Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows pt.1

[Bungleau]

Saw it again tonight with my son, who was very upset that he missed the chance to see it Friday with us.

• It's better in IMAX... it really, really is.
• The second time, you notice more details... like the fact that the three polyjuice targets were not randomly chosen (well, at least two weren't).
• To reiterate what Larry said, this movie is all about Hermione. Radcliffe has three emotional settings (angry, stoic, and crying). Grint has (been given?) the acting range of a stone, although he almost showed some emotion during the torture scene. Watson? By far the best of the movie.
• Lucius Malfoy... how far they can fall. Almost too far, I think... absolutely no swagger left.
• I pity the poor guy who left the theater after the final emotional scene with Dobby. He had to go to the bathroom... and literally peed away the final scene in the movie!
• Still unsure what the heck the dancing scene was for.. other than to fill time
• Best line, IMHO... "Dobby did *NOT* intend to kill! Dobby only intended to maim... or seriously injure..."
• My son thought it sucked... because he doesn't want to wait until July for Part 2...

All in all, still excellent.

[SpiritWarrior]

Saw it tonight and was dissapointed tbh. I don't think this has anything on "The Half Blood Prince". I know the franchise changes directors for almost every movie, so maybe that was the problem for me...I haven't looked it up to check yet.

It truly felt like half a movie for me but not in the sense that it was Part 1. I agree with Larry that there was this kinda blurry aspect to combat and action. Many times I missed what was happening or didn't quite know. I know they are firing spells behind them but I can't see it properly. It looked like they teleported just as they got thrown out the window but I wasn't sure if it was just smoke. This wasn't intentional mystery because I found out they did a few seconds later.

Scenes begin and end suddenly with no progress made really. I guess they call it "art". For me it was just wasting time.

I don't think the details were as defined as they should have been. The story holds up...but only because it has been built on for years, but all the characters seem very 1-dimensional in this installment. From Hagrid to Harry. It wasn't terrible but it wasn't exactly awesome either. I felt like I was watching one of the Twilight movies sometimes (flashy, but lacking substance).

[Wolf Rider2]

Hehe, speaking of Twilight... When I went to Harry Potter, one girl said afterwards that it hadn't been as good as the last Twilight movie. She had everybody's remaining popcorn thrown at her

[Cerek]

I took the boys to see it this afternoon. I agree about the action scenes...they were hard to follow at times. I'm sure there was a lot of references in other scenes that went past me since I don't know the back story.

I also agree the acting by Radcliffe and Grint was almost non-existent - especially Grint. If that were my g/f screaming in pain, I would be trying to rip the iron door out of the stone to reach her. And Harry does come off even worse in that scene. EVERY time the s*** hits the fan, he turns to Hermoine, relying on her to have a way out or begging her to help with the situation. Then, when she is being tortured and screaming, he doesn't show any concern at all and, as Larry said, seems far more interested in discovering Luna there. Hermoine said she was "always mad" at Ron. Seems to me, she should be more than a little pissed at Harry too.

And speaking of Hermoine and Harry, exactly WHY is Hermoine the "best with spells", always the one with a plan AND the person the Chosen One turns to any time things go past being "slightly screwed up"?

Hermoine is the one with the disguises when they leave the Barrows (and also the one that ports them away). She is the one with the plan (and potion) for breaking into the Ministry of Magic. After the attack in the cafe', Harry is the one that depends on Hermoine to do the mindwipe because "she is the best with spells". WHAT? "the best with spells"? Then exactly what IS the "Chosen One" good for?

Finally, how come Harry pleads with Hermoine for help when Dobbie is dying in his arms? Can the Chosen One not even cast a healing spell?

I realize a lot of this is probably self-explanatory to those that have actually followed the series, but as an outside observer, I keep asking myself just what purpose the Chosen One is suppose to serve? Is it JUST being the one that can kill Voldemort? In most movies with a "chosen champion", it is very common for the "chosen" to not realize how much power they truly wield, but in Harry's case, he has now had YEARS to discover and develop his power and he still seems - quite frankly - pretty useless most of the time. I never saw any flashes of uber power during moments of extreme duress and barely saw flashes of medium power when it was called for.

Guess I do need to read the books or at least rent the other movies to find out why Harry isn't a lot more powerful by now.

[SpiritWarrior]

No, you're right. As childrens books/movies go, Harry Potter holds true to the genre - making less logical sense and more "make believe". Harry, throughout all the movies, always comes off as an amatuer wizard, if even that. Calling Ron the same is a compliment, as he can barely cast ANY spell correctly and really, shouldn't be there at all. If I ran Hogwarts, Ron would be the cook and Harry would be kept back each semester until I saw some advancement to justify his grade level. Hermoine is the only one with any skill and, in contrast, should have been skipped ahead a few grades.

