X-Men!!! Oh man, I just saw the 12:01am session tonight!!

[Olorin]

On a sidenote: anyone else seen the new X-Men: Evolution cartoon on Cartoon network?

On the raging debate over the spec ops attack:

I think that there are good points on both sides, but I imagine that any charges against Wolverine would be dropped if Stryker's files came to light. Wolverine can claim self-defense and defense of others to unknown and armed invaders; who incidentally do not bother to identify themselves. The other problem with the whole scenario is that Stryker was the one who orchestrated the attack on the President, so he knew full well that the Institute was not a terrorist threat, he wanted to get to Cerebro.

I'm not a lawyer, but I know enough about politics to know that Wolverine would never be brought up on charges over this, since the government would come out looking decidely like the villians in this case.


On the other hand, I think the destruction of Cerebro would be a good idea. A machine that a powerful telepathic can use to can anyone or everyone in the world? In a world where such a person can be mind-controlled by other mutants? It's not enough to be sure that Xavier would never use Cerebro to kill people, not if he can be controlled by someone else.

Of course in the world of X-Men, such worries are pointless, since the good guys will always manage to save the world at the last second anyway [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Bungleau]

Okay, I've been putting off reading this thread until I saw the movie, 'cause I thought it would be rife with spoilers. Was I right!

So, if anyone's reading this far, you're already up to your neck in spoiler quicksand. Hit your backbutton or accept your fate

My thoughts:

Cool scenes:
- Nightcrawler saving Rogue...
- Wolverine slicing and dicing during the invasion...
- Kitty licking Wolverine's claws...
- Jean Grey controlling water and energy at the end...
- Mystique in anything... consarn that John Stamos [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]
- Wolverine and Cyclops both grieving at the end
- Wolverine passing the soda to Rogue's boyfriend (iceman?) to chill it
- Mystique sneaking some iron in to Magneto, and Magneto extracting it :shooter7:

Overdone things:
- Pyro's blow-up. Don't you think one cop would have shot him by the fourth or fifth fireball? It's not like he was protected...
- Wolverine telling Cyclops that Jean made a choice... Cyclops. Fat lot of good it did right then [img]graemlins/troutslap.gif[/img]
- Stryker's final moments... for what, the third time? First Wolverine, then Magneto, then Wolverine again... and let's be real, you don't know if he's gone or not...
- The Magneto/Mystique inside-joke stuff at the end. Can you say grade school?
- Rogue's BF's (iceman's?) family's reaction to learning he's a mutant. Wonder how closely that relates to other revelations (gay, etc.).
- The scale of Stryker's military operations and the lack of leaks. Don't you think that with that many people involved, someone else would know what's going on?

I really enjoyed the movie... had to go to the [img]graemlins/toilet.gif[/img] before it started, and by the time it was over, I could barely walk... thank Kerah I was the first one into the [img]graemlins/toilet.gif[/img] , 'cause by the time I left, there was a long line...

And I agree with TL -- the home invasion thing was chilling. It's a short step from that to "You're a terrorist -- prepare to die. We'll find the proof later."

But I also have to agree with Wolverine's response, as justified excellently by... MagiK? Hearing the bootsteps, smelling the oil... and he was there to protect the children, remember? Mess with my cubs, willya?

Personally, if someone comes into my house in the middle of the night and fails to identify themselves as officers of the law (or other body I should respect), I am not going to be gentle with them... [img]graemlins/shooter04.gif[/img]

Great movie overall, and I'd give it an 8 out of 10. Definite re-watchability, if only to look for the other mutants hidden in there...

[the mighty stamar]

I enjoyed reading everyones opinions on wolverine killing people.

At its best the X men series was an analogy to gay rights, to racial profiling, terrorists, etc.

It brings up a lot of subjects that have no right or wrong answer. Which is cool. The X men are outlaws they are not the super friends. So whenever I was reading comic books they were a step deeper.

Anyhow Im ready for the next movie definitely. I also think there will be a Wolverine movie, that is just theory though.

PS in the comic books, wolverine is 5'3". The movie version was cast a much more 'dreamy' actor who was tall. They did make him hairier though at least.

[Vaskez]

Originally posted by Olorin: On a sidenote: anyone else seen the new X-Men: Evolution cartoon on Cartoon network?

Yeah to keep up my sadness level, I've watched every episode
They stopped broadcasting for a few months didn't they?

Evolution isn't as good as the old animated series, but I did like the episodes when the world first finds out about mutants.

