Solafein Q:s

[Xero279]

If you want more info (thought this info on this thread might be enough), i have a thread opened called Problems with Mods, asking questions about sola. its on the first few pages.

[Dundee Slaytern]

Originally posted by SixOfSpades: Quote: Originally posted by SpongeBobTheDestoyer: ...He also eventually gets a long sword called Tsuki no Ken Equipped it provides: Free action, luck, +2 Armor class bonus, +1 attacks per round, permanent Armor of Faith, Draw upon Holy Might, Death Ward, Negative Plane Prot. Chaotic Commands, And each hit has a 50% chance of blinding the victim and inflicting 18 points of fire damage over the course of 3 seconds.

Gee, it's a good thing that that sword ISN'T GROSSLY OVERPOWERED OR ANYTHING!!! Permanent Luck alone is too much.[/QUOTE]Wasn't sure if that was sarcasm there.

Anyway, are those when equipped, or... can cast on self once a day? I sincerely hope it is the latter... ...

[SixOfSpades]

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern: Wasn't sure if that was sarcasm there.

Well, I was laying the sarcasm on with a snow shovel, so yes, I hope you detected it. In retrospect, I'm amazed that the first thing I complained about was the Permanent Luck! I must have been so flabbergasted by the cheesiness of this thing that I didn't even stop to read the whole description, because Permanent Luck is worthless compared to Permanent Armor of Faith. Oh my god, give me a colossal @^$*##^! break here! Even *IF* the thing can only be used by Soluafein, it would be mere child's play to create a Fighter/Thief with the DoE and the Jansen Adventurewear--BAM, permanent 70% Physical Resistances, without even touching Hardiness, through the entire latter half of the game. And it gets even better! Because Armor of Faith doesn't just shield against Physical damage: Magic Damage, Fire, Magic Fire, Cold, Magic Cold, Acid, Electricity, and Poison all have their damage reduced by 25% as well.

This sword, apparently, was for people who weren't satisfied with the useless piece of junk known as Sanchuudoku.

Sometimes I wonder why the hell Weimer even bothers to write MODs, as it's painfully obvious he doesn't know JACK about game balance.

(Wow! A real, honest-to-god flame! I'm finally a man now!)

[Dundee Slaytern]

A little harsh there, SoS. Weimer does try his best to balance his mods, although I do concede that he does go overboard sometimes. One must also note that most of the crowd over at his forums are powergamers and/or cheaters. The former is okay, but the latter can really screw up the feedback data on his mods.

They think nothing of Ctrl+Ying everything that moves, or create a Kensai->Sorcerer. Things like that can seriously undermine whether a mod is balanced or not. I mean... if you are going to do the Improved Encounters by cheating... then what is the point of installing the Improved Encounters in the first place? If the response is to get the cool stuff, then I will just shake my head.

So I guess what I am trying to say here is, try to critisise constructively. I try by suggesting alternatives. Whether or not Weimer chooses to implement them is up to him, but at least he knows my opinion and what I think should be done, although I do go one step further by gathering opinions from the rest on this forum instead of e-mailing him my stance so that he knows I am being serious about it and that several people share my view.

[SixOfSpades]

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern: Weimer does try his best to balance his mods,

That's his best?

One must also note that most of the crowd over at his forums are powergamers and/or cheaters.

I must concede that my own view is biased as well, as I am something of an "orthodox purist" about this game, and surrounded by others of like mind here at Ironworks. But even if Weimer's viewpoint has been completely skewed in the opposite direction by the powergaming fanatics, that still doesn't justify making a sword that would make Helm, Tempus, and Moradin lie down and weep with envy.

So I guess what I am trying to say here is, try to critisise constructively. I try by suggesting alternatives.

You know, I tried that. I tried that when he brought out the Rebalanced Shapeshifter, when he brought out the Impaler+4, and when he brought out Improved Kitthix. I didn't complain when he made the Holy Buckler of Amaunator more powerful than I'd intended. I suggested logical ways to tone down things like the Improved Staff of the Woodlands, Sorcerian Ring and Gloves of the Master Thief. And none of it did a damn bit of good. But, since it's always good policy to at least attempt to change the world:

Tsuki no Ken
THAC0 bonus: -3
Damage: 1D8+3, +1D4 Fire Damage
Proficiency: Long Sword
Attributes: While equipped, grants Negative Plane Protection, Chaotic Commands, and immunity to Charm and Domination spells.

And looky there! It's still one heck of a cool sword--it makes Vampires and Mind Flayers get ready to wet their pants. (Do Vampires even _have_ bodily functions?)

....I do go one step further by gathering opinions from the rest on this forum instead of e-mailing him my stance so that he knows I am being serious about it and that several people share my view.

