A question of re-incarnation

[Fljotsdale]

Hm. Interesting replies - but none of 'em actually really answer the questions so far, so maybe I wasn't specific enough. I'm going back up to modify original post and add extra points..!

------------------




[This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 05-25-2001).]

[Fljotsdale]

Lady Avalon, I've read your response very carefully now; and I do hope you don't get offended by this 'cos I DO like you (!! ), but I found the quotes from Sylvia Browne incredibly negative. They seem to leave this everyday world we live in as a place of no-hope.
It is like the belief in heaven - the terrible things that happen in this world don't really matter 'cos it will all be made ok in the next. Sylvia Browne is saying the same but calling it a different name. (IMHO )

OK. Some people - far, FAR too many people - have only a 'next world' to believe in 'cos this one gives them nothing but grief.

BUT

And it is a very big but - this world is an amazingly beautiful and wonderful place. Should we carry on destroying it as though it doesn't matter? Should we carry on hating and killing and tormenting one another just so we can 'learn'? (I'm being very restrained here! I wanna yell! ) Where is the sense in that?
Where is the sense in constant 'repetition for emphasis' if all it does is make humanity in suffer! Look at all those people with Aids, look at all those people in war-torn countries, look at all the racial prejudice! You want to see that carry on so we can LEARN!?
We should be paying attention to helping people understand each other, tolerate each other, love each other - in THIS WORLD!

And what difference is there in perfection and peace on another plane of existence and perfection and peace on earth? If you're gonna be bored here, then you are sure gonna be bored there as well!

I'm gonna shuttup now, 'cos I'm in serious danger of losing my cool, lol!

Sorry if I offend, Lady Avalon. But I just seriously don't understand how people can believe in re-incarnation when you look at all the implications, and I WANT to understand your viewpoint even if I don't agree with it!

BTW, I know I have included some stuff in here mentioned in other posts, but it was relevant, I think
------------------




[This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 05-25-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 05-25-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 05-25-2001).]

[Lady Avalon]

Fljotsdale, I am sorry that you took what I said as being negative. The comments and quotes I made are certainly far from negative. In fact, I think they are very positive. I believe this world is a terrific place to be. We experience happiness and sadness here. I am so glad to be alive. I love my life here on earth. I'm not saying this to offend Fljotsdale, but it seems like you are saying you want to understand my point of view, but you have tunnel vision and don't seem like you really want to understand about reincarnation. I certainly know that a lot of people don't believe in reincarnation and I don't have a problem with that. All of us believe in different things, have different viewpoints and different opinions. We've all been brought up different and we've all gone through a lot of different situations throughout our life.

Another quote from Sylvia Browne: "The Dark Side are earth's true sociopaths, remorseless and amoral, valuing no life but their own. They see the rest of humanity as a vast sea of pawns to be played with, used, manipulated, and in some form or other, destroyed. Their destruction might be actual murder, or it might take the more insidious form of physical, emotional, or mental abuse. But the only way darkness can survive is to extinguish light, so The Dark Side feels entitled to whatever destruction they resort to. The Dark Side are criminals, in the eyes of the law or simply of decent society, who can't be rehabilitated, or had a social conscience to begin with. Among The Dark Side, nothing could be further from the truth.

"It would be convenient if The Dark Side would segregate itself, or wear matching outfits, or be born with horns and little pitchforks. But sadly, they're everywhere, looking just like everyone else. They can enter your life as a parent, a child, a sibling, a spouse, a boss, a friend, a lover, or even a political, religious, or spiritual leader you sincerely believe has the best interests of humanity at heart. The Dark Side can make themselves sound like God's closest personal friend if they think it will help disarm you.

"The truth, though, is that The Dark Side rejects God so completely that his constant, unconditional love has no impact on them. It is without question the most tragic unrequited love there is, with the most tragic, long-lasting consequences."



------------------


Seeker of Truth

[Fljotsdale]

Thank you for your further reply, Lady Avalon. You are partly right about my attitude, but also partly wrong, lol! I'm a sort of contradictory person, I guess.
I AM interested, quite genuinely, in the viewpoints of people who believe in an afterlife (of whatever sort). You see, I would really like to have that sort of belief. One part of me is actually very 'spiritual' in as much as I truly yearn for something... Not sure what. I want to explore the universe...
But the other half of me is VERY practical, down-to-earth, sensible. And I LOVE this earth. I love people, animals, insects... oh, everything alive, even things I'm scared of, like earwigs (bugs with lots of legs that look like little brown scorpions!). And I want this world to be a happy place. I want to see kids laughing and happy and safe and fulfilled... I want pie-in-the-sky, don't I?
And it makes me angry - VERY hot under the collar! - when various religions and beliefs see this earth just as some sort of testing ground... I really hate that.
Anyway, don't give up on me!
Keep posting...


------------------




[This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 05-25-2001).]

[Lady Avalon]

Fljotsdale, I love our discussions. I love this earth too, love people, animals, etc. I love being here.

