New Custom Item: The Necromanicon

[SixOfSpades]

Being able to cast an infinite number of ADHWs per day, with a casting time of 2, is enough to make this an obvious no-no.

Why do people always try to come up with overpowered crap? Like there aren't enough Godsticks in the game already? It's the well-balanced items that make the game fun, and here are (what I think are) 2 good examples:

Say you're irritated by the mods that use cheese, such as enemies being scripted to always know exactly where you are, even if you're Invisible. (They might not be able to attack you, but they'll follow you around and surround you anyway, making it impossible for you to move.) Fight the cheese by turning around and biting that mod on the ass: Make a version of the Book of Infinite Spells, usable by anybody, that casts Invisibility, Globe of Blades, Stun and Hold Person on its user. Duration of 1 turn for all effects, usable 3x/day.

Make items that carry serious drawbacks, but can still be used in a way that benefits the player. For example, a while ago, Leslie was playing a no-Reloads game in which Jaheira got chunked. Can't Resurrect her, and can't play that battle over, so Leslie was stuck without a very valuable party member that he had invest a lot of time and EXP in. So I made (and sent to him) the Ring of Doom: When a party member puts it on, she dies instantly. The Ring then becomes a Quick Item, which the PC can use to cast Raise Dead, after which it turns back into a Ring again. It sounds like a really stupid thing to carry around, but if Leslie had had Jaheira put on this Ring when things started looking really bad for her, he would have been able to Resurrect her, for free, after the fight.

[ 09-02-2004, 08:41 PM: Message edited by: SixOfSpades ]

[Dundee Slaytern]

Originally posted by Feral: ~~ Is there a storyline justification for the drop in wisdom, of all traits? ~~

Wise men no touch this s***.

To put it in a more palatable way, if a person is unwise enough to meddle with "Things That Men Are Not Suppose To Know", chances are, the powers he/she gains from this item will gradually degenerate his/her common sense.

"My precioussss... ..."

[Feral]

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern: "My precioussss... ..."

SOLD! [img]smile.gif[/img]

SixOfSpades: I agree with your never-faltering stance against overpowered cr@p being inserted into the game (I'm currently keeping a couple of ridiculous items found after Tactics battles in my bag of holding for imminent sale). However, I like the idea of having a very powerful item with very serious side-effects. A serious chance of 10D10 slashing damage should ensure that the item is used only in the most dire circumstances. That much damage is virtually guaranteed to chunkify the spellcaster, so one would think hard before resorting to it.

[Bozos of Bones]

I'm surprised noone saw this one: the book's name is Necronomicon Ex Mortis, not Necromanicon. I've also seen the movie, and I got a nifty idea if it's possible to make a user alignment related item(something like the Equaliser, just user dependant). If you're evil, you get what's previously stated, but if you're a good aligned character you may cast banishment and protection from evil and stuff like that, but only once, as we've seen Ash do that in the movie.
P.S.
Is there an Evil dead 4, in the future?

[Neomi]

SixOfSpades, I'm sure most of the people on the board appreciate your insight (not to mention wit) with regard to all aspects of this game. Myself included.

However, IMHO you might have been a bit harsh on Daniel_M by calling his item "overpowered crap". While it is true that in the initial inception, the book was quite a bit overpowered, I think it's kind of a neat idea (and fun that it draws from the Evil Dead movies) and I tried to suggest revision of the item to encourage better balance rather than just brushing it away.

I'm not sure what the meaning of "Able to cast all Necromatic spells at will" means; if it means "Being able to cast an infinite number of ADHWs per day, with a casting time of 2" then yes, I think most people would agree that it is more than a little bit over-powered. But perhaps Daniel_M would consider editing this feature of the item a bit more.

Bozos of Bones, you're probably right about the spelling of the book, yu shud kno that mos of the peepl on ths bored cant spel vry well. But I really like your idea that the book could have different effects for different alignments ala ASH.

Or, if you really wanted to get cute, you could set the item up like one of the tests in Hell, so that if you chose to use the item for EVIL (i.e. to call forth an army of darkness), your alignment would remain EVIL or change to EVIL, whereas if you chose to destroy the book, your alignment would remain or change to GOOD or NEUTRAL. Any item-makers want to comment on the feasibility of this idea?