After years of training, Harry still manages to demonstrate the abilities of a 1st level wizard, if even that. Cantrips, basically. He is also, to this day, horribly lacking in confidence and arcane knowledge. He knows far more people at Hogwarts than he does spells. At the end of almost every movie, he manages to pull off some fluke-ish, well-beyond-his-ability stunt, but this is usually due to being aided by powerful creatures/items/people who insist he is "the chosen one". His father, a phoenix, Dumbledore, Hermione. The list goes on. But it is never directly him who really does much. In a nutshell, he defeats the villains by sheer luck or help. I guess this is intentional...although it just ends up being frustrating. Hermoine could take Harry down in seconds. Draco too.

IMO, whoever the chooser of the chosen one is, they made a horrible mistake and obviously meant to choose Hermoine. For a half-blooded mage, she is more powerful than all of them put together. She also seems to be the only one with a brain. Harry is a bumbling idiot who stumbles his way through each mess with the help of his friends and various powerful adult wizards.

Another thing about this movie was the amount of running they did. Like, why run from the snatchers when they can just join hands and teleport? Why be nervous whilst inside the ministry when they can just teleport away if things go sour, then try again later?

These are the mysteries. But again, we can't take it this seriously since it is a kids movie, after all, and for most kids, these questions simply don't arise.

The movies are good though - don't get me wrong. This one just broke the trend, for me. If you haven't seen the others I would advise you to maybe do so. While the first two are VERY much "for kids" you might get through them. If not, start from part 3. Some of them are excellent, as they become darker as they go on, with the themes reflecting this. The Half Blood Prince was very good. Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix was one of my facorite ones, and stars that female teacher whome Harry took the horcrux from, as the main character. The Goblet of Fire was also fun. There are definately some great ones in the series. I don't count Deathly Hallows as one though : /

[Cerek]

I DO plan to rent the movies (at least) and watch them sometime so I'll have a better knowledge of what is going on. I liked the Half-Blood Prince even though I knew practically nothing of the back story.

The movie I've seen most often was The Chamber of Secrets, because it happened to be on TV during my extended hospital stay in early 2008. It was also one of the movies I rented last year before going to see Half-Blood Prince.

I agree completely with your assessment of Harry seeming to be little more than an amateur wizard. That was understandable in the first couple of movies, but by now, he should be able to sling some serious spells and have a lot more confidence in his ability. Instead, Harry almost seems to view events from the reader or movie-goers perspective; he has very little confidence in his magical abilities (and it would seem rightly so), yet doesn't seem fazed by the prospect (or prophecy) that HE will have to be the one to face and defeat the greatest and most powerful evil wizard alive. When Dobbie is dying, he doesn't have a clue what to do, but apparently feels that lack of ability won't be a problem when he finally faces Voldemort because he knows he's going to win somehow.

I am just extremely disappointed (from a logical viewpoint) at his amazing LACK of ability, DESPITE his many years at Hogwarts now. Contrast that to the Last Airbender, for example.

Aing knows he is the Avatar and, despite his very young age, already has a strong mastery over Airbending. He struggles to learn Water-bending, which is only natural since he had not studied it at all before leaving, but at the end of the movie, he learns to just trust in his ability and is able to wield uber-power with control and confidence. Yeah, he learned Waterbending very quickly (relatively speaking), but he IS the prodigy born with the natural ability TO master all the elements - so again, it makes sense he would develop that mastery at a rapidly advanced pace.

Back to Harry: I know the arcane arts supposedly take years of study and practice to master, but Harry is supposed to be the prodigy with a natural ability far beyond that of his peers and even his teachers. After several years at Hogwarts, he should definitely be at least level 10-15 (in D&D terms), yet still looks like a 1st level wizard. The argument that even the prodigy still needs time to master the arts falls flat when a half-blood mage has become far more advanced in the same amount of time.

Like you said, if anyone shows actual signs of being the "Chosen One", it's Hermoine rather than Harry. Which brings me back to one of my original assessments...I can't help wondering if Rowling subconsciously wanted to make Hermoine the "Chosen One", but felt she had to follow the accepted tradition of given that label to a male figure. She has certainly made Hermoine more adept, skilled and confident than her two male counterparts combined, so it seems obvious she does want to "play up" the idea of women actually being more powerful than men.

All I know is that, unless Harry suddenly sheds his inherent bumbling attitude and whips out some world-stomping power in the final showdown with Voldemort, I'm gonna be left scratching my head thinking "Hermoine could have done that without breaking a sweat".

[Bungleau]

Actually, Harry's role as the Chosen One comes from him having been the only person who survived Voldemort attacking him. So it's less being Chosen from skill than from the fact that he's still alive.