------------------


Seeker of Truth

Originally posted by Fljotsdale: I've been reading over some of the threads and it struck me how many people seem to believe in re-incarnation. Many also think that each new incarnation teaches them something they need to know. Now, I am puzzled by a few things. 1)Since the vast majority of people never remember past lives, how can they possibly learn from them? 2)If we are learning anyway, whether we know it or not, how come we are still making the same mistakes the human race has ALWAYS made? 3)Surely, since humanity has been in existence for thousands and thousands of years, and we have all had countless re-incarnations to learn from - why haven't we even learned how to get along with each other? SURELY, with so many thousands of years of learning, this world should be a place of peace, happiness and security by now! 4)What is the point of lots of lives learning and re-learning stuff if it does no good to anyone but yourself? 5)If it is doing everyone so much good, then, newer souls or not, the majority of re-incarnated souls should be pretty darned well-educated by their past lives and able to teach and keep in check the newer ones. It ain't so. The human race seems to be getting worse, not better, and we are doing more damage than we ever did. WHERE is all the WISDOM we should have? I should be very interested to read your comments on these points!

1) I have experienced at least one of mine in a vision so I can't answer this one for you or ewven give you an opinion.

2)History has a way of repeating itself

3)People are weak (and greedy)

4) It can do good in the lives around you, even if you aren't aware of past mistakes vs the way you live this life, unless of course you are just born evil and enjoy making the world around you a miserable place to be.

5) Spend some time with the younger generation and you will see that the teens and children of today seem to be much wiser at an earlier age and alot more caring than kids were when I was young. Not to say that they are all good kids, there is evil in this world and there always will be as a balance to nature until things change drastically.

You say yourself that life is too short to bitch about...live your words~stop looking for the bad everywhere and open your eyes to the good and beauty that surrounds you in ways you are keeping yourself blind to. You might be pleasantly suprised.


Moni


------------------


[This message has been edited by Moni (edited 05-25-2001).]

[Fljotsdale]

Originally posted by Moni: [B5) Spend some time with the younger generation and you will see that the teens and children of today seem to be much wiser at an earlier age and alot more caring than kids were when I was young. Not to say that they are all good kids, there is evil in this world and there always will be as a balance to nature until things change drastically. You say yourself that life is too short to bitch about...live your words~stop looking for the bad everywhere and open your eyes to the good and beauty that surrounds you in ways you are keeping yourself blind to. You might be pleasantly suprised. Moni [/B]

Um. Moni? I spend quite a bit of time with teenagers!
And I am certainly NOT blind to the beauty of this earth - this wonderful planet and the life on it are part of the point I am making in my posts above, lol! I guess you just read the first post? I DON'T look for bad everywhere, Moni, quite the reverse, in fact. My family are always saying I live in a fantasy world where I see everything through rose-coloured spectacles. 'Tain't true, actually - only half of me does, lol! The other half is very down-to-earth. But I DO notice beauty all the time.

------------------

I did not mean to offend you, I know you do see the beauty in the world but do you let yourself be part of it?

I would really rather not sit here with you and trade misunderstood opinions and end up having you be mad but it seems to me like you may see the best, but you look for the worst, i.e. in your last response to me in the "Do you believe in the afterlife?" thread. I was insulted and felt like it would make you happy if we did just die and turn to nothing. I let it go then because I cannot change your point of view, only you can. My response would have been a little bit on the rude side but I felt it better to let it go rather than to have you encourage me to bring bad karma upon myself.

I did my testing of God with plenty of faith that the truth He showed me would be worth living for. To me, it is.

Respectfully,
Your Friend,
Moni

------------------

P.S. There are two things you should never discuss with friends...religion and politics. Opinions are bound to differ and someone usually gets upset.

Moni

[Fljotsdale]

Originally posted by Moni: I did not mean to offend you, I know you do see the beauty in the world but do you let yourself be part of it? I would really rather not sit here with you and trade misunderstood opinions and end up having you be mad but it seems to me like you may see the best, but you look for the worst, i.e. in your last response to me in the "Do you believe in the afterlife?" thread. I was insulted and felt like it would make you happy if we did just die and turn to nothing. I let it go then because I cannot change your point of view, only you can. My response would have been a little bit on the rude side but I felt it better to let it go rather than to have you encourage me to bring bad karma upon myself. I did my testing of God with plenty of faith that the truth He showed me would be worth living for. To me, it is. Respectfully, Your Friend, Moni

Moni!
I am truly sorry if I offended you I did not intend for that to happen, and I am not offended myself by ANYTHING people say to me with a good heart and genuineness. Yes, I DO get hot under the collar, but IT IS NOT PERSONAL! Please believe me! I like and respect you, Moni - and I sort of envy your belief, and the beliefs of others. Lady Avalon says I have tunnel vision and refuse to see the truth about spiritual matters. But I don't think it is that (ok, maybe she is right, but I don't see it, lol! ).
I am fascinated by other peoples' beliefs. I really truly want to know. I would LIKE to believe as you do.
But, you see, Moni, I was 25 years as a practising christian, and towards the end of that time I started to notice stuff in the bible that just didn't gel with the god I was being asked to worship. I finished up saying, 'well, if what I am reading here is the person god is, I don't want to play with him any more, thanks'. And I do get really angry about some things, and some beliefs, but 1) the anger is not directed at the person I am chatting to. 2) I won't believe ANYTHING spiritual until I have tested it to breaking point. I don't want to waste the rest of my life believing c**p. I wnat to have real confidence that what I believe is safe to believe in. Ok, ok! I know that is pretty well impossible, but Moni, the reason I seem negative about what people believe is not 'cos I am knocking THEM! I just want answers! Answers I can accept.
Please, as I said to Lady Avalon, keep posting

------------------