO. On the other hand he just needs to be evasive for some time, then he should have plenty of everything..

Anyway, thats it in general. Anybody has any opinion?

[mad=dog]

The problem with it being a Ranger is that the stronghold is very inappropiate. In "The Complete Fighters Handbook" there is a Samurai kit already.

My immidiate thoughts:
A Samurai must start as Ronin. The Stronghold quests should be custom made and involve getting a new master after Gorion (whom me must regard as the original master).

Otherwise it looks neat. I think a Samurai should have access to the Avoid Death HLA.

If the samurai can wear Splint or below both WDS and Armor of Faith (marked as Chain and Splint respectively in my game) are available.

[Link]

Starting off as a ronin does sound like a cool idea [img]smile.gif[/img]