A Perspective From Over There

[pritchke]

Originally posted by promethius9594: one could assume she is the project head out of the three. this is likewise impossible in iraq, as women there are NEVER placed in authority over men.

That is funny because if I recall even seeing a female member of Saddams cabinet at the beginning of the war when he was meeting. I am sure the position was not that important but it was still a position probably more important than the information minister. Hell I am not even sure Bush has a female advisor. Must be because females are oppressed in the US and can't have a top position. Never is a pretty strong word and there are always exceptions to the rule. Maybe this Riverbend knows someone, like in North America I see alot of morons get positions over people who are more qualified as a result of patronage.

As for people being "had" I am quite sure a few Americans feel that way about Bush going to war over WoMD. Still a few who still don't believe he pulled the wool over there eyes. Sorry dude I see no reason not to believe this person isn't who she says she then again she could be a fraud but your generalizations can't be taken as proof as they are all circumstantial. How do we know you are who you say you are? Hmmm I think you are an imposter thinking "the calm before the storm" is an American saying. I think the Newfies use that quote quite a bit too.

[ 04-21-2004, 02:38 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

[Chewbacca]

Originally posted by promethius9594: OH COME ON!!! are you too prideful to realize youve been had?!?!?!

No, you have made a less than compelling case that this is a fake and instead of giving something substantial yourself you make demand for us to do the same.
I think you are discrediting this blog becasue it is critical of the occupation and rather than address the issue provoked by the writing it is more convient to dodge the issue by claiming fraud.

HOWEVER, she notes she is from a software company in bagdad. I figured, "heck, company has got to be online." being a computer scientist, i know a bit about programming. a google search for "software + engineering + bagdad" produced a bunch of firms offering jobs to go to bagdad (read: american companies) and ONE company with a location in bagdad. so, i looked at the webpage. conveniently enough "riverbend is anonymous, so i couldnt look up any employee records or software products produced by her. that would be what is called imperical evidence: it is verifiable through FACT which can be observed, not just by claim. So i think to myself, well, she specialized in databases, so this company i have found must have some location on its site for databases. I went back and i searched "software + engineering + database + bagdad." this turned up a whole result of... nothing but foreign companies offering people jobs to go to bagdad for nation building. READ: the division she claims to work for in her company does not exist in bagdad.

Has it occured to you that this company may not exist anymore? Nothing compelling here. It actuallyl wouldn't suprise me that even a tech company in a nation that has been invaded and occupied for the last year would not make an effort to create a web-presence. (especially after all the equipment was looted).

Now, if that weren't enough, i know a little bit about the iraqi culture... being in the military and all we learn a bit about the cultures we have to fight. She claims to make more money than two male counterparts. that would NEVER be true in iraq. in saudi arabia that wouldnt even be true, and iraq is not even that progressive. If women are EVER highered in Iraq it is for much less money than their male counterparts make. assuming she makes more than her male counterparts, one could assume she is the project head out of the three. this is likewise impossible in iraq, as women there are NEVER placed in authority over men.

Actually in Iraq under the former secular regime, woman and men were veiwed as equals. It is the fundimentalist Islamist's that would enforce inequality between the sexes. What ever the military told you about woman's rights in Iraq under the previous regime was either a lie or not the entire truth.

This character, riverbend, does a good job dodging the obvious accusations that she is a phony, but she just doesnt know enough about the culture nor provide enough prove to be imperically verifiable as any sort of real opinion from iraq.

Evidently you have not read the blog very much. Riverbend has provided ample information about herself, Iraqi culture and her opinion of the the war and occupation.

I think you don't like her opinions and rather than counter them directly, you resort to claiming that she is a fraud.

[pritchke]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: I think you are discrediting this blog becasue it is critical of the occupation and rather than address the issue provoked by the writing it is more convient to dodge the issue by claiming fraud.

That is what I was thinking!!!

[ 04-21-2004, 02:43 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

[promethius9594]

okay, having visited the blog now, i can see one thing... you're still wrong.

look up a google search on the word falloojeh, which appears in her blog several times. you'll find that the only results are clips or various forms of her blog.

now look up the word Fallujah. You will find all sorts of CNN articles, stories, independant writer pieces. why do i make the distinction? because anyone from iraq should be able to spell the name of a large city. please, i wouldnt spell the capital of california "sackramentoe." or i wouldnt call the big apple "nue yorck."

I think the reason you cling to this is that you so want it to be true. You know what, i can live with that.

I'm not saying its bad to be against the war, I'm saying you shouldnt pretend to be somethign you're not, just to make a point. if you believe in something, tell the truth, stand up for it, don't hide behind some fictitious blog.

[Melusine]

Originally posted by promethius9594: okay, having visited the blog now, i can see one thing... you're still wrong. look up a google search on the word falloojeh, which appears in her blog several times. you'll find that the only results are clips or various forms of her blog. now look up the word Fallujah. You will find all sorts of CNN articles, stories, independant writer pieces. why do i make the distinction? because anyone from iraq should be able to spell the name of a large city. please, i wouldnt spell the capital of california "sackramentoe." or i wouldnt call the big apple "nue yorck." I think the reason you cling to this is that you so want it to be true. You know what, i can live with that. I'm not saying its bad to be against the war, I'm saying you shouldnt pretend to be somethign you're not, just to make a point. if you believe in something, tell the truth, stand up for it, don't hide behind some fictitious blog.

