Cloudy's Cafe, a conversation Zone, 10-2902 - Page 13

antryg · 11-01-2002, 01:39 PM

Kaltia-
Since you brought it up (and to avoid the Christmas rush) I'll explain how we really ended up with the dates for Christmas and Easter.
You must first understand that in the 1st century A.D. most Christians came from a philosophical viewpoint that was more Eastern than Greek, ie. events/life were cyclical in nature rather than linear. Important events such as the beginnings of life and death were linked and thus were represented to occur on the same day. The angels announcement to Mary that she was "with child" was Jesus beginning. (Side Issue/Massive Arguement: This is a historical note that shows the early church view that life begins with conception.)
Now is where we can really confuse people who are not already passed out from boredom. The early church didn't celebrate the birth of Christ at all, the attention was all upon Easter. One group of Christians determined that the Annuciation came on the historical date of (in our calendar) March 25th and thus began to celebrate Easter as a fixed holiday on that date. This group was known as Quatrodecimanians. (Boy that's fun to say!) At this time each group of Christians pretty much did their own thing. There was no codified Bible or any official holidays. A couple of hundred years later the Council of Nicea was where everyone reached consensus. Easter became a floating holiday tied to Passoverand Jesus birthday became 9 months after conception/death (March 25th) and thus Christmas (December 25). Thats also why shepherds sleeping outside etc. doesn't make sense. It was early Spring not midWinter. There you have, holiday by committee. For those of you trying to go to sleep; I hope this helps.

Sio · 11-01-2002, 02:09 PM

Noooooo I gotta go to work in a few mins

bloody work!!!!
I suppose it will seem worth it when I get my chipped Panasonic Gamecube from Japan in 5 weeks though

hehe

Sigmar · 11-01-2002, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sio:
I suppose it will seem worth it when I get my chipped Panasonic Gamecube from Japan in 5 weeks though hehe

Well I suppose I can be thankful for my plain old Gamecube, still a cool chrome dvd playing console like the Q would be great you lucky person you

Got any games lined up for it?

Kaltia · 11-01-2002, 05:12 PM

Lord, 'tis Sigmar!

Antryg, i'm talking about the pagan origins: from about the same time stonehenge, which is rougly 3,000 years ago, give or take five centuries.

Calaethis Dragonsbane · 11-01-2002, 06:08 PM

Slow tonight eh? lol, is anyone on at all? [img]tongue.gif[/img]

antryg · 11-01-2002, 06:21 PM

Kat-
I just couldn't pass up a chance to talk about Quatrodecimanians. It is fun to say and rolls off the tongue. Try it. Believe it or not I am also pretty familiar with druid worship (in general) and American Wiccan practices, and understodd where you were going with your comments. If you want to go farther afield maybe you would like to see my paper comparing the peyote ritual of the American Native Religion to the Christian Eucharist. If you are indeed Wiccan I understand your problem with the European and American Halloween traditions.

Sir Goulum · 11-01-2002, 06:23 PM

G'Afternoon, all! [img]graemlins/wavey.gif[/img]

Calaethis Dragonsbane · 11-01-2002, 06:55 PM

Hi Sir G. how are you?

Sir Goulum · 11-01-2002, 06:56 PM

Fat and plump from candy. You?

True_Moose · 11-01-2002, 06:59 PM

New signature again Sir G? LOL [img]tongue.gif[/img]

