The Schiavo Battle II

[Cloudbringer]

There IS a moratorium on religious discussions in place and as of now, this thread is teetering on being closed and warnings being handed out.

Melchior, your post count shows you to be relatively new here so please read this :
http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cg...;f=27;t=000569

And for the regulars and old-timers- help avoid the topic if you can by not continuing the discussion where it goes into the moratorium areas. Thanks!

[Aragorn1]

I did aplogises for responding to the orginal point, i should have reminded Melchior about the ban.

On a legal point, having grounds for a divorce does not mean there is a divorce and so Michael stil had his powers as spouse over his wife's affairs.

[Timber Loftis]

Originally posted by Cloudbringer: There IS a moratorium on religious discussions in place and as of now, this thread is teetering on being closed and warnings being handed out. Melchior, your post count shows you to be relatively new here so please read this : http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/cg...;f=27;t=000569 And for the regulars and old-timers- help avoid the topic if you can by not continuing the discussion where it goes into the moratorium areas. Thanks!

Sorry if I teetered on the edge of preaching, Cloudy. *hands over soapbox*

I guess, to remain within the rules, I should have simply said:
- I was Baptist, but left that church
- Now I am aetheist

Period. Right?

Anywho, sorry for spouting off my beliefs too much.

[Cloudbringer]

No worries, guys. The subject was related to the discussion but you have to keep the ban on in depth religous debate in mind.

I'd love to see us open it up, but as we've seen in the past, some people get too hot under the collar and it gets messed up for everyone, so as long as the moratorium's in place and I'm a mod, I have to abide by the rules and remind you not to get too far into the religious items, that's all. [img]smile.gif[/img] No harm done.

[ 04-29-2005, 02:05 PM: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ]

[Cerek]

Originally posted by Aragorn1: I did aplogises for responding to the orginal point, i should have reminded Melchior about the ban. On a legal point, having grounds for a divorce does not mean there is a divorce and so Michael stil had his powers as spouse over his wife's affairs.

I was the one that first brought religion into this latest round of discussion, so I apologize for that. But the Schindler's religious beliefs were central to their argument to keep Terri alive, so the issue IS relevant to the discussion. We just must be tread very lightly when discussing that aspect.

Aragorn - You're right that there was no divorce between Michael and Terri. Nobody is claiming there was. The Schindler's claimed that removing the feeding tube would violate Terri's religious beliefs. I pointed out that asking Michael to divorce Terri is also a violation of the Catholic doctrine (under most circumstances). However, Melchior is correct (to the best of my knowledge) that adultery IS a justifiable cause for divorce in the Catholic church...and Michael was committing adultery with his live-in girlfriend.

That should sum up the "religious aspect" of the discussion for now. There are still plenty of legal and emotional issues to discuss, so perhaps we can shift the focus to those areas.

[Timber Loftis]

Sure, Cerek, adultery is a justifiable cause for divorce. Terri, would you like a divorce dear?

Terri: *drool* *drip* *drool* *stares blankly*

Well, that settles that. No divorce.



[ 04-29-2005, 02:22 PM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

[Melchior]

Originally posted by Cerek: quote: Originally posted by Melchior: quote: Originally posted by shamrock_uk: He's not talking about one in particular

The Pastor he mentioned was of a particular faith I take it? That's the question I asked of Timber Loftis, not you. [/QUOTE]The more of your comments I read, Melchior, the more curious I become about something. It is very unusual for new members to come to the Current Events forum so soon after joining IW. Most new members come to IW looking for help with games like Baldur's Gate or Neverwinter Nights and stay in those forums for a while before "venturing out" to other forums. It is also somewhat unusual for newbies to enter such a "hot" thread as this so soon after joining. They don't know the other members yet, so they don't want to risk accidentally offending someone. And - along that same line - it is even more uncommon for those that do come here to make such pointed statements as the one above to members. There is nothing wrong with what you posted, it's just odd for a new member to tell a veteren that they weren't talking to them - and you've been very blunt in your other comments as well. Again, there is nothing wrong with that...it's just extremely unusual for a newbie to do these things. It isn't unheard of, I suppose, but it doesn't happen very often. Most members wait until they've been here long enough to get a "feel" for some of the members before jumping into such a hot topic.

So I am curious as to what drew your attention to Ironworks originally and - after joining - what drew your attention to the Current Events forum in particular? [img]graemlins/1ponder.gif[/img] [/QUOTE]A google search led me to find Baldur's gate hints and spoilers on ironworks. I'm no stranger to internet forums. I've been talking on them for years. One of my favs was an old Moslem one that sadly passed away. Good guys I can't seem to find again

[Azred]

Originally posted by Melchior: quote: Originally posted by Azred: quote: Originally posted by Melchior: I never said adultery is a crime, but that adultery gave Michael a conflict of interest and gave Terri grounds for divorce under Roman Catholic Church doctrine.

So? Roman Catholic doctrine is not the law of the State of Florida; thus, church doctrine is irrelevant. [/QUOTE]As Cerek was discussing the Schindlers Roman Catholic beliefs and a possible level of hypocrisy, it is relevent to discus the said beliefs. You're attacking a straw man by trying to meld what I was saying into a comment on Florida's law. [/QUOTE]Actually, I am attacking your position. The disagreement between the Schindlers and Michael was never about religion; the Schindlers kept playing the religion card in order to drum up sympathy for their cause. In short, they were using religion just like they used their daughter just to get their way. How pathetic can they be?
With every legal battle they lost they whined louder. I am really glad that it is all over so I don't have to listen to their pathetic mewling anymore.

[Ruadh nan Cath]

Originally posted by Azred: quote: Originally posted by Melchior: quote: Originally posted by Azred: quote: Originally posted by Melchior: I never said adultery is a crime, but that adultery gave Michael a conflict of interest and gave Terri grounds for divorce under Roman Catholic Church doctrine.

So? Roman Catholic doctrine is not the law of the State of Florida; thus, church doctrine is irrelevant. [/QUOTE]As Cerek was discussing the Schindlers Roman Catholic beliefs and a possible level of hypocrisy, it is relevent to discus the said beliefs. You're attacking a straw man by trying to meld what I was saying into a comment on Florida's law. [/QUOTE]Actually, I am attacking your position. The disagreement between the Schindlers and Michael was never about religion; the Schindlers kept playing the religion card in order to drum up sympathy for their cause. In short, they were using religion just like they used their daughter just to get their way. How pathetic can they be?
With every legal battle they lost they whined louder. I am really glad that it is all over so I don't have to listen to their pathetic mewling anymore. [/QUOTE]Duuude man, read the arguments. Shit. Religion came up in the convo, so it gets discussed. Chill yo.

[Illumina Drathiran'ar]

Duuude man, read the TOS before spreading your idiocy about indiscriminately.