Actually, with a thread title like "Solaufein Q's," weimer should come strolling along here of his own accord pretty soon, anyway. Here, you be the good cop & I'll be the bad cop. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 03-11-2003, 12:27 AM: Message edited by: SixOfSpades ]

[weimer]

Originally posted by SixOfSpades: Gee, it's a good thing that that sword ISN'T GROSSLY OVERPOWERED OR ANYTHING!!! Permanent Luck alone is too much.[/QB]

Believe it or not, the sword (which is only available to high-level Sola, ToB-style) is actually under-powered compared to a bunch of other ToB and SoA weapons (Foebane? Ravager? Ages? Fury? Magi? Unyielding?). Permanent Luck is too strong in IWD2 -- in BG2 it's not as strong. The sword provides a few buffs ... but that's basically a convenience factor. By that point in the game protecting Sola from confusion is not really a big concern -- chaotic commands and the like are just gravy that fit with the theme.

Originally there was no Tsuki+5 -- just Tsuki+4. A number of players complained (rightly, in retrospect) that it was much too weak for ToB and that they lamented having to drop Sola's "signature weapon" in favor of something more effective.

[weimer]

Originally posted by SixOfSpades: that I didn't even stop to read the whole description, because Permanent Luck is worthless

Pretty much, yes.

compared to Permanent Armor of Faith.

And this is more fun than having Solaufein cast Hardiness how? Seriously -- Solaufein normally sits around with Pro-MW when there is any danger of him being hit by something important. If you're already taking 0 damage, a percentage reduction isn't that impressive.

Oh my god, give me a colossal @^$*##^! break here! Even *IF* the thing can only be used by Soluafein,

... which is true. Eilistraee takes it away if any other party member ever uses it.

it would be mere child's play to create a Fighter/Thief with the DoE and the Jansen Adventurewear--BAM,

What does this hypothetical F/T have to do with Solaufein's sword?

Your argument actually seems to suggest (correctly!) that it is already quite possible to get very high physical resistances in BG2. In light of that, I'm not sure why giving AoF to Solaufein in ToB is such a big deal.

[SixOfSpades]

Originally posted by weimer: The sword provides a few buffs ...

"A few?" I count ten. If that's your idea of "a few," I'd like to see what you consider overpowered. How many people value Belm, Kundane, or the Scarlet Ninja-to solely because of the extra attack? How many people value the Runehammer+5, just for the Negative Plane Protection? In case you're not as familiar with the Ironworks board as I am, I'll tell you: Plenty.

A number of players complained (rightly, in retrospect) that it was much too weak for ToB and that they lamented having to drop Sola's "signature weapon" in favor of something more effective.

If anybody thinks that they're "forced to drop" what is pretty much a Godstick in favor of something "more effective" simply doesn't have the brains to realize that it's fully capable of granting Barbarians and Fighter/Thieves non-dispellable, permanent, 100% Physical resistances. Stick something like this on a character who already has close to 90% Magic Resistance, and you have just cheesed the game beyond all recognition. Congratulations.

[weimer]

You know, I tried that. I tried that when he brought out the Rebalanced Shapeshifter,

And look! Now it's weaker, and has been for a while.

when he brought out the Impaler+4,

And look! After a long debate I have decided that I do not agree. That happens some times.

and when he brought out Improved Kitthix

And look! After a long debate no one was able to bring forth any evidence beyond "I having a feeling that Imp Kitthix is strong" -- in all but one of my tests he died a horrible flaming death. Sure, he's great support. But he's not the second coming. The one person I remember who did some other battle testing came back with the conclusion that he was comparable to a Mordy (in the Oasis).

I didn't complain when he made the Holy Buckler of Amaunator more powerful than I'd intended.

In a game where you can buy protection from undead scrolls, concerns about False Dawn didn't seem all that pressing to me. Compare Daystar's Sunray (which works on more than undead!).

And none of it did a damn bit of good.

I wouldn't go that far.

Attributes: While equipped, grants Negative Plane Protection, Chaotic Commands, (and immunity to Charm and Domination spells (which is part of Chaotic Commands, IIRC)).

These abilities are larely useless for the only possible user given his initial magic resistance. Would you use a +3 sword with NPP and some fire damage when Ages, Fury, Angurvadal, the Runehammer, Foebane, etc., are available?

[weimer]

If anybody thinks that they're "forced to drop" what is pretty much a Godstick in favor of something "more effective" simply doesn't have the brains to realize that it's fully capable of granting Barbarians and Fighter/Thieves non-dispellable, permanent, 100% Physical resistances. Stick something like this on a character who already has close to 90% Magic Resistance, and you have just cheesed the game beyond all recognition. Congratulations.

Since you cannot give it to a Barbarian or a Fighter/Thief, I'm not sure how this is relevant.