Are Bush And Blair Liars?

[Chewbacca]

Originally posted by Azred: In this case, though, don't blame the Bush Administration for continuing deaths; rather, blame the damnable insurgents because they are the ones doing the killing. They are also the ones continuing to cause their country to be occupied by foriegn troops. Were they to stop, the troops would go away faster.

Why not blame those who started the conflict and who failed to anticipate the insurgency? We've had the discussion before- There would be no insurgents if we had not invaded in the first place. One thing led to the other. Simple cause and effect.

So indeed Bush and Blair, and anyone who supported invasion, is responsible directly and indirectly by virtue of root cause, for every death and injury resulting from the invasion up until now and beyond. They will bear responsiblity into the future of the conflict, even when western troops are no longer deployed in Iraq until this bloody period is a faint memeory and the grievous wounds of war on the mass psyche are healed.


I also doubt a lack of insurgency would make the troop leave any faster, though we would have far less deployed.

[Chewbacca]

Speaking of the war and it's realities, has anybody heard of the Album "Live From Iraq" It can be found here:

WARNING- Real Graphic Images of war and adult language

[Timber Loftis]

A funny thing has occurred since the invasion of Iraq. I've seen several snuff films. Prior to the past few years, such things were very taboo and exceedingly difficult to acquire.

[Azred]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: Why not blame those who started the conflict and who failed to anticipate the insurgency? We've had the discussion before- There would be no insurgents if we had not invaded in the first place. One thing led to the other. Simple cause and effect. So indeed Bush and Blair, and anyone who supported invasion, is responsible directly and indirectly by virtue of root cause, for every death and injury resulting from the invasion up until now and beyond. They will bear responsiblity into the future of the conflict, even when western troops are no longer deployed in Iraq until this bloody period is a faint memeory and the grievous wounds of war on the mass psyche are healed. I also doubt a lack of insurgency would make the troop leave any faster, though we would have far less deployed.

Yes, this discussion has been undertaken before. Some people simply want to blame Bush and Blair for anything and everything, including their grandmother's lumbago.

Tell you what--I will personally accept the blame for every death in Iraq during the last 2 years. You know what? I will sleep very peacefully at night because I know I am right for supporting the removal of Hussein.
There are other strategic decisions I would make that they didn't make to ascertain greater stability in the region, so count your blessings that Bush and Blair were the driving forces behind the campaign. [img]graemlins/petard.gif[/img]

[Chewbacca]

Originally posted by Azred: quote: Originally posted by Chewbacca: Why not blame those who started the conflict and who failed to anticipate the insurgency? We've had the discussion before- There would be no insurgents if we had not invaded in the first place. One thing led to the other. Simple cause and effect. So indeed Bush and Blair, and anyone who supported invasion, is responsible directly and indirectly by virtue of root cause, for every death and injury resulting from the invasion up until now and beyond. They will bear responsiblity into the future of the conflict, even when western troops are no longer deployed in Iraq until this bloody period is a faint memeory and the grievous wounds of war on the mass psyche are healed. I also doubt a lack of insurgency would make the troop leave any faster, though we would have far less deployed.

Yes, this discussion has been undertaken before. Some people simply want to blame Bush and Blair for anything and everything, including their grandmother's lumbago. [/QUOTE]That's not what is happening here. The call for accountability upon Bush and Blair here is rooted in logical assumptions, rather than politically motivated emotional appeals.

Tell you what--I will personally accept the blame for every death in Iraq during the last 2 years. You know what? I will sleep very peacefully at night because I know I am right for supporting the removal of Hussein. There are other strategic decisions I would make that they didn't make to ascertain greater stability in the region, so count your blessings that Bush and Blair were the driving forces behind the campaign. [img]graemlins/petard.gif[/img]

Funny. I know I am also right for NOT supporting the invasion and subsequent removal of Hussien. Funny how that works. [img]smile.gif[/img] BTW- I sleep GREAT!

[Azred]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: Funny. I know I am also right for NOT supporting the invasion and subsequent removal of Hussien. Funny how that works. [img]smile.gif[/img] BTW- I sleep GREAT!

Well, no one ever said this was a zero-sum game. We can both be right. [img]graemlins/petard.gif[/img]

On the other hand, if we keep talking about sleeping, people might start to talk. [img]graemlins/erm.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/beigesmilewinkgrin.gif[/img]

[Zebodog]

George Bush is very similiar to Adolf Hitler...very charasmatic but both very stupid.

Tony Blair is akin to Benito Mussolini, "Oh it looks like Germany is going to win, so I'll side with them...no wait a minute..."

Either we learn from history or we are doomed to repeat it. Unfortunately, it seems that we have learned nothing.

[Illumina Drathiran'ar]

Originally posted by Zebodog: George Bush is very similiar to Adolf Hitler...very charasmatic but both very stupid. Tony Blair is akin to Benito Mussolini, "Oh it looks like Germany is going to win, so I'll side with them...no wait a minute..." Either we learn from history or we are doomed to repeat it. Unfortunately, it seems that we have learned nothing.

Hitler wasn't stupid. He manipulated his people like nobody's business. Twisted, yes. Stupid, no... but then again, he *did* try and invade Russia in the winter.

[Grojlach]

Originally posted by Zebodog: George Bush is very similiar to Adolf Hitler...very charasmatic but both very stupid. Tony Blair is akin to Benito Mussolini, "Oh it looks like Germany is going to win, so I'll side with them...no wait a minute..." Either we learn from history or we are doomed to repeat it. Unfortunately, it seems that we have learned nothing.

I reckon Godwin's Law is completely lost on you?

[Aragorn1]

You've got learn the right lessons though.
Example: the USA in Vietnam (sorry, just the most obvious one to me). THe chose to look at the British in Malaya to illustarte that communist insurgents in S.E. Asia could be beaten, rather than the more directly aplicable actions of the French in Indochina.

And to my knowledge Tony BLair has never thought about siding with either Sadam Hussein or Islamic Fundamentalists, so not like Italy at all then. ALso, Mussolini would only ever of come out in support of the Axis forces, never the allies. He just waited until he thought it was sure the Axis would win. If it had not been so he would simply have remained neutral.

(And don't bother arguing back, as stated above, by Godwin's Law*, you've already lost the arguement!!! )

*OK, I know this was not what it originally said, but that's how its being applied.

[ 06-25-2005, 08:53 AM: Message edited by: Aragorn1 ]