So, the Flames won last night *hops around in glee.*

11-01-2002, 01:39 PM	#121
antryg Fzoul Chembryl Join Date: August 30, 2002 Location: Dallas, Tx. Age: 21 Posts: 1,765	Kaltia- Since you brought it up (and to avoid the Christmas rush) I'll explain how we really ended up with the dates for Christmas and Easter. You must first understand that in the 1st century A.D. most Christians came from a philosophical viewpoint that was more Eastern than Greek, ie. events/life were cyclical in nature rather than linear. Important events such as the beginnings of life and death were linked and thus were represented to occur on the same day. The angels announcement to Mary that she was "with child" was Jesus beginning. (Side Issue/Massive Arguement: This is a historical note that shows the early church view that life begins with conception.) Now is where we can really confuse people who are not already passed out from boredom. The early church didn't celebrate the birth of Christ at all, the attention was all upon Easter. One group of Christians determined that the Annuciation came on the historical date of (in our calendar) March 25th and thus began to celebrate Easter as a fixed holiday on that date. This group was known as Quatrodecimanians. (Boy that's fun to say!) At this time each group of Christians pretty much did their own thing. There was no codified Bible or any official holidays. A couple of hundred years later the Council of Nicea was where everyone reached consensus. Easter became a floating holiday tied to Passoverand Jesus birthday became 9 months after conception/death (March 25th) and thus Christmas (December 25). Thats also why shepherds sleeping outside etc. doesn't make sense. It was early Spring not midWinter. There you have, holiday by committee. For those of you trying to go to sleep; I hope this helps. __________________

11-01-2002, 02:09 PM	#122
Sio Avatar Join Date: September 17, 2002 Location: UK Age: 38 Posts: 546	Noooooo I gotta go to work in a few mins bloody work!!!! I suppose it will seem worth it when I get my chipped Panasonic Gamecube from Japan in 5 weeks though hehe __________________ ICCT HEdral Phillip 4Glass Orchestration<br /> [img]\"http://members.lycos.co.uk/deatbringer/sio-sig1.jpg\" alt=\" - \" />

11-01-2002, 06:21 PM	#126
antryg Fzoul Chembryl Join Date: August 30, 2002 Location: Dallas, Tx. Age: 21 Posts: 1,765	Kat- I just couldn't pass up a chance to talk about Quatrodecimanians. It is fun to say and rolls off the tongue. Try it. Believe it or not I am also pretty familiar with druid worship (in general) and American Wiccan practices, and understodd where you were going with your comments. If you want to go farther afield maybe you would like to see my paper comparing the peyote ritual of the American Native Religion to the Christian Eucharist. If you are indeed Wiccan I understand your problem with the European and American Halloween traditions. __________________

11-01-2002, 06:59 PM	#130
True_Moose Gold Dragon Join Date: June 18, 2002 Location: Wolfville, NS / Calgary, AB Age: 37 Posts: 2,563	New signature again Sir G? LOL [img]tongue.gif[/img] So, the Flames won last night hops around in glee. __________________ [img]\"http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f13/true_moose/Siggy.jpg\" alt=\" - \" />

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11-01-2002, 05:12 PM	#124
Kaltia Jack Burton Join Date: May 2, 2002 Location: Canterbury, England Age: 37 Posts: 5,817	Lord, 'tis Sigmar! Antryg, i'm talking about the pagan origins: from about the same time stonehenge, which is rougly 3,000 years ago, give or take five centuries.

11-01-2002, 06:08 PM	#125
Calaethis Dragonsbane Legion Symbol Join Date: May 29, 2002 Location: Somewhere in between Age: 39 Posts: 7,029	Slow tonight eh? lol, is anyone on at all? [img]tongue.gif[/img]

11-01-2002, 06:23 PM	#127
Sir Goulum John Locke Join Date: February 7, 2002 Location: Edmonton, Canada Age: 35 Posts: 8,985	G'Afternoon, all! [img]graemlins/wavey.gif[/img]

11-01-2002, 06:55 PM	#128
Calaethis Dragonsbane Legion Symbol Join Date: May 29, 2002 Location: Somewhere in between Age: 39 Posts: 7,029	Hi Sir G. how are you?

11-01-2002, 06:56 PM	#129
Sir Goulum John Locke Join Date: February 7, 2002 Location: Edmonton, Canada Age: 35 Posts: 8,985	Fat and plump from candy. You?

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