[Mr. Mopery]

I read an interview with Hugh Jackman (Wolverine) saying that, in the 1st film, he came into it a week after filming started and that he had trouble finding the character. After the film he listened to what some fans had to say and he said that what stuck out was "more berzerker rage."

So he decided to add some berzerker rage this time around. Damn right he did. I agree, though, that he's a bit tall for the part but who would they get to play him? Seth Green? Danny DeVito? Eh, Bub?

One more thing...thank you Mr. Singer and Mr. Cummings for adding a blue, "Bamfing" character with a bit of depth. And he did the accent well! Much appreciated.

[Cerek the Barbaric]

Originally posted by the mighty stamar: PS in the comic books, wolverine is 5'3". The movie version was cast a much more 'dreamy' actor who was tall. They did make him hairier though at least.

You can't really fault the movie for that. In the comics, Wolvie seemed to "grow" in size as his popularity grew. In the early 90's, he was being drawn almost as large as the other X-Men - a definite deviation from the original character concept.

To get back to the "strongest mutant" debate.......

Rogue is strong, but she only has partial invulnerability. It's never been fully explained. The bottom line is that it is hard to hurt her, but she isn't completely immune to physical damage.

Colossus (when in steel form) is easily as strong as Rogue - and possibly stronger. He is also more completely immune to damage than Rogue is. In his steel form, there is almost nothng that can hurt him.

Juggernaut (yeah, I know, he isn't "really" a mutant..but what the heck) is physically stronger than Rogue OR Colossus and has almost complete invulnerability. He has gone toe-to-toe with Thor and held his own.

Now then - if you want to talk about who is hardest to kill - it would have to be Wolverine (or Sabretooth). Thier healing factor repairs any damage done to them. The more severe the damage, the longer the healing takes....but they are going to be getting back up and coming back at you as soon as the damage is healed. With Rogue, Colossus, or Juggernaut - if you ever find a way to kill them...they would NOT be coming back.

As far as sheer power goes (not just physical strength), the comics have traditionally conceded that Professor X and Magneto are the two most powerful mutants alive. Neither of them uses their powers to the fullest potential possible (although Magneto uses less restraint than Professor). Apocalypse is very powerful also, but he is not unbeatable.

And of course, there is one other mutant we've left out of this discussion entirely - even though it appears they will be a central figure in X3.

Who is the most powerful mutant of all time? It would have to be

PHEONIX

Her powers were almost limitless. She saved an entire universe singlehandedly and (as Dark Pheonix) destroyed an entire planet with a single thought. Her mental powers were easily equal to Professor Xaviers and her telekenetic powers simply had no limits on them.

So Pheonix would get my vote as the most powerful mutant of all time.

[Davros]

Man - I never knew I had so many geeks for friends [img]smile.gif[/img]

I am only 1 week into this X-Men thing, so I can perhaps explain away my nerdiness as a passing phase .

Have fun guys and gals - play nice .

[Grojlach]

Psst Cerek, it's spelled "Phoenix".

After reading TL's reasoning I think he didn't really make his case. Waco was an example of how NOT to use Federal power, as was Ruby Ridge and the Elian Gonzalas case. Those were instances where the Justice department ran roughshod over the rule of law. In Waco if they thought ol Jimboy was doing something wrong they should have picked him up, not torched the entire compound. Rubyridge..they shot an innocent woman to get at the man, Elien....well that was just F'd up all the way around. As far as I know...there is no law against owning an SR-71 knockoff. I know several people who have built their own high performance jets....they don't have the avionics of military craft but thats due to economics. You may also possess military grade weapons, there are no constitutional prohibitions stating that you may bear arms as long as the military has better ones. And in fact the US government allows citizens to own military grade hardware....you just have to bribe/pay through the nose for the license through the ATF.

While the President may have had the legal authority to round up certain individuals, In the case against Xavier and the school, there was no reason to go after them..it was not School faculty nor students that attacked the white house and the people at the school had done nothing wrong.

Secret passages and compartments are not illegal in your house. Though you usually have to have accurate archetectural documents filed ...which I think is a load of crap..why does the government have the right to know how you lay out the interior of your home?.....oh so many tangled webs...

As for most powerful mutant...Was Phoenix really a mutant? or just an alien "cosmic being" I think they eventually tied the phoenix force to the Beyonder at one point.... But anyone who can kick Galactus' ass is definately a Uber powerful being.