French Protests Continue

[Nachtrafe]

Originally posted by Grojlach: That actually happened?? Yikes. Did they have any decent reason or excuse to wear those masks, were they supposed to be a symbol of anything? Because if that's not the case, I actually have to agree with you...

Yep. They were showing footage from NY and San Fran, and there were several 'activists' out there who were wearing either foll face masks/ski masks or scarves that covered their whole faces. They tended to be the ones throwing things and fighting with the police. There was one woman, wearing a ski cap, and a fleece scarf almost completely covering her face, and dark glasses, shouting about Bush being a warmonger...then later, she was one of the people it showed throwing a bottle at the police!

AFAIK they were wearing them simply to avoid being seen. There didn't appear to be any uniformity to them, just cowards covering up their faces and being brutal, violent, lawbreakers. Like I said Groj, I have a lot of respect for the people that stood on the Mall in Washington DC, or the ones who stood near the Towers...they had peaceful demonstrations and made their point. But the a$$holes who assaulted the police, or the McDonalds, or were doing nothing more than attention getting are worthy of nothing more than contempt IMO.

[Donut]

Originally posted by Larry_OHF: I am completely aware that the Al-Quaida group are separate from Iraq, for we are in Iraq to take out the Al-Quaida, and return Iraq to Iraqis...I never said they were the same...but when referring to them, one is accustomed to name their current location of residency. Still, I guess I should use their group's name in future discussion. I was unaware that Bin Laden and Saddam were not buddies. My reports say that they are friends, your's says they are not....I guess only those two men know for sure. I was unaware that France had trouble from Algeria. I seldom listen to the news, except in these last days, because I have a two year old that I love more than TV. I am sorry that my conclusions are bitter to your taste. Try me with a bit of ketchup!

Sorry Larry but you are way off here. Al Quada do not operate to any great extent in Iraq. Saddam does have close links to other Middle East terror organisations. The people we are going to get out are Saddam Hussein and his cronies.

Bin Laden has a fundamental hatred of Hussein. He classes him as a secular fascist and wants him out as mucjh as the US do.

Link

[ 03-21-2003, 10:54 AM: Message edited by: Donut ]

[Donut]

This is the report from the BBC on the first day of protests. You'll note that France hardly merits a mention.

Mass arrests at US peace demo

Police in San Francisco have arrested 1,025 people during violence at an anti-war demonstration.

Protesters blocked streets leading from the city's Oakland Bay Bridge, while small groups of people clashed with police and threw debris.

Tens of thousands of people joined demonstrations across the US.

There were huge protests across the world on Thursday, with violence in several countries including Belgium, Egypt, Spain, India and Switzerland.

"This is no ordinary day," said Jason Mark, a protester in San Francisco. "America is different today.

"We've just launched an unprovoked, unjust war."

Anti-war demonstrators in New York completely blocked New York's Broadway for two blocks below 42nd Street, while hundreds of protesters gathered in Washington and at university campuses around the country.

Hundreds of students at students at Harvard University walked out of classes at noon, and at least 1,500 people took part in a rally.

Some of the biggest outbursts of opposition to the war have been in Europe.

In Brussels, police used water cannon and tear gas to disperse hundreds of protesters who were throwing stones outside the US embassy.

Organisers said 3,000 people joined the protest, though police put the figure at 1,500.

Arab nations angry

Egyptian riot police used water canon and batons to beat back crowds throwing rocks and trying to advance on the US embassy in Cairo.

"We just wanted to tell the Americans they are no longer welcome here," said student leader Fadlallah Abu Wafia.

Protesters unfurled banners reading "Shame on USA" and "Vive la France, Arab governments go to hell".

Much of the anger was directed against Arab leaders for not opposing the US action.

In the Syrian capital, Damascus, demonstrators waved Iraqi flags and denounced US President George W Bush as a war criminal.

Crowds tried to advance on the US embassy before being forced back.

They also marched on the Egyptian embassy, and the embassy of Qatar - the host of the US Central Command for the duration of the war.

Police in the Jordanian capital Amman used force to break up an anti-war march by lawyers belonging to the Jordanian Bar Association.

At least four of the lawyers were injured, needing hospital treatment.

Turkish protesters marched through central Ankara, where the parliament has voted to allow US planes to use Turkish airspace for the war on Iraq.

Children on the march

At least 100,000 people marched through the Greek capital, Athens, many of them school pupils.

"We left class and asked our professors to join us," said Lefteris Faniotakis, a 15-year old student heading a group of 100 schoolmates.

Tens of thousands of school and university students in Italy staged spontaneous rallies in towns and cities all over the country.

Swiss police used tear gas against hundreds of protesters, also mainly students, who marched on the US diplomatic mission in Geneva.

Spanish police fired rubber bullets at protesters in Madrid. The demonstration, protesting against the government's support for the war, included well-known actors and celebrities.

Eggs were thrown at the British consulate in Venice and police used teargas to disperse demonstrators.

More students staged a sit-in outside Nato headquarters in Naples.

Germany, France and Britain also saw big demonstrations, many involving schoolchildren.

There have also been widespread protests in Asia.

There was violence in Calcutta, in eastern India, when about 1,000 protesters tried to storm a US cultural centre. At least 12 police officers and six protesters were injured, a senior police official told Reuters news agency.

In Indonesia, 2,000 people took part in a march in Jakarta in support of the government's call for an end to the war.

