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Old 10-22-2003, 12:41 PM   #11
Timber Loftis
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Join Date: July 11, 2002
Location: Chicago, IL
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Quote:
Originally posted by Seraph:
quote:
I think he qualifies for the even nastier label of "terrorist"
Terrorists usually have some sort of goal greater than "go kill people". AFAIK This guy doesn't. [/QUOTE]Actually, didn't he want to cause mass terror, and accomplish that goal to an extent? What else is a terrorist? Muslim? Well, I'd say no, but if that is the case, wasn't he a Muslim convert?
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Old 10-22-2003, 12:46 PM   #12
Timber Loftis
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Quote:
Originally posted by Arvon:
Remember Lincoln's statrment... A man who represents himself in court has a fool for a client.

Of course Lincoln was always looking for a fee....
Not always. He was quite pragmatic about the practice. One of my favorite quotes of his is (paraphrased):

The local town attorney made a decent living until another attorney moved to town. Then, they both made a killing.

I think he got wise real fast when he learned that evidence which was legally inadmissible would just keep rolling in without an attorney to know when to object and why.
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Old 10-22-2003, 03:12 PM   #13
Seraph
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Join Date: September 12, 2001
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Quote:
Originally posted by Timber Loftis:
quote:
Originally posted by Seraph:
quote:
I think he qualifies for the even nastier label of "terrorist"
Terrorists usually have some sort of goal greater than "go kill people". AFAIK This guy doesn't. [/QUOTE]Actually, didn't he want to cause mass terror, and accomplish that goal to an extent? What else is a terrorist? Muslim? Well, I'd say no, but if that is the case, wasn't he a Muslim convert? [/QUOTE]Terrorists use terror as a means to an end.
For example: (Some of these may be underestimates of their actual goals)
The IRA wanted a "free" northern Ireland
Osama wanted the Muslim world "free" of American influance
Hamas wants Israel out of the occupied territories
Timothy McVeigh wanted to attack the government, and to avenge the deaths of the Branch Davidians.
[etc...]

This guy appears to have wanted nothing more than to go around killing people. Do you consider Jack the Ripper, David Berkowitz (Son of Sam), and Albert DeSalvo (the Boston Strangler) to be terrorists?
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Old 10-22-2003, 03:44 PM   #14
Timber Loftis
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No, I don't. I just think we don't know what this guy's motives were -- at least I haven't seen much on it.
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Old 10-22-2003, 04:21 PM   #15
Sir Taliesin
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Join Date: March 4, 2001
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I thought it was for $10,000,000. Wasn't that what he demanded?
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Old 10-22-2003, 05:16 PM   #16
Skunk
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I think that was an after-thought. The demand only came after the authorities had made contact with him. Frankly, I think that he was just having 'fun' - and got carried away by his new found 'cult' status.
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Old 10-23-2003, 04:29 AM   #17
Azred
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Join Date: March 13, 2001
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Question Mark

Quote:
Originally posted by Azred (thank you very much):
I think he qualifies for the even nastier label of "terrorist"
Quote:
Originally posted by Seraph:
Terrorists usually have some sort of goal greater than "go kill people". AFAIK This guy doesn't.

Terrorists use terror as a means to an end.
[img]graemlins/idontagreeatall.gif[/img] Not necessarily. The most effective terrorist will have no apparent motive, because he doesn't want to acheive any goal other than watching everyone running around scared s***less.

Quote:
Originally posted by Seraph:
This guy appears to have wanted nothing more than to go around killing people. Do you consider Jack the Ripper, David Berkowitz (Son of Sam), and Albert DeSalvo (the Boston Strangler) to be terrorists?
Yes, they were. The citizens of of London, New York City, and Boston, respectively, were terrified out of their minds. How safe would you feel if it became known that a serial killer was active in your city?

That being said, I think he was just toying with everyone just like he has been this whole time; he never seriously planned to represent himself legally. I have always gotten the impression that he thinks of this whole scenario as some sort of game, his version of "me against the world".
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