Battle of the Rogues...

[Jim]

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern: Jim, you forget that Blades can have Traps too if you install ToB. He mentioned level 40 for the both of them, which is the ToB XP Cap. It is going to degenerate into a contest of taunting... ... "Come here you chicken! I dare yer! DARE YER!" "No, you come here, you yellow whippersnapper!" "You come here!" "You come here!" ~ ~ ~ ~

Hmmm, that'll teach me to properly read the starter post. We can then of course assume that the swashbuckler can use spell buffs too! I think your taunting contest is seemingly more and more likely.

Oh, and while Mirror Image will protect you from Thief Traps, Stoneskins will not. For some reason, Thief Traps bypasses Stoneskins

This I did not know. For standard thief snares, I was always under the impression that there was a physical component and an elemental component, therefore the stoneskins could have blocked the physical damage with the mirror images blocking the elemental damage. If this is not the case, then . I wonder now if MR will not block the maze effect from a Bounty Hunters special snare?

[Butterfingers]

Protection from Magical Weapons will also protect against Thief traps... As I found out with my unfortunate Mage/Thief who somehow failed to set a snare with 90% in trap setting. I got the strangest message. Snowlocke was immune to my damage.

[Rataxes]

C'mon people, the Blade wont stand a chance 1st, He'll struggle badly to even hit a properly armored Swashie, who should no doubt have -25 AC at the very least (probably more bonuses to individual damage types). The Swashie wont have that same problem even if figthing a Blade in defensive stance, with his +8 THAC0 bonus which will grant him warrior-like THAC0. Any illusion spells the Blade tries to throw up will be dispelled in mere seconds by the Swashies permanent and almighty Detect illusions ability, thus denying the Blade of any kind of advantage that Imp Invisibility, Blur, Mirror Image or Mislead would offer.

You put up PfMW? Ok, so I'll stay away for four rounds. I can do that as many times as I need. Not only can I run, but I can also hide with my permanent stealth. You put up Stoneskin? I'll use Whirlwind and slam FoA +5 in your face. You think you can slow me? Good luck slowing a player who knows how to avoid non-targetted AoE spells and moves at quadruple speed You use Imp Haste? Well with your THAC0 vs my AC, good luck killing me on criticals You could use Tensers Transformation to get your Chance to hit up to maybe 20-25%, but that leaves you with zero magical back-up for the duration of the spell, and I think we all know how badly a Swashie owns a Blade in pure melee.

The bottom line is that every single advantage that a Blade has over a Swashie comes from a very limited source which a smart player can easily outlast, while every single weapon and counter-measure a Swashie has against a Blade, is permanent and unextinguishable. The Blade might be able to hold his own for a while, but he'll perish in the long run.

Oh and btw, this might be another "Acid trap? No piercing trap! No Acid trap!" thing, but Stoneskin stops the physical part of the thief traps just fine, it can even halt the poison (which I believe is actually physical damage as well) that follows in the next few rounds.

[ 03-31-2003, 09:42 AM: Message edited by: Rataxes ]

[Dundee Slaytern]

I wish mine did... life would be soooo much easier against the Tactics Improved Encounter's Bounty Hunters.

[Rataxes]

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern: I wish mine did... life would be soooo much easier against the Tactics Improved Encounter's Bounty Hunters.

Actually, now that you mention it, I've never tried if Stoneskin can protect me from enemy traps. Just countless times observed enemy mages with stoneskin absorbing my traps like they were made of rubber.

And Stoneskin wont stop the Maze Traps, they are surely as much of a PITA for me as for you

[Alson]

Originally posted by Rataxes: Actually, now that you mention it, I've never tried if Stoneskin can protect me from enemy traps. Just countless times observed enemy mages with stoneskin absorbing my traps like they were made of rubber.

Mysterious! Stoneskin does not, under any circumstances, absorbs traps' damage in my game, neither mine nor the enemies'.

And Stoneskin wont stop the Maze Traps, they are surely as much of a PITA for me as for you

Ah... fortunately, Gebhard Blucher (the proud creator of the Improved Random Encounters) was kind enough and made this tweak. No more Maze Traps, wohoo! [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Dundee Slaytern]

The... only thing I can think of... is that the European version of BG2 is somehow differently coded from the USA version. I am assuming here that Jim and Rataxes are using the European version, while Alson is using the USA version.

[Rataxes]

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern: The... only thing I can think of... is that the European version of BG2 is somehow differently coded from the USA version. I am assuming here that Jim and Rataxes are using the European version, while Alson is using the USA version.

Yep that's probably correct, though I think it's strange that they got the US version in Israel. Did you order your copy from a foreign company or did you buy it in a local store Alson?

[Alson]

Yep - i do use the Northern American version of SoA (and ToB, obviously). Stores in Israel sell the European version, indeed, but my father bought me my copy in JFK... you have no idea how hard it was to get ToB. Had to order a special copy, which obviously means extra $$... Oh well... it was worth it. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[D*Ranged]

Oooookkkaaaay, so ends round 1.

So in the short run, blade wins. If drawn - out, however, swashies kill blades.

Now for round 2:

Skald vs Bounty Hunters
(The battle of the "outdated" rogues )

Skald can sing special bard song, +1 to hit, and casts mage spells up to lvl 6 and set traps.
BH can set traps up to maze, HLA traps, backstab x5.
Same equipment as blade and swash, just this time both wear Carsomyr +6 (UAI).

Free for all. WHO SHALL WIN???