Dude. [img]graemlins/jawdrop.gif[/img]
Sorry but I'm quite stumped at this post. Erm, you do know that Arabic languages, when used in writing, are written with different characters than those of the Latin alphabet we use, right? And you know that the sounds of this Arabic script cannot be literally translated into Latin letters, resulting in different spellings that reflect attempts to convey the sound as closely as possible (e.g. Al Queda, Al Qu'ida etc etc)? Apparently not.
To put it in simple terms for you: there are no hard and fast rules for spelling Arabic names in our alphabet.

[ 04-21-2004, 03:58 PM: Message edited by: Melusine ]

[Ronn_Bman]

I don't know if the blog is real or not, and I've read through quite a bit of it, but it still seems a bit too good to be true.

There are those on this board whose first language is not English yet they use it better than some of the English or American members of this board(Mel comes to mind ), so speaking perfectly doesn't mean the blog isn't real, but it's one of many things that makes me wonder.

I though there were problems with basic power and water in Iraq, and I thought people's jobs were gone, so they didn't have money for basic items and yet she still has an internet connection? Of course it's possible, just seems a bit.... off.

Another thing that just struck me as weird, the reference to "Condi" Rice? I don't know, like I said it's just a bit off.

[pritchke]

Did you ever consider that the American spelling for the city is not correct from there language and culture?

You say color, we say colour. There are tons of other words were America as decided to go and spell things their own way. Of course every other English speaking nation in the world is wrong that is why they changed it. That is an example of a distinction in the same language. I can't even begin to imagine what a difference between two different languages using a different alphabet or script would be as Melusine points out.

As for city spelling I always had a problem spelling. Fredericton (Provincial Capital of New Brunswick ) I always left out the silent 'e'. Guess that means I was a dumb kid growing up.


[ 04-21-2004, 05:05 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

[Timber Loftis]

Erm, you do know that Arabic languages, when used in writing, are written with different characters than those of the Latin alphabet we use, right? And you know that the sounds of this Arabic script cannot be literally translated into Latin letters, resulting in different spellings that reflect attempts to convey the sound as closely as possible (e.g. Al Queda, Al Qu'ida etc etc)? Apparently not. To put it in simple terms for you: there are no hard and fast rules for spelling Arabic names in our alphabet.

Very correct. The spelling alone leads to no real conclusions. As MagiK, this guy who posted on this forum once upon a time, likes to point out: when he was doing military intel work, they could NEVER decide on the correct spelling of "Qudaffi" "Khadaffi" "Kadaffi" or whoever the hell the guy was.

[promethius9594]

Originally posted by pritchke: Did you ever consider that the American spelling for the city is not correct from there language and culture? You say color, we say colour. There are tons of other words were America as decided to go and spell things their own way. Of course every other English speaking nation in the world is wrong that is why they changed it. That is an example of a distinction in the same language. I can't even begin to imagine what a difference between two different languages using a different alphabet or script would be as Melusine points out. As for city spelling I always had a problem spelling. Fredericton (Provincial Capital of New Brunswick ) I always left out the silent 'e'. Guess that means I was a dumb kid growing up.

you would be correct in this assessment except for one minor detail... even the iraqi websites use the spelling fallujah, not her faulty spelling. when NOBODY else on the web spells the word quite so incorrectly as this woman, including her own countrymen, then i HAVE to assume that she is NOT from the country. especially when she has otherwise perfect spelling, except for iraqi ethnic words. i'll take a little more time to search through the blogs and see if i cant gather a bit more proof.

Please note, however, im not saying youre ideal is wrong... but you might want to place a little less faith in an anonymous web blogger who claims to repeatedly violate iraqi tradition and mispells common iraqi place names. did you know that a recent poll showed that more than a third of people representing themselves as women on the internet were actually male? yeah, thats why i dont trust an anonymous blogger...

[Chewbacca]

What a non-issue. Time to break the mirrors and disperse the smoke.

Why in the hell would someone make a fake blog like this?

Why haven't other Iraqi or Arab bloggers who are not so anomynous denouced the fraud?

Here is one with a bunch of links to other Iraqi blogs:

http://healingiraq.blogspot.com/

They don't seem to concerned with the spelling of Fallujeh or with Identity of Riverbend from what I have read.

A google search of the word "falloojeh" provided me with 900+ results from a variety of sources.

Furthermore I have come across a variety of spellings by Iraqis and other Arabs. Fallujeh, Fallujah, Falloojah, Falloojeh.

What a non-issue and avoidance of the the actual content of the blog. Any further discussion of the identity of the blogger as factual is irrelevant in my opinion.

The yeahs will say yeah and the nays will say nay and the blogger will remain anomynous until she decides it is safe to do otherwise.