The word "Oriental" is being banned from the English language ?

[Yorick]

Originally posted by /)eathKiller: quote: Originally posted by Larry_OHF: does anyone on here that may be of Asian decent feel bad when a person says that you are from the Orient? Do you feel bad when referred to as Asian? Can you please teach all of us the correct way to refer to your land and heritage?

Ok First of all, let me put it this way:

When you say Oriental to an Asian it's like calling a Russian a Soviet. The Orient is an old time word that the british made up to refer to an area they, themselves had not fully discovered or could possibly understand yet. Its not Oriental that annoys most asians though... it's when you designate an individual from any asian nation as being from another.

At least 75% of Americans don't know the differince between China and Japan... that really ticks Japanese people off. I doubt the Chineese mind but that's because they're impartial to being confused wtih anything, they've been called everything from Manturian to people of Shangai. anyway... The word Orient i think mainly is centered around the mainland part of Asia and i'm not perflectly certain on its oragins but it sounds like a word the British would make up. I mean if you ever had an american call a guy from Scotland a Brit, don't you think he'd be a little ticked off? Well that was just a bizare analogy. Anyway, when was the last time you heard of people from England being refered to in English as being European? See! Asians want that kind of respect when they are refered to, not as some Oriental folk, or sometimes even as Asian people, Japanese like to be refered to as Japanese its simple as that. Koreans like to be called Koreans, im sure they even prefer the North or South be designated in their racial background, Vietnamese, Tai, all of them want to be refered to as the nation they originate from, not just some odd generalization. Even People from Mexico don't get called Americans though they are from South America! Are you getting my point here?[/QUOTE]I think you're being a bit sensative there. It's not like Japanese are being called Chinese, or Thais being called Burmese. It's totally different to your Russian/Soviet analogy as well. The Soviet Union as a state no longer exists. We still use the word when referring to that era.

Do Caucasian Australians get all hung up about being called Europeans or Caucasians? Do French and Germans get angry about being called Europeans? Do Nigerians, Tanzanians and Zulus get hung up about being called Africans? No. They're just broader definitions when one cannot or does not want to ascertain or refer to a narrower definition.

Oriental, East Asian, Asian. What's the big deal. If I'm referring to all the people in East Asia, I'll call them one word (Oriental, Asian etc), rather than use all the little designations, just as if I'm talking about all the people on the earth, I'll use one word (human) instead of all the little designations (Mestitzo, Kouri, Ainu, Han, Tutsi etc)

A lot of whooha over nothing.

[Yorick]

Oh yes, and did you not read? The English did not invent the word. To the Roman Empire, 'the Orient', was Asia Minor (now Turkey) and what we call the Middle East.

[Larry_OHF]

Originally posted by slackerboy: could it be that you slightly misunderstood the conversation and rather thnn saying that the word was to be removed from the language, they were actually discussing the trend our language is taking in that most references where the word orient, or oriental would be used, the word asian is typicaly used instead now? I had noticed this a while ago. the term oriental has pretty much fallen by the wayside. I dont really see signs for oriental resturaunts anymore. they are always either "asian" resturaunts or they specify : chinese, japanese, thai, etc... its possible that was the actual topic of the discussion rather than an intentional attempt by some group to actually remove the word.

You could be right, but I am sure that they mentioned that it was to be enforced by law; to remove the word from society, because the effects of it in speaking to an Asian was relative to that of the "N" word. I certainly would not want to use that word anymore if that was the case, so I will continue to research this and return and report my findings.

[Silver Cheetah]

Originally posted by Yorick: Oh yes, and did you not read? The English did not invent the word. To the Roman Empire, 'the Orient', was Asia Minor (now Turkey) and what we call the Middle East.

What, the Romans actually called it 'the Orient'? How very strange and interesting!

What was the actual Latin word they used?

[John D Harris]

From what I understand it is the State of Washington that is trying to pass a law to remove the word "oriental: from all offical state laws, paperwork etc. It allso goes along with the traveling theatrical (sp?)company that removed the word "Hunchback" from it's play the "Hunchback of Notre Dome" (how ever it is spelled ) , because it might offend. Also the NCAA is removing the word "unsportsman" from Unsportman like conduct, because it might offend.
So watch out for Unsportman Hunchbacked Oriental

[K T Ong]

I don't find the word 'Oriental' so much an offensive word as a pompous, over-flowery word. I mean, if a Westerner (Caucasian? Occidental? [img]smile.gif[/img] ) called me an Oriental, I wouldn't be offended at all -- though I would feel somewhat funny ('Why not use a simpler word like 'Asian', friend?').

Truth be told, I love the word 'Oriental' when used in fantasy novels. So much so, I sincerely hope they won't even ban it from being used in such contexts. What could possibly be a more romantic and mystical setting for a fantasy story than the Orient?

As for Edward Said's thesis on Orientalism, the fact is that not all the myths and ideas regarding Orientals that were brewed up by Westerners in the 18th and 19th centuries were down-putting ones; there were also quite a few very flattering ones . But I agree that neither of them would help a Westerner (Caucasian? Occidental?) understand us Asians (or 'Orientals' if you prefer) more -- as simply human beings, albeit with slightly different tastes and ways of thinking. We're neither mysterious and inscrutable mystics living in gilded pavillions (the flattering myths) nor weak-minded, irrational dolts (the down-putting myths).

I suppose it's just human nature to fantasize about things you're not familiar with -- such as other races. I myself like to fantasize and romanticize about you CAUCS (the guys anyway) as a bunch of big, handsome, hairy, brawny, bearded, blonde-haired, blue-eyed brutes who smell like sheep. (Just jesting, you don't mind...) I guess it's okay for us to indulge in fantasies about each other so long as we remain on our guard against confusing fantasy with reality.

BTW, I got mistaken for a Japanese about four times when I was in Australia. I wasn't offended at all.

[ 07-03-2002, 10:07 PM: Message edited by: K T Ong ]

[caleb]

I lived around a lot of Japanese, Laotian, Philipino, and Chinese people back in Hawaii and they didnt seem to give a crap if they were called oriental.....maybe the older generation takes offense [img]graemlins/question.gif[/img]

[Hayashi]

Personally, 'oriental' and 'asian' have pretty much the same - someone whose race has his roots in the Asian continent.
I think this is another case of political correctness gone overboard - I mean, if I refer to my British friends as "European" or "westerners", I don;t think they would be offended in the least bit.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Larry_OHF: You could be right, but I am sure that they mentioned that it was to be enforced by law; to remove the word from society, because the effects of it in speaking to an Asian was relative to that of the "N" word. I certainly would not want to use that word anymore if that was the case, so I will continue to research this and return and report my findings.

But that word has it's origins in derision rather than geography.

[Rimjaw]

Like my compatriots just said, I too wouldn't get angry if anybody called me 'Oriental' Although I don't think anybody's called me 'Oriental' to my face before. Its an archaic, poetic, hyperbole-ish word that doesn't have much use in modern conversation (probably more use in literature) when you can simply call the person an 'Asian'.