"Whites Only" Scholarship

[Oblivion437]

That's what we would call bad reception to good logic. King was a visionary. He belonged to a school of thought shared by such men as Jesus, Ghandi and that Buddha fellow. Real good men at heart, whose messages and names have been misused and twisted. But for the real point: Why not eliminate all racial exclusivism? Or better yet, let people decide who they'll divvy their money out to the public? It's a private fund, after all. Now, some say Affirmative action as a means to support those from rough backgrounds: Your heart is in the right place, and so is your head, but your wallet has been relocated! The system more often supports those who don't need it. The slum child with a 4.0 is an incredible rarity, and one we should seek out. My thing with college is, even if the 2.3% or whatever (I know it's an incredibly small minority) of black people in the upper class schools got displaced because, on their requirements alone, they couldn't get admitted, so what? A system that rewards thrift over birth produces better results anyways. If he got turned down out of requirements, instead of because of the fact that he wasn't white, or because he came from a certain part of the country, as I see it nothing has gone wrong here.

[ 02-29-2004, 04:05 PM: Message edited by: Oblivion437 ]

[WillowIX]

Originally posted by John D Harris: No! there are 12 months were history is recognized, and one of those months is DEVOTED to recognizing Black History. There are Zero months that are DEVOTED to recognizing White history. Now here's the real KICKER history is not Black or White it is the study of what happened. Black & White is only a factor to those that see color in this supossed color blind society. What was that Dr. King said about being judged on the content of ones Character and not the color of ones skin?

[img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] Well said John, couldn't agree more.

Racism isn't a one-way street, whatever one may say about it. What is considered racism towards black must also be considered racism towards white if the action in question is reversed. Whereas scholarship for blacks only maay be morally correct it is still discrimination against white people. The question is, how far can you push it until it is recognised as such? Shouldn't scholarships be judged by accomplishments only and not skin color? Granted that some prejudicm would always effect the outcome, but segregating scholarships will not help anyone in the end.

[Chewbacca]

I think it would depend on the racial make-up of the school, for example Alabama State in Montgomery is (was) somewhere around 95% Black, so they offer white scholarships and other benifits to encourage diversity. I worked with a guy (white) back in '96 who got a free ride at that school because of his skin color.

Its all fine and dandy to ignore race, but that is not practical while, statistically speaking, economic and social disparity still exists. While not enforced by law, segregation can still happen. I have argued previously that affirmative action may not be a perfect solution the problem of disparity and socio-economic inequality, but it is a heck of alot better than letting bigots segregate schools and workplaces unchecked and unhampered.

Down the road, when true intergation has permeated our culture and when the economic and social challenges of minority communities have been met, then AA's time
will be up. When skin color really doesn't matter then skin color will really not matter.

BTW last summer we had a discussion here about affirmative action, the topic was about a mock bakesale at a college in Texas that gave different prices based on race. It was quite a discussion with both sides firmly entrenched in their vewipoints, offering pros and cons of affirmative action.

[Chewbacca]

Here is that previous discussion on this topic.

[ 03-01-2004, 11:19 AM: Message edited by: Chewbacca ]

[Chewbacca]

Originally posted by John D Harris: quote: Originally posted by Illumina Drathiran'ar: I used to be of that school of thought, Cerek, but now I'm not so sure. I used to shun Black History month and say things like, "When's White History Month?" But if you think about it, we have eleven White History Months every year... It sounds trite, but it's true.

No! there are 12 months were history is recognized, and one of those months is DEVOTED to recognizing Black History. There are Zero months that are DEVOTED to recognizing White history. Now here's the real KICKER history is not Black or White it is the study of what happened. Black & White is only a factor to those that see color in this supossed color blind society. What was that Dr. King said about being judged on the content of ones Character and not the color of ones skin? [/QUOTE]Well after 400 years of slavery, it does seem fair to honor the accomplishments of people of that skin color, if for anything, to help instill a sense of general worth and potential in the community, inorder to facilitate the development of that very character Dr. King dreamed of everyone being judge by. Black history month does not hurt me (being white- that I am) nor does it stop me from seeing it in relation to the bigger picture of world/national history. What is the big deal about it? How does it hurt anything? Its not like they are saying that black history is better than white history or some BS like that.

