Archer?

[Cerek]

Originally posted by ister: Well I don't really see why the choice of making the archer an elf (per Kruchy Frog's post above) is any better than making the archer a halfling. The halfling gets the same DEX, and significantly better saves versus poison and magic. The long bow bonus is only +1, and doesn't help much because you get the Tuigan bow very quickly, and that is much preferable to any long bow even with an extra +1. Not to mention Gessen is IMHO the best bow. The halfling has better CON than the elf but worse STR. But you're an archer for goodness sake - the CON is more useful. So, I disagree with krunchy frog that the best racial choice for the generic archer, power wise, is the elf.

krunchyfrogg was talking about the Ranger kit, not the Generic kit. Since Rangers can only dual to Cleric and the OP wanted to dual to a thief (or perhaps mage), dualing the Archer seemed to be a moot point. Also, the Ranger/Archer kit doesn't get the bonuses with slings (IIRC). Since he can't dual, it makes sense to make the archer a demihuman for the racial bonuses. Since the R/A kit only gets bonuses with the bow, it makes sense to choose an elf over dwarf, gnome or halfling...because the elf is the only race that gets an extra bonus with long bows.

Tuigen bow IS one of the best weapons in the game (despite only being +1), but there are plenty of good long bows available also. With a Girdle of Giant Strength, the elf could take the Strong Arm bow and gain even more THAC0 bonuses.

As for the Generic archer kit, I agree that a halfling slinger would be an awesome choice (as would a dwarven crossbowman). In the generic kit, all races are fairly equal. The halfling and dwarf don't get the extra +1 bonus the elf gets, but (as you pointed out) they DO get a much better bonus vs poison and magic.

As for halflings having better CON, that all depends on the stats you roll. They have a higher maximum, but there is no gaurantee you'll get a CON that high. And the elf's higher DEX - in addition to the +1 bonus - gives plenty of reason to consider them as the ultimate archer (with bows) in the game.

BTW.......

WELCOME TO IRONWORKS, ISTER !!!


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[Jerr Conner]

I thought both halflings and elves got 19 dex?

[Cerek]

Originally posted by Jerr Conner: I thought both halflings and elves got 19 dex?

By golly, I believe you're right, Jerr. Now that you mention it, I think halflings DO get a +1 bonus to DEX and they take a -1 penalty to STR whereas the elf takes the -1 penalty to CON.

[Jerr Conner]

Cause I always up my halflings' dex to 19

[SixOfSpades]

Halflings also have a WIS penalty. They're capped at 17. But they have a bonus with Slings to match the Elves' Bow and Longsword.

[Jerr Conner]

Yea, I tried making a Halfling Cleric once. Could only get 17 Wis

[Dundee Slaytern]

WIS is kinda of a moot point for an Archer.

[Jerr Conner]

Lol true! Though doesn't WIS help a Ranger Archer at least?

[Nerull]

Originally posted by Jerr Conner: Lol true! Though doesn't WIS help a Ranger Archer at least?

Not in the slightest. It has no effect on ranger spellcasting like it does a cleric, and archers do not get spells anyway. Might as well just leave it at the minimum required to be a ranger (or if doing the generic archer, at around 10).

[Cerek]

Originally posted by Nerull: quote: Originally posted by Jerr Conner: Lol true! Though doesn't WIS help a Ranger Archer at least?

Not in the slightest. It has no effect on ranger spellcasting like it does a cleric, and archers do not get spells anyway. Might as well just leave it at the minimum required to be a ranger (or if doing the generic archer, at around 10). [/QUOTE]Wisdom also helps improve your Saving Throws vs spells like Charm and Domination (IIRC), so it is still to your advantage to keep it fairly high. I always try to get WIS and INT both around 12-14 for non-spellcasters if possible. Naturally, I want them higher if I'm playing a spellcaster, but it doesn't hurt to have a good Wisdom score for any character (except maybe a barbarian or beserker - since their Rage will make them immune to mind-affecting spells anyway).