How do you get more than 5 summoned creatures? (possible spoilers) - Page 3

Rataxes · 01-30-2004, 10:41 PM

No doubt that combining the two is far worse than either of them alone, but if you really feel the need to be able to summon more than 5 minions, that mod is a better choice than to use cheesy in-game exploits.

[ 01-31-2004, 06:20 AM: Message edited by: Rataxes ]

Dundee Slaytern · 01-30-2004, 10:47 PM

Well, the whole point of cheesing is to exploit ingame mechanisms that have not been classified as a bug yet.

When an exploit is fixed in a patch, it is no longer considered cheese but cheating to continue using it.

Mods are a whole different story.

Kevin Dorner is going to re-release a new updated version of the Baldurdash Fixpack, so we will see which cheese gets reclassified as cheating.

Dace De'Briago · 01-31-2004, 10:56 AM

The Cleric/Mage is the best class for any project image abuse - we can summon skeleton warriors with both mage and cleric spells.

So no longer 4*5 eh Dundee

Remember to include high Wisdom bonus spells as well

[ 01-31-2004, 10:58 AM: Message edited by: Dace De'Briago ]

Illumina Drathiran'ar · 01-31-2004, 12:23 PM

I'm trying to find a flaw in that line of thinking.
I could say cast Death Spell or Death Fog... but a sorc knows a limited number of spells... What if they know neither?
I think it really boils down to, are they allowed time to prep and buff beforehand? If so, the sorc's toast.
Unless they get off a Remove Magic and Spellstrike. Then the cleric/mage would start crying. All that hard work gone to waste.

SixOfSpades · 01-31-2004, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern:
People seem to be missing my point on why removing the summoning limit is a VERY bad idea.

I disagree. I see two reasons for wanting to break the summon limit:
1) "I want to have more than 5 Dire Wolves."
2) "I want to have 5 Planetars."

Without the MOD, everyone--even the people who just want a "meat wall" between their party and the Mind Flayers--has to use the PI/Simmy cheese to get what they want, thus implying that having multiples of the same divine Summon active at the same time is equally valid as a simple horde of Skeletons. But with the MOD, people who want to use their Wands of Fodder will be able to do so with ease, while those who want lots of Fallen Devas will be forced to feel guilty about what can only be called abuse.

Dace De'Briago · 01-31-2004, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern:
You have 5 slots of Animate Dead.

You have 4 slots of Project Image.

The minimum amount of Animate Dead you can have is therefore 4*5=20.

The actual equation is actually slightly more complex, but this should enlighten you on the matter.

Is the 'real' character allowed to cast Animate Dead as well? Or are the proj images/proj images summons counted against the limit?

Dundee Slaytern · 02-01-2004, 09:27 PM

SixOfSpades, that's assuming the cap remover does not remove the cap on Celestial gated creatures either.

Dace, the answer is yes.

SimDing0 · 02-02-2004, 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern:
Kevin Dorner is going to re-release a new updated version of the Baldurdash Fixpack, so we will see which cheese gets reclassified as cheating.

Baldurdash is not an official patch. More like a mod. So feel free to continue arguing that getting round the summonning cap like that isn't a bug. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Quote:

SixOfSpades, that's assuming the cap remover does not remove the cap on Celestial gated creatures either.

You're limited to one Deva/Planetar without the mod, right? I don't think I've changed this. Maybe I should.

Dundee Slaytern · 02-02-2004, 06:23 AM

Well, considering K.D. was an employee involved in the game, he is about as close to official as you can get.

With Black Isle more or less dead and buried, Baldurdash is the next closest thing.

Secondly, I was not suggesting that it was a good idea to remove the limit on Celestial gated summons.

Quite the opposite actually.

SimDing0 · 02-02-2004, 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern:
Well, considering K.D. was an employee involved in the game, he is about as close to official as you can get.

News to me. Sure you're not thinking of David Gaider?

Quote:

With Black Isle more or less dead and buried, Baldurdash is the next closest thing.

I agree. I might also question whether bugs that Kevin Dorner can't fix due to engine limitations are considered real bugs or "cheese"?

01-30-2004, 10:41 PM	#21
Rataxes Symbol of Cyric Join Date: November 17, 2002 Location: Sweden Age: 39 Posts: 1,359	No doubt that combining the two is far worse than either of them alone, but if you really feel the need to be able to summon more than 5 minions, that mod is a better choice than to use cheesy in-game exploits. [ 01-31-2004, 06:20 AM: Message edited by: Rataxes ] __________________ [img]\"http://atlas.walagata.com/w/rataxes/ymca3.jpg\" alt=\" - \" /><br />I want <b>YOU!</b>

01-31-2004, 10:56 AM	#23
Dace De'Briago Silver Dragon Join Date: December 28, 2002 Location: Wales Age: 45 Posts: 1,617	The Cleric/Mage is the best class for any project image abuse - we can summon skeleton warriors with both mage and cleric spells. So no longer 4*5 eh Dundee Remember to include high Wisdom bonus spells as well [ 01-31-2004, 10:58 AM: Message edited by: Dace De'Briago ] __________________ Warning: Powergamer

01-31-2004, 12:23 PM	#24
Illumina Drathiran'ar Apophis Join Date: July 10, 2002 Location: I can see the Manhattan skyline from my window. Age: 39 Posts: 4,673	I'm trying to find a flaw in that line of thinking. I could say cast Death Spell or Death Fog... but a sorc knows a limited number of spells... What if they know neither? I think it really boils down to, are they allowed time to prep and buff beforehand? If so, the sorc's toast. Unless they get off a Remove Magic and Spellstrike. Then the cleric/mage would start crying. All that hard work gone to waste. __________________ http://cavestory.org PLAY THIS GAME. Seriously. http://xkcd.com/386/ http://www.xkcd.com/406/ My heart is like my coffee. Black, bitter, icy, and with a straw.

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01-30-2004, 10:47 PM	#22
Dundee Slaytern Ironworks Moderator Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Pasir Ris, Singapore Age: 42 Posts: 11,063	Well, the whole point of cheesing is to exploit ingame mechanisms that have not been classified as a bug yet. When an exploit is fixed in a patch, it is no longer considered cheese but cheating to continue using it. Mods are a whole different story. Kevin Dorner is going to re-release a new updated version of the Baldurdash Fixpack, so we will see which cheese gets reclassified as cheating.

02-01-2004, 09:27 PM	#27
Dundee Slaytern Ironworks Moderator Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Pasir Ris, Singapore Age: 42 Posts: 11,063	SixOfSpades, that's assuming the cap remover does not remove the cap on Celestial gated creatures either. Dace, the answer is yes.

02-02-2004, 06:23 AM	#29
Dundee Slaytern Ironworks Moderator Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Pasir Ris, Singapore Age: 42 Posts: 11,063	Well, considering K.D. was an employee involved in the game, he is about as close to official as you can get. With Black Isle more or less dead and buried, Baldurdash is the next closest thing. Secondly, I was not suggesting that it was a good idea to remove the limit on Celestial gated summons. Quite the opposite actually.

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