[SixOfSpades]

Originally posted by Feral: I like the idea of having a very powerful item with very serious side-effects. A serious chance of 10D10 slashing damage should ensure that the item is used only in the most dire circumstances. That much damage is virtually guaranteed to chunkify the spellcaster, so one would think hard before resorting to it.

10D10 comes out to about 60, on average, so even people like Aerie have a decent chance of survival (especially if the chance of the damage occurring at all is less than 100%), and remember that a player who imports an item this powerful is probably using something along the lines of a Kensai->Mage, as well. But even that is irrelevant when you consider the damage type: What do Mages do against Slashing damage? Stoneskin, of course!

Originally posted by Neomi: However, IMHO you might have been a bit harsh on Daniel_M by calling his item "overpowered crap".

My exact words were, "Why do people always try to come up with overpowered crap?" Sorry, but I thought my shift to 3rd-person plural was enough to indicate that I wasn't flaming Daniel or anything. It's just that I've seen a lot of, well, overpowered crap in my day, and it saddens me to think that many modders seem to believe that the only definition of a "good" item or spell is "something that kicks ass and gets used a lot."

While it is true that in the initial inception, the book was quite a bit overpowered, I think it's kind of a neat idea (and fun that it draws from the Evil Dead movies) and I tried to suggest revision of the item to encourage better balance rather than just brushing it away.

True. Background is always good, particularly if the audience has also seen the film(s) and is therefore in on the reference. I once submitted a custom joke item to PlanetDiablo.net (unfortunately, it was long after they'd stopped taking custom joke items, but it was cool anyway):

FRENCH STUDDED LEATHER OF TAUNTING AC: 30 +200% Armor against daffy English knnnnnnnnnnnnigits Grants Hurl Cow ability 2x/day (Barbarian only) -4 penalty to knees-bent, running-about, advancing behavior

All this makes for funny reading, of course, but doesn't really help Daniel_M. So, as part of the drawbacks for using the Necronomicon, I suggest that each attempted use have a 33% chance of having the book fly up into the air and attack whatever it can see (Insect Plague), and a 33% chance of sucking the user into the book for a while (Maze). Then, if the user is lucky enough to get in the successful 34%, there's a 50% chance (perhaps dependent on the user's INT?) of mispronouncing the spell, which casts Earthquake and summons a small army of hostile Skeletons.

There are 2 big drawbacks to making the Necronomicon as a usable item, one from the movie, and one from the game:
1) The Necronomicon was never actually used to cast anything: Some archaeologist bozo was dumb enough to read part of it out loud, of course, summoning something evil, but for the rest of Evil Dead 2 (and all of Army of Darkness), nothing is ever successfully done with it--evil things just seem to happen around it.
2) Book of Kaza? What the hell's that?

[ 09-04-2004, 01:11 AM: Message edited by: SixOfSpades ]

[Hank Parsons]

Originally posted by SixOfSpades: if Leslie had had Jaheira put on this Ring when things started looking really bad for her, he would have been able to Resurrect her, for free, after the fight.

Let me get this straight... SixOfSpades created/uses an item which basically removes the chunk-threat from the game? LMAO. *And* you support the idea of tossing the ring across the room and equipping it in mid-battle when someone's heavily damaged? Man, chunking is the only way to actually die in this game. You've just made the game impossible to lose. And you talk about overpowered cheese. LMAO. Surely I've misunderstood? Else, the irony is killin' me.

[ 09-05-2004, 05:53 PM: Message edited by: Hank Parsons ]

[Sir Goulum]

Originally posted by SixOfSpades: Why do people always try to come up with overpowered crap? Like there aren't enough Godsticks in the game already? It's the well-balanced items that make the game fun, *snip*

But to some people(myself included), being able to be a walking death machine is equally as fun as playing the game fairly!

[Illumina Drathiran'ar]

Originally posted by Sir Goulum: quote: Originally posted by SixOfSpades: Why do people always try to come up with overpowered crap? Like there aren't enough Godsticks in the game already? It's the well-balanced items that make the game fun, *snip*

But to some people(myself included), being able to be a walking death machine is equally as fun as playing the game fairly! [/QUOTE]I don't need an item like that to be a death machine. I have my sorc.

[Sir Goulum]

Er.....I don't have that kind of patience!