Alien vs. Predator!

[Barry the Sprout]

I think the one in Alien 3 is an android as well Hierophant - 85 clocks him on the head with a wrench rather hard and he doesn't even feel it. Large amounts of skin and flesh are hanging off his head and he doesn't particularly mind...

While we're on the subject of Alien 3 I'd just like to say: its a bad, bad, film. It has good actors and a good director but its somehow just very bad.

[The Hierophant]

Originally posted by Barry the Sprout: I think the one in Alien 3 is an android as well Hierophant - 85 clocks him on the head with a wrench rather hard and he doesn't even feel it. Large amounts of skin and flesh are hanging off his head and he doesn't particularly mind...

Really? Again, I may need my eyes checked as I never noticed the flesh hanging off. But then again, I havn't seen it since I was about 13 [img]smile.gif[/img]
But personally I quite liked Alien3. Can't really put my finger on why. I guess I just like bleak, hopeless films.

[Morgeruat]

hmm, lets just hope there aren't any "alien-predator" hybrids, I recall one of the alien vs predator comics where that occured (aliens take select genetic material from their "hosts" resulting in some very interesting brids - ie one crossover where superman was infected he coughed the little bastard up into the sun to prevent it from emerging with some of his capabilitiese)

[Barry the Sprout]

Having just watched the scene in question again I'm undecided on whether or not he's an android. His ear appears to be half off, along with a large bit of the skin around it, and he doesn't exactly look in pain, let alone the kind of agony you'd expect. But then again the blood is red, not white like the normal androidy stuff.

I don't mind hopeless and dark films, but theres no way you can get round the awful dialogue of Alien 3. Plus I could never get over expecting 85 to say in a flat northern voice: "...of course the shopkeeper and his son were another matter entirely. I had to beat them to death with their own shoelaces.". It horribly under-uses Pete Postlethwaite as well, and thats a crime deserving of the death penalty in some cultures.

[Link]

I always assumed that it was just another trick and that this Bishop was another cyborg.

[The Hierophant]

I assumed he was human because of the contrast he demonstrates with the android Bishop. As if David Fincher was trying to point out the greed and exploitation that 'condemns' humanity. The android Bishop was selfless and faithful to Ripley, risking his 'life' to save her from the Queen, whereas the human Bishop merely wants to use her to gain access to the alien. I thought where he says 'I'm very human', Fincher was intending him to personify all of humanity's negative qualities. And in comparison to his (and the company's) calculating exploitation, the alien's savage destructivness, yet utter devotion to its species, seems less 'evil'. Bishop becomes the 'Burke' of Alien 3.

And yeah Barry, I'm a fan of Pete Postlethwaite too [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

[Link]

First off, ever seen The Lost World; Jurassic Park 2? Talk about Pete Postlethwaite having a good role. He gets eaten by two T-Rexes

And about the android Bishop being faithful and all: yeah that's true. But maybe David Fincher isn't pointing out that Mr Weiland himself (assuming the Bishop in Alien 3 is in fact human) is a total opposite of his own androids and that he is greedy, self-centered and all those negative qualities, but that even androids, while properly programmed, can have their nasty sides as well (and here I assume that Bishop in Alien 3 is indeed an android).

Note that there is an immense difference in time between the movies. While Ripley may be in cryosleep, that doesn't mean other people don't age.

[Barry the Sprout]

Burke is slimy and Machiavellian, but the Bishop android/maker (whichever) seems much mroe sincere. He is obviously trying to get some kind of personal (or company) gain, but he just comes out and says it, unlike Burke. With Burke its all about the money, whereas with Bishop he practically pleads with Ripley to let him examine the Alien - he seems much more trustworthy than Burke, they're not really the same in my opinion. I know you're not saying they were the same, but I mean that they don't play the same role. Burke shows how humans will climb over each others dead bodies for a bit of money, but Bishop (in Alien 3 at least) shows how raw ambition and desire (he embodies the company effectively - whether he's human or not) cause us to make our greatest mistakes. Burke doesn't care what he does to anyone, as long as he's okay. Bishop is just overconfident and feels he can handle anything. Aliens is a very 80s film - about the greed of man, Alien 3 is much more 90s - with a message that we shouldn't get too confident in ourselves. Thats my take on it anyway.

But it still doesn't help answer the question of whether he's human or not!

Pete Postlethwaite is very good, but does he actually get eaten in Jurassic Park 2? I thought he had an epiphany halfway through and vows not to hunt anymore, therefore making him untouchable as far as the film script goes... I could have sworn it was Richard Schiff who gets eaten by two T Rex's. But either way Postlethwaite is one of the only good things about that film.

[The Hierophant]

Originally posted by Barry the Sprout: Burke is slimy and Machiavellian, but the Bishop android/maker (whichever) seems much mroe sincere. He is obviously trying to get some kind of personal (or company) gain, but he just comes out and says it, unlike Burke. With Burke its all about the money, whereas with Bishop he practically pleads with Ripley to let him examine the Alien - he seems much more trustworthy than Burke, they're not really the same in my opinion. I know you're not saying they were the same, but I mean that they don't play the same role. Burke shows how humans will climb over each others dead bodies for a bit of money, but Bishop (in Alien 3 at least) shows how raw ambition and desire (he embodies the company effectively - whether he's human or not) cause us to make our greatest mistakes. Burke doesn't care what he does to anyone, as long as he's okay. Bishop is just overconfident and feels he can handle anything. Aliens is a very 80s film - about the greed of man, Alien 3 is much more 90s - with a message that we shouldn't get too confident in ourselves. Thats my take on it anyway.

That's a good way of looking at it Barry. Puts a new perspecive on things [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

[Link]

No you're right. It wasn't Pete who got eaten after all [img]smile.gif[/img] Maybe by the raptors though..