06-21-2002, 02:23 PM | #21 | |
John Locke
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06-21-2002, 03:58 PM | #22 |
Fzoul Chembryl
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I guess one problem is that we have absolutely no idea how life starts or how common the occurance is. Our isolation makes it's study quite difficult. We only know of one instance so far and the way it started is still debated quite often even here.
I do think it's at least a rare occurance and probably started with divine intervention. Who can say for sure though? Statements like that are faith based.
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06-21-2002, 05:11 PM | #23 | |
John Locke
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06-21-2002, 05:20 PM | #24 | |
Harper
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The second is the sulphur ecosphere on earth. This is the lifeforms on the bottom of the oceans - with no oxygen, virtualy no light and far too much heat, nothing in our everyday experience could survive there. Even the toughest bacteria coudnt thrive there due to the presence of toxic suplhur - and yet there is an ecosystem of a sort. Its limited to life-forms we would consider primitve, but this may be because of a lack of environment for them to evolve in. This life is powered by sea-floor volcanoes which are inherently unstable. Yet these life-forms have been around longer than the oxygen ones. ON a more volcanicaly active world (like Io say) they may have become the dominant type of life-form. Mars probably at one time have harbourd an oxygen ecosystem like ours, and possibly still harbours remnants of it. Europa may have a sulphur ecosystem, since it has a volcnicaly active core surronded by a liquid water ocean. Thats one system - two active ecosystems on one planet, two possibles on more hostile worlds. Plus whatever we havent even begun to think about - energy beings in the sun? Gaseous entities on jupiter? Who knows. Life is common in this system, and it will be throughout the universe.
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06-21-2002, 05:43 PM | #25 |
John Locke
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Then again, we are stuck to the confines of our definition of a 'habitable environment'. For all we know, an alien could find our planet, which is right for us, completely inhospitable. For all we know, there might be a life form that can survive in a vacuum or very little atmosphere. There could be a life form that can only breath volcanic gases. We have been stuck to the things we are used to on this planet, fish, humans etc.
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06-21-2002, 06:12 PM | #26 | |
Fzoul Chembryl
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The second is the sulphur ecosphere on earth. This is the lifeforms on the bottom of the oceans - with no oxygen, virtualy no light and far too much heat, nothing in our everyday experience could survive there. Even the toughest bacteria coudnt thrive there due to the presence of toxic suplhur - and yet there is an ecosystem of a sort. Its limited to life-forms we would consider primitve, but this may be because of a lack of environment for them to evolve in. This life is powered by sea-floor volcanoes which are inherently unstable. Yet these life-forms have been around longer than the oxygen ones. ON a more volcanicaly active world (like Io say) they may have become the dominant type of life-form. Mars probably at one time have harbourd an oxygen ecosystem like ours, and possibly still harbours remnants of it. Europa may have a sulphur ecosystem, since it has a volcnicaly active core surronded by a liquid water ocean. Thats one system - two active ecosystems on one planet, two possibles on more hostile worlds. Plus whatever we havent even begun to think about - energy beings in the sun? Gaseous entities on jupiter? Who knows. Life is common in this system, and it will be throughout the universe.[/QUOTE]The main question is "What started it all?". Which original life form opened pandoras box? It would have to derive it's energy from photo or thermal sources. Even that primitive of a life form is too complex to simply spring into existence on its own. There's missing links between single celled organisms and the primordial ooze that no one seems to know about. I think the discovery of Prions may lead to some interesting discoveries in that area. Non-cellular, non-viral structures that seem to replicate like life forms, but do so without DNA. The only ones known right now are the parasitic ones that cause brain diseases like Mad-cow and a few other rare human conditions. Whether these are actually life forms or simply chain reactive chemicals released by defective cell processes or other phenomena still remains debated.
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06-21-2002, 06:18 PM | #27 | |
Ma'at - Goddess of Truth & Justice
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Imagine 600 years from now, people are sitting around discussing how we managed to get around with such a short life span, and such crude technology, and the people back then may have thought their technology as advanced as it will get. We may still have an abundance of potential, and be hugely far away from reaching it, but I suppose only time will tell.
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06-21-2002, 06:37 PM | #28 | |
Fzoul Chembryl
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Imagine 600 years from now, people are sitting around discussing how we managed to get around with such a short life span, and such crude technology, and the people back then may have thought their technology as advanced as it will get. We may still have an abundance of potential, and be hugely far away from reaching it, but I suppose only time will tell. [/QUOTE]I think we'll reach our maximum age pretty soon. Most of the problems were health related issues and not age related back then. Heart disease, obesity, and cancer are the only major health issues left in countries like the US. The real deciding factor of age is "maximum productive age" as far as discovering advances go. That hasn't increased much as of late. Most people still retire by age sixty. Most people start to get dulled senses and lose thier mental edge by age seventy. So the extra few years we glean with current medical advances really don't add much to productivity. Another problem humans have is we also don't breed effectively anymore, evolutionarily speaking that is. Physically and mentally superior people tend to have LESS children on average. This is presumably because they have less time due to thier pursuits and they also tend to want to raise fewer children so they can maximize thier success (child and parents). I'll be curious to see what comes of these issues.
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Master Barbsman and wielder of the razor wit!<br /><br />There are dark angels among us. They present themselves in shining raiment but there is, in their hearts, the blackness of the abyss. |
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06-21-2002, 06:55 PM | #29 |
Drow Priestess
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I think most reasonable folks would agree that, given the size of the universe, there are probably non-Terran civilizations out there somewhere. As stated, though, the chance of communicating with them is next to 0, figuring that most communication is limited to the speed of light. Even the best interferometers being planned will be able to detect planets no further than, say, 1000 light-years away.
On the other hand, it is known that spin-paired particles seem to communicate at faster-than-light speeds when separated. It is possible that if you were to create two atoms absolutely identical to each other in every quantum detail that changes to one would be reflected in the other regardless of distance; this would allow for FTL communication. re: humans being the oldest/most technologically advanced civilization. Arledrian, when it comes to thinking about the universe then all possibilities must be considered, including that one. [img]graemlins/petard.gif[/img] I agree with Ziroc--I'd love to be able to live long enough to see even the next 200 years.
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06-22-2002, 06:19 AM | #30 | |
Harper
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Even if you could control the result youd have to carry one partical per bit of information. FTL communication through a micro-wormhole is a more practical proposition. In both techniques though both ends of the link would have to be formed in contact and then moved - theres no way for humans to build one end and aliens another, you cant target a wormhole.
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