[Timber Loftis]

A private institution can spend its money as it chooses. If I am ever able to afford it, and no one has yet to do it, I WILL be starting the UCCF (United Caucasian College Fund) to honor my people, a proud people who have developed many advancements in the world and have shared their great wealth with all others. Even when my people had control of other races, they had the foresight and compassion to free those people and treat them equally. I will be seeking to honor my people in any way I can. And, if you don't like it, you can kiss my big stark-white butt.

Believe me, I knew lots of disadvantaged white kids who couldn't go to college because they couldn't afford it. Poverty afflicts all communities. Promoting education helps all communities.

[ 03-01-2004, 11:37 AM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: Well after 400 years of slavery, it does seem fair to honor the accomplishments of people of that skin color, if for anything, to help instill a sense of general worth and potential in the community, inorder to facilitate the development of that very character Dr. King dreamed of everyone being judge by. Black history month does not hurt me (being white- that I am) nor does it stop me from seeing it in relation to the bigger picture of world/national history. What is the big deal about it? How does it hurt anything? Its not like they are saying that black history is better than white history or some BS like that.

History should tell it all the good, the bad, and the ugly. As for the Black history month go for it, there is nothing wrong to devote a month to the study of the history of the acomplishments of people of one racial background or skin color, as long as a month devoted to the study of another is not squelshed (sp?). Character is from within oneself, if character is based on ones skin/eye/hair color then it opens the door for abuse. Having pride in one's background, does not deminish(sp?) another's background. The problem usally lays in when one feels their background is deminished because another has pride in their background, which IMHO is a very self-centered view ie: "They are so important that another can not have their own pride."

Chewie, you're a white man from Alabama, you are intimently(sp? speller doen't seem to be working today ) aware of the sterotype that leaves in the minds of some people, because of history, yet you have never owned a slave, nor has anyone living in your family. Same for me.

[Cerek the Barbaric]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: Well after 400 years of slavery, it does seem fair to honor the accomplishments of people of that skin color, if for anything, to help instill a sense of general worth and potential in the community, inorder to facilitate the development of that very character Dr. King dreamed of everyone being judge by. Black history month does not hurt me (being white- that I am) nor does it stop me from seeing it in relation to the bigger picture of world/national history. What is the big deal about it? How does it hurt anything? Its not like they are saying that black history is better than white history or some BS like that.

I'm not sure where you are getting the figure of "400 years of slavery". America is only officially a little over 200 years old and slavery was not started as soon as the Pilgrims set foot in he New World.

Of course, there is the fact that Africans were being enslaved in thier own country by rival tribes loooong before the slave-traders ever thought about bringing them over to the New World to see if there was a market here also. So perhaps that is where the extra few hundred years come in. Of course, America had absolutely nothing to do with the slave trade in Africa, yet it is America that is supposed to apologize for slavery in general and help African/Americans "feel better" about themselves. That sounds more than a bit like a "victim mentality" to me.

But as long as we are honoring those who suffered slavery, then lets not forget that the Israelites were enslaved many times throughout their history...most notably by Egypt. So I suggest we have History Month dedicated to their victory over forced servitude and the subsequent contributions they have contributed to societies in other nations as well as their own. A perfect example would be the Pyramids. Why do the Egyptions get all the credit and praise when these monstrous constructs were built on the backs of the Israelite slave labor employed by Egypt at the time. Surely the Egyptions deserve scorn and ridicule for the Pyramids rather than all-encompassing praise, awe, and wonder. And the credit for the Pyramids should go to the Israelites who actually hauled the megaton blocks into place with nothing more than the strength of their arms, legs, and backs. Let's give credit where it is due and scorn where it is deserved.

[Timber Loftis]

Can we have a history month for my ancestors who were serfs???

[Chewbacca]

Originally posted by Cerek the Barbaric: I'm not sure where you are getting the figure of "400 years of slavery". America is only officially a little over 200 years old and slavery was not started as soon as the Pilgrims set foot in he New World.

400 years is a nice round arbritary figure, give or take some decades and doesn't include Slavery by Africans of Africans in Africa. Not all slaves were black nor from Africa either, simply most were. Check here for the history on Slaves being brought to the new world:

http://www.innercity.org/holt/slavechron.html

As for the rest of your post....time heals all wounds. The wounds of New World slavery, Jim Crow, and segregation are far nearer to now than the slavery of the Isrealites by many hundreds of years.