And many anti-war demonstrations have been held in Australia - which has committed warships, aircraft and 2,000 troops to the conflict.

[Rikard_OHF]

Originally posted by Donut: Quote: Originally posted by Larry_OHF: I am completely aware that the Al-Quaida group are separate from Iraq, for we are in Iraq to take out the Al-Quaida, and return Iraq to Iraqis...I never said they were the same...but when referring to them, one is accustomed to name their current location of residency. Still, I guess I should use their group's name in future discussion. I was unaware that Bin Laden and Saddam were not buddies. My reports say that they are friends, your's says they are not....I guess only those two men know for sure. I was unaware that France had trouble from Algeria. I seldom listen to the news, except in these last days, because I have a two year old that I love more than TV. I am sorry that my conclusions are bitter to your taste. Try me with a bit of ketchup!

Sorry Larry but you are way off here. Al Quada do not operate to any great extent in Iraq. Saddam does have close links to other Middle East terror organisations. The people we are going to get out are Saddam Hussein and his cronies.

Bin Laden has a fundamental hatred of Hussein. He classes him as a secular fascist and wants him out as mucjh as the US do.[/QUOTE]Even worse Osama called Saddam a "Bad Moslim" which in Osama's eyes is worse then a non-moslim

I know bush kept saying that Al-Quiada was operative in Iraq and that osama and saddam were helping one another but that's pure ignorance of bush' advisors
or just another lie for the proganda war

[ 03-21-2003, 10:48 AM: Message edited by: Rikard_OHF ]

[Rokenn]

I work in downtown San Francisco and was right in the thick of it yesterday. I had a chance to go out and observe several of the demonstrations yesterday and did not see ANY violence. Cloudy, the point of getting arrested is that they are performing civil disobedience. The whole point of the protest is to draw attention to their feelings on the issue. Remember that showing 10 mins of footage of peaceful protesters is not going to get the TV news program any ratings. But if they can find the 1% of the crowd that is itching for a fight they can get some footage that will get airplay. My favorite protest group I saw yesterday was actually right in front the building I work in. A group of about 20 people were doing 'Yoga for Peace' [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Timber Loftis]

Look, I am all for free speech and peaceful protest, but these Peace-Mongers paraded about Chicago during rush hour last night and shut down main arteries - such as Lake Shore Drive and Michigan Avenue (the Magnificent Mile) for HOURS. I'm sorry but that kept a lot of people from work, a lot of people from their families, and generally pissed us all off. [img]graemlins/1pissed.gif[/img]

Thousands marced. As of 10 pm last night, most had gone home, but a few hundred who lingered eventually were *not* allowed to leave. The police herded them in and started arresting them. For fairly-levelled charges - such as blocking traffic. Now, they could have begun such arrests hours earlier, but only did so when some people just refused to go home.

Now, I saw the footage, and while at least a few cops made more than necessary use of their night sticks, I certainly feel the protestors got what they deserved. They tied me up in traffic for over half an hour through a single city block. Look, I'm not one to whine, but their rights end at impenging my rights.

I saw one guy who had used electricity (black) tape to write "F#$% Bush" on his shirt. Since I was sitting still in traffic anyway, I decided to let my window down and proceed to berate him for his ignorance while complimenting him on the cerebral nature of his profoundly wise sentiment.

A final note: economics. The hundreds of extra police officers in riot gear the city must field to deal with this. The diversion of the city's buses to get protestors to and from areas. The thousands of high paid professionals who lost an hour or more out of their day whilst sitting stuck in their car on a 8-lane highway with peaceniks dancing in and among the cars. In short, these peace-mongers brought a lot of economic damage to Chicago last night. I think if you're going to take from the public in such a way, you should ante up the costs of your activities. Or be summarily executed, of course. (joke!)

Oh, and already early this morning they're blocking traffic around the Dirksen federal building - in the heart of the city. I had to re-route myself on my walk to work. Very frustrating.

[ 03-21-2003, 11:02 AM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

[Masklinn]

I have to agree, war-mongers do not make any mess in their own country. They just encourage bigger mess in another

On the Osama/Saddam topic : Saddam made a laic state and Osama is a muslim zealot. That cant fit.
I agree they both hold a grief toward US, for different reasons. They have only that in common.

[Rokenn]

Originally posted by Masklinn: I have to agree, war-mongers do not make any mess in their own country. They just encourage bigger mess in another

Other then the fact that Bush's war-mongering with Iraq has already cost the US economy about a $1,000,000,000,000.00 (a trillion) dollars according to a report released today.

[Timber Loftis]

Well, here's what I'm talking about:

From the NY Times: Thousands of protesters honored their pledge to "stop business as usual" the day after bombing began in Iraq, walking out of classes and work, shutting down major roads and converging on plazas, bridges, military bases and federal buildings. In Chicago, a huge crowd gathered in Federal Plaza.

Now, if their goal is to stop my "business as usual" is it okay if my goal is to punch them in the nose when/if they succeed???

[Timber Loftis]

Oh, and here are the protestors in traffic:

From NY Times: Demonstrators in Chicago walked through traffic after shutting down Lake Shore Drive during the evening rush hour.

This just goes beyond the right to voice their opinion. They have NO RIGHT to force me to listen.

Regarding the SUV sign: talk about mincing issues. I'm embarrassed to agree with that person on anything now. These wackos give good causes (e.g. environmentalism) a bad name.

[ 03-21-2003, 11:54 AM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]