Aide: Saddam Did Get Rid of Iraq WMD

[Larry_OHF]

Hey, has something in the news changed? I saw live footage of white people running out of a building with sleeves across their faces and women in panic like it was the end of the world, then on the other TV, the sound was down, but the words read across the screen that somebody had found a Nuke plant in the East and they had air-photos.

What was all that?

[Cerek the Barbaric]

Originally posted by Moiraine: Cerek, I would like to add a couple of things. In my analogy, OK, you have heard him say some threats across the fence, and later you have noticed strange trucks bringing stuff to his house, and that aroused your suspiscions. And if the police said they would come again next Saturday, that is most probably because they haven't collected - yet - all the informations they needed, because maybe some rooms were locked or some of the neighbour's family wasn't there at the time. . So there, in that case, do you wait until Saturday for the trained policemen to do their job, or do you decide to act on your suspiscions ? ... And in Larry's analogy, it is not any guy who said the guy is bluffing, it is a policeman - that is, a peacekeeping trained officer. Don't you trust a policeman's accuracy and training ? More generally, in a nowadays society, can a citizen act upon another based on what he perceives as a threat, or must he not handle the matter to the State peacekeeping force ?

Touche' [img]graemlins/laugh3.gif[/img]

[Animal]

Originally posted by Larry_OHF: If a man is on a bus and says, "I have a bomb and this whole freaking bus is going down in flames if you do not cooperate, then a person jumps him as he is making his speech and kills him, then we learn that the would-be terrorist was only carrying a coke bottle...the would-be hero is still considered received with warm embraces, even if there was no real danger. Isn't this kinda the same, but to a larger degree? That is what I am getting out of the topic so far. If I am wrong, point me in the right direction to see another point of view.

Let's not forget about the innocent people on the bus who were killed while the would-be hero was grandstanding.

A bit of an apples and oranges analogy, especially considering the would-be terrorist claimed he didn't have a bomb.

The would be terrorst claims he doesn't have a bomb, the bus driver searched him and couldn't find one, so the hero decides to kick his ass anyway, but unfortunately half the people on the bus get killed in the process?

[pritchke]

Originally posted by Larry_OHF: If a man is on a bus and says, "I have a bomb and this whole freaking bus is going down in flames if you do not cooperate, then a person jumps him as he is making his speech and kills him, then we learn that the would-be terrorist was only carrying a coke bottle...the would-be hero is still considered received with warm embraces, even if there was no real danger. Isn't this kinda the same, but to a larger degree? That is what I am getting out of the topic so far. If I am wrong, point me in the right direction to see another point of view.

Actually what would likely happen either with the bottle or the bomb is that the police would come and say hmm, you got the terrorist but now we have to take you in and charge you with murder because that is the law. Then during the court case you pray to God that the judge is in a good mood and will let you go. That is reality, and reality bites.

[ 08-05-2003, 02:11 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

[Skunk]

Originally posted by Larry_OHF: If a man is on a bus and says, "I have a bomb and this whole freaking bus is going down in flames if you do not cooperate, then a person jumps him as he is making his speech and kills him, then we learn that the would-be terrorist was only carrying a coke bottle...the would-be hero is still considered received with warm embraces, even if there was no real danger. Isn't this kinda the same, but to a larger degree? That is what I am getting out of the topic so far. If I am wrong, point me in the right direction to see another point of view.

Not really.
What happened here was that a known and convicted criminal is released from prison and boarded a bus.
A policeman recognises him and accuses him of having a gun.
The man denies it.
The policeman asks clergyman sitting next to him to search him. The clergyman finds nothing.
The policeman opens fire and kills the man (and accidently wounds the one behind him). The policeman then begins to search the body for a gun.

Fifteen minutes later, the policeman is still searching the body for the gun muttering "I know you've got one somewhere", then stops and turns to the passengers and says: "The gun doesn't matter, I'll probably find it later. But be glad because he deserved it!"

The wounded man doesn't agree - and I'm not sure that I blame him.

[Timber Loftis]

Felix, I think politicians should be forced to pound sand for 6 hours a day no matter what -- the best lawmakers are those who don't make laws.

Anyway, I'm dubious as to this, but hopeful. Hopeful, because it solves all (or most) problems. It allows those who supported the war to keep face -- there is nothing wrong with believing Saddam had weapons when he signed papers saying he did and then did not show evidence of destroying them -- AND was so duplicitous about it all. It allows us to quit fearing former Iraqi WMD fell into the hands of guys with names like "Ahzik Takil Amah Riken."

However, now that we're in nation-building mode, we are stuck with our troops therre. While I wish every single beleaguered one could come home today, I think we have a duty to set up the foundations for a country in Iraq now that we've overrun it.

Again, I am dubious. But, I am hopeful.