Your perception of world leaders.

[Leonis]

(I thought about whether this shoud go in the war forum, but it's not really about war, so...)

I was talking with a mate the other day how we take for granted our perceptions of the world leaders involved in current issues.

For example (and bear with me before breaking out the crucifixs), If I honestly believe Saddam Hussein is a threat to my world, where have I gained this perception? From the media of course. But which media?

There's not much news about that he's a really nice guy with only the best intentions - except from his own country.
Any leader could be forgiven for getting fiesty when they're sure they're going to be attacked by the most powerful forces on the planet.

What I'm getting at is that I don't know him, nor anyone who's met him. So I only have the media to go by.

Same goes for George Bush. And John Howard (although I do know people who've met him) and Tony Blair etc...

We have to make our judgements on these situations almost entirely based on biased (in one way or another and not necessarily wrong) media reports.

I've made mistakes about people I've known for years...

Now, I do live in Australia, so can make a more educated opinion due to the effects the leader causes on my own life.
I also am able to speak to trusted family and friends in the USA and the UK and use their opinions to filter the media. These observation can then be applied to current situations and a clearer picture is gained.

Ok, so if I believe on different levels, that regardless of the methods, these leaders are addressing a real problem; where does that leave me with Saddam/Iraq?

I've known 3 Iraqis. Each one was really nice, friendly, unimposing. Each one had lost dearly loved family members in the gulf war. These were elderly civilians not soldiers.

I sat next to one girl, crying her heart out, telling a cousin on the phone that their Grandmother's house had been blown apart with her in it.

This is my only personal experience of Iraq. Saddness, pain, loss. (I know cause and effect - if Iraq hadn't invaded Kuwait, no civilians would have died. What about all the Kurds etc...)

Looking at North Korea, it's an even darker picture. I know very little even from the media. However I have studied with many South Korean youths who seem very beatiful and loving people - who do whatever they can to avoid national service...

I guess what I'm trying to say is that their are innocent and guilty parties on both sides. But it's hard to wade through the masses of information to find something true, something that gives a peace of mind about the whole mess.

EDIT: I've just realised what a rambling piece of vaugeness this is. Sorry, just trying to work some things out.

[ 01-30-2003, 07:27 PM: Message edited by: Leonis ]

[Animal]

What about Jean Chretien? What about Canada?

My own feelings, pretty much all world leader these days are only interested in their own personal agenda's and their own pockets.

I don't really care for Bush much, I think he's using the media as a tool to justify his actions.
It seems that Tony Blair does whatever Bush says. He kinda reminds me of that Kibbles and Bits commercial, with the big bulldog walking down the sidewalk and the smaller tiny dog jumping back and forth over the bulldog the entire time.
Kim Jong, although I'm not terribly familiar with him, seems to be your typical dictator much as Saddam Hussein, but I think the majority of their actions against the rest of world in general stems from actions of the US and its companions. Back anyone into a corner and they'll come out swinging.
Jean Chretien is pretty much a moron as far as I'm concerned. We have the resources and technology to be the most powerful country in the world, and what do we do with it? Piss it away.
It would be nice to see a leader for once who is genuinely concerned with the well being of his country. Short of Churchill, I can't remember when the last politician actually fit that description.

[ 01-30-2003, 07:36 PM: Message edited by: Animal ]

[The Hierophant]

The bottom line is that benevolent ideology and the trappings of power simply don't mix. Once a person gains the power and authority to order the lives of others, they are essentially forced by their own ambition to do what it takes to hold on to such power. Subterfuge, propaganda, token kindness, use of coercive force, they're all necessary parts of being the head MF in charge. Sometimes one might feel that it makes life easier to just go along with what leaders say, to not make waves and simply assume that they know what's best for you. But putting all of one's trust in someone who openly seeks and wants the power of authority over you simply isn't wise, and alot of the time people that blindly follow their leaders sadly become little more than political and productive tools, serving the individual leaders who have no qualms with using people in such a way.
There are plenty of 'leftists' and 'rightists', 'militants' and 'pacifists', 'extremists' and 'moderates' in the world today. But sadly the population of humans is declining rapidly.

ps: don't worry Leonis, I'm ranting too.

[ 01-31-2003, 09:01 AM: Message edited by: The Hierophant ]

[The Hierophant]

Originally posted by Animal: It would be nice to see a leader for once who is genuinely concerned with the well being of his country. Short of Churchill, I can't remember when the last politician actually fit that description.

What are you waiting for Animal? Your people need someone who cares about them. Leaders are made, not born, you can make the difference if it's what you really want to do. Seriously.

[ 01-30-2003, 08:02 PM: Message edited by: The Hierophant ]

[Jeffi0]

Originally posted by Animal: What about Jean Chretien? What about Canada?

Nobody cares.

[homer]

Originally posted by The Hierophant: There are plenty of 'leftists' and 'rightists', 'militants' and 'pacifists', 'extremists' and 'moderates' in the world today. But sadly the population of humans is declining rapidly.

Very well put and unfortunately true.

[sylent]

Sadly too many people base their opinions of world leaders on what the media show us... you will be hard pressed to find a non-emotive, non-biased report in your local newspaper. I saw one thing the other day which just made me laugh out loud. It was a report the morning after Bush's big speech, and had a big front page article... Bush wearing glasses and weilding a pen (clearly and intelectual), and a comparitive photo of Saddam Hussain pointing a gun wildly in the air. Both pictures had nothing to do with the events, and probably weren't even recently taken, but people who see that will think that was is the answer.

Sorry if thats a bit too largely based around the war issue.

You've got a good point Hierophant, that we have to put our faith in someone who wants power, and will do what he thinks meets public expectation simply to keep his position. I find it frightening that one person can have that sort of power over the direction of the world.

I'm also going to add that I don't know any of the people I have just spoke about, and my perceptions are unfortunately also based on the media, and what I see on TV, and read in the newspapers. (this aint a poor saddam post)

[Sir Krustin]

Originally posted by Jeffi0: quote: Originally posted by Animal: What about Jean Chretien? What about Canada?

Nobody cares. [/QUOTE]Actually, myself and quite a few other people (such as our esteemed Animal [img]smile.gif[/img] ) do care - the problem is, there are a lot more people who not only don't care they actually think the loser's actually doing a good job!

I had this discussion with a few friends, and they really think he's done great and deserves to be kept in office. After quizzing them, I discover their approval stems from his giving the states "the finger". I can talk about underfunding the military, or pissing away our tax dollars on bs like bill C68 (which is sure to be repealed, btw) but they just don't think it's important as long as the medical and social welfare benefits keep rolling in. sigh. [img]graemlins/1ponder.gif[/img]

[sylent]

Originally posted by Sir Krustin: Originally posted by Jeffi0: giving the states "the finger

Now there's an idea you don't often see publicly voiced.

[ 01-31-2003, 08:16 AM: Message edited by: sylent ]