What is your view on China?

[Paladin2000]

Just curious Ong, do you read/write Chinese (or Mandarin if you prefer)?

Oh, thanks for pointing our the error in my previous post.

[Avatar]

Well let's see: couple of thousands in Vietnam (still counting from the chemical waste u dumped over the country), ooooo the 2 nukes u emptied over Japan that's near millions, ummm plus the civilians u kill in ur heroic bombing campaigns!

At least we stick to our own country!

[K T Ong]

Originally posted by Paladin2000: Just curious Ong, do you read/write Chinese (or Mandarin if you prefer)? Oh, thanks for pointing our the error in my previous post.

You're welcome. [img]smile.gif[/img]

And yes, I read and write Chinese. Why?

Originally posted by Djinn Raffo: And soon enough they will be Going To The Moon

Well, if, as the article predicts, the Chinese were to go to Mars someday, and if there were Martians and the Chinese did to them what the Europeans did to Native Americans in the past, you can be quite sure I would not feel proud about being Chinese anymore.

[ 08-27-2002, 07:50 AM: Message edited by: K T Ong ]

[johnny]

Originally posted by Avatar: Well let's see: couple of thousands in Vietnam (still counting from the chemical waste u dumped over the country), ooooo the 2 nukes u emptied over Japan that's near millions, ummm plus the civilians u kill in ur heroic bombing campaigns! At least we stick to our own country!

I thought this was a thread about peoples views on China ? Where did you come up with Vietnam and Japan ?

[K T Ong]

Originally posted by johnny: I thought this was a thread about peoples views on China ? Where did you come up with Vietnam and Japan ?

If you go back a few posts on this thread, MagiK and I had a bit of a debate on American vs Chinese records on human rights, in which I brought up the Vietnam War. I believe Avatar is referring to that.

BTW, Japanese culture has a few lovely things, too.

[Avatar]

Originally posted by johnny: quote: Originally posted by Avatar: Well let's see: couple of thousands in Vietnam (still counting from the chemical waste u dumped over the country), ooooo the 2 nukes u emptied over Japan that's near millions, ummm plus the civilians u kill in ur heroic bombing campaigns! At least we stick to our own country!

I thought this was a thread about peoples views on China ? Where did you come up with Vietnam and Japan ?[/QUOTE]yup yup, MagiK graced us with a comparison of chinese and american human rights records and i thought i would just remind him of his country's records.

Originally posted by Avatar: Well let's see: couple of thousands in Vietnam (still counting from the chemical waste u dumped over the country) At the time, the people of SOUTHERN Vietnam wanted us there, you see they were being invaded by their communist neighbors/countrymen to the north, yes there were political motives and financial motives but in the end, if the government of SOUTHERN Vietnam had not wanted us there we wouldnt have been there. And it was the tactics used by the NVA, their Chinese allies and their Russian supporters that were just as much responsible for how things were conducted there...can you say "strap a grenade to your baby and send it out to the nice soldiers?" sure..I knew ya could. Can you say Sneak attacks then run back accross the boarder to Laos? Or how about lets put all our military stockpiles and supplies in the middle of a civilian population center? There is/was enough blame to go round for that little fracas in the Nam's...I will point out that it wasnt China, Russia or North Vietnam that spent BILLIONS in developing precision weapons to be used so as to minimize civilian casualties. It is a matter of record that many American lives were lost due to its attempts to minimize civilian casulties. , ooooo the 2 nukes u emptied over Japan that's near millions, ummm plus the civilians u kill in ur heroic bombing campaigns! Point #1. All told BOTH dukes in Japan had less than 150,000 casualties total...no where near "millions". Point #2. The fire bombing of Dresden and Tokyo killed far more. Point #3. I do believe that on December 7 1941 it was Japan and not the USA that started that little conflict with the USA Not to mention their alliance with and backing of Nazi Germany. Point #4. It was the fanatical defense and civilian suicides in Okinawa that forced the US president to decide to drop those two bombs. A conventional assault would have cost both Japan and the USA far greater casualties. Point #6. the cruel and inhumane treatment of American POWS by the Japanese ensured that there would be little thought put into how they felt about being "nuked" Point #7. It doesnt matter if you are nuked to death, firebombed to death or napalmed to death or anything else to death...your still dead. Those two bombs were nothing but more efficient than conventional arms. At least we stick to our own country! TIBET TAIWAN KOREA VIETNAM

History is told by the victors no doubt, however I have read enough about the conflicts you mention to have a fair idea of what whent on, as well as having a number of family members who were present in WW2, Korea and or Vietnam...as Im sure you may as well. The end result is that at least the US tries and some times sacrifices its own to try and keep as many "innocents" from harm as possible...and it is usually (almost always) her foes that try to use the innocents as shields.

[ 08-27-2002, 09:26 AM: Message edited by: MagiK ]

Originally posted by Avatar: quote: Originally posted by johnny: quote: Originally posted by Avatar: Well let's see: couple of thousands in Vietnam (still counting from the chemical waste u dumped over the country), ooooo the 2 nukes u emptied over Japan that's near millions, ummm plus the civilians u kill in ur heroic bombing campaigns! At least we stick to our own country!

I thought this was a thread about peoples views on China ? Where did you come up with Vietnam and Japan ?[/QUOTE]yup yup, MagiK graced us with a comparison of chinese and american human rights records and i thought i would just remind him of his country's records.[/QUOTE] With some inaccurate speculations I might add. [img]smile.gif[/img] I never claimed the US to be saintly, but I do know our record is far better than Chinas [img]smile.gif[/img] And I do not blame the "peoples" of China so much as their totalitarian dictatorial socialist government". You don't like the US andthats fine but I at least try to get it right when talking about the other country...I said try (no one is perfect)

[ 08-27-2002, 09:30 AM: Message edited by: MagiK ]

[Avatar]

Originally posted by MagiK: TIBET ... just in case you haven't looked at a map for the past few decades "tibet" is in China. If you want to argue that I am quite happy to bring up Okinawa, S.Korea, Hawaii...etc. TAIWAN ... yup yup I apologise for the millions massacred there! eh WHAT?! Chinese troops have never landed on Taiwan let alone civilians. KOREA ... ummm and what about the American troops? VIETNAM ... what about it? You were there, we weren't.

Just for the record, untill this debate, I never even thought about China's participation in Korea and Vietnam when China was mentioned...(see my first list of things that I thought about China)Now I remember Many civilian US airmen giving their lives to try and save China from Japan and all the aid that was sent....lovely how those kind gestures are remembered and repaid...the idea was to try and stop national aggression and expansionism...or so the theory goes.

On a different front..Has any of the Chinese Natives on this board seen the Discovery Channel's (or was it the History Channel's) Special on the Great Wall?
I was wondering what you might have thought of the special and wether you thought it was well done.

[ 08-27-2002, 09:37 AM: Message edited by: MagiK ]