I have been struck, however, by the fact that of Harry's generation of wizards, there's Hermione... and the rest of the world. No one of note.

Harry's father's generation, however... Snape, who corrected rewrote the potion book; Padfoot, Moony, Prongs, and Wormtail, who secretly mastered shapeshifting and created things like the Marauder's Map. Brilliant.

I'm in the process of rereading Deathly Hallows now, if the rest of my family will let me read in peace...

[SpiritWarrior]

Right, he "lucked out" even as a child, and avoided being slain by the "killing curse" (Power word: Die). But even this, was because of his Mother's sacrifice - not his.

And so, thorughout his wizarding life, people are consisitently telling him he is the chosen one, and dying for him etc.

There are some inherent bonuses he has against Voldermort (the wands being twinned, the blood being shared) but other than these, Harry is hardly prepared for a confrontation with the dark one. These small bonuses alone will not get him through that fight.

I mean, why didn't he bury his head in books like Hermione did as soon as he was told he would inevitably face him? That's what I would dedicate my time to. I'd also ask Hermoine to tutor me so I could learn faster and "on the fly"...I have this genius who is also my best friend constantly around me, yet I prefer to dance with her in a tent while our lives are in mortal danger. I'd turn off the radio, and demand she teach me how to petrify people.

[Larry_OHF]

Reading the books, I never envisioned a problem but now after seeing this latest movie and then seeing your reactions to it and the storyline in general...I've got a new perspective on the whole story and agree with everything you guys are saying. I never saw Harry as the weakling that he really is until now. I read the books but never made that connection. Nor did I see how strong Hermoine is and how dumb the whole situation is until now. Some really great critiques have been brought up here and I really appreciate your insights.

[Cerek]

Originally Posted by Larry_OHF Reading the books, I never envisioned a problem but now after seeing this latest movie and then seeing your reactions to it and the storyline in general...I've got a new perspective on the whole story and agree with everything you guys are saying. I never saw Harry as the weakling that he really is until now. I read the books but never made that connection. Nor did I see how strong Hermoine is and how dumb the whole situation is until now. Some really great critiques have been brought up here and I really appreciate your insights.

I suppose it helps that I have not read the books and, thus, had not been swayed by Rowlings explanations (or allowances) of why Harry has not advanced very much in his wizadry. Instead, I went into the movie thinking "Ok, Harry should have a pretty good selection of spells by now and be working on gaining and mastering the more epic spells available", only to see him ask Hermoine to do the mindwipe because "she has always been the best with spells." WTF? Shouldn't he be almost an arch-mage by now? Or at least have power along that level? Everything in the storyline indicates Voldemort is certainly at that level and is one of the most POWERFUL arch-mages alive. It's going to take a helluva lot more than a mid-level wizard with a decided LACK of spells to take someone like him out. My oldest son agrees with me. He has never read the books or watched the movies either, but he has played NWN for a couple of years now and become pretty good at making characters and understanding how things work in the AD&D world.

When Harry deferred to Hermoine in the cafe', I said out loud "Why is he relying on her to cast a spell? Isn't HE supposed to be the Chosen One with the world-shattering magical powers?" My son said "I was just about to ask the same thing."

So, tonight, we went to the local video store and rented the first two movies. It was MUCH more along the lines of what I expected. Hermoine already had a pretty impressive list of spells for a first-year student (improving Harry's eyesight on the train {not really sure what spell that would be}, casting Flame {or perhaps Burning Hands} on Snape's cloak, Knock {on the 3rd floor door}, Searing Light {on the Death Trap vine} and Hold Person {on Neville}) Overall, pretty dang impressive for an 11-yr old half-blood witch.

But Harry and Ron had their strong points as well. Harry showed the innate courage and leadership in the bathroom against the Mountain Troll and Ron managed to get the levitation spell right at the most critical time. Ron was also the only one smart enough to get them across the chessboard. So each member made a significant contribution to the team that the others could not have done. THAT is what I would expect from these three. I've seen the Chamber of Secrets more than the other movies. By the time they reach the Deathly Hallows, though, Hermoine is doing almost ALL of the heavy work (planning for every circumstance, porting them to safety every time (except one), providing almost ALL the spells and protections to keep them safe along the way, etc. By contrast, Harry and Ron act as little more than dead weight 90% of the time. And when Hermoine needs them most, Ron is powerless to muster decent emotion and Harry is too distracted to even notice Hermoine's screams. Seriously? This is the thanks she gets for saving their ASS over and over?

I've seen Chamber of Secrets a couple of times, but will be watching it again tomorrow with a fresh perspective. I'll continue my critique' of the movies (and the overall plot) then.