Druids: spell progression, levels, etc

[manikus]

What are folks opinions about druid spell progression?

I like 1e, but in only allows spell preogression up to level 14 (15 and 16 are special cases that DC.

Also, they have a maximum level of 23

But, under 2e, they are just specialty priests.

Do we want to stick to a strict interpretation of 1e, or do we want a hybrid of the two? I do not want to do the 2e version, as I'm putting everything else as 1e.

Uatu? ST? Tarlanon?

Uatu: you mention (in your bug tracker request) you mention that druids keep adding hit dice all the way up to level 23, where did you find this at? The Unearthed Arcana sourcebook only has them gaining dice through level 15 and then adding one point/level after that.

[SilentThief]

Do the 1st Edition style spell progression as long as there is the ability to change/edit character classes available someday

ST

[manikus]

Well, there is limited ability now. But, if you mean you reserve the right for a 2e Druid, I understand.

[Uatu]

I think that spell progression is up to level 15, no? It is true that they stop gaining spell slots after that, but they DO have a whole lot of spell slots by that time (in particular, higher level spell slots).

Let me check the HD thing (oops - did I make a mistake? I will have to wait until I am home to check... Uh oh, I think I DID make a mistake, I think you are right... Er... how does one change requests then? )

Of course I want to go the whole 1e thing, in the spirit of the old Gold Box games - I want DC to be what the Gold Box games COULD have been...

(On that note, what about monks, illusionists, and assassins? For people who don't want them, they could still be useful as a "placer" for classes to edit (anti-paladins?) and such.)

[manikus]

I've been busy today. I've changed all classes experience tables to 1e and done the same with the spell progression tables for the appropriate classes. I used the player's handbook and Unearthed Arcana, so druids gain spells up to 15 and may be up to level 23. I'm pretty excited b/c I actually did something and I added a new variable to cap a classes level limit. I need to do some more testing before I submit to the code repository.

(Plua, maybe Tarlanon will say, "No way! I've got other plans." So, I'll wait till I hear from him on this topic before I commit my changes.)

I was looking at another request for allowing racial maximums to go to 19 for dwarves, elves and halflings. That will be a bit harder and require me to do a complete rework of that section. But, I am pretty sure that I know how to do it.

Edited to add: I just noticed that Tarlanon has assigned this one to himself, so I won't worry about it anymore.

[Uatu]

Sorry about the druid boo-boo...

Hmm - barring the level cap, I guess you could just make level 24 require 459823475902348759082375 experience or something like that (that is what I did until now)

The racial maximums of 19 for some races is pretty important, I think (I mean, that was the whole reason for being an elf (DEX 19), dwarf (CON 19), etc., right?).

Another important one is that any natural attack roll of 20 should hit, and any natural attack roll of 1 should miss...

Actually, how does DC roll up stats for PCs, anyway? It does seem that stats are pretty nice in general, so I don't think it is a flat 3d6 kind of thing right now... (I made a javascript PC roller, and it is quite hard to get a PC that is not average )

Hey, maybe you could do the teeeeny little adding monks/illusionists/assassins thing...

[manikus]

Originally Posted by Uatu Hmm - barring the level cap, I guess you could just make level 24 require 459823475902348759082375 experience or something like that (that is what I did until now)

I've found a way to cap the druids at level 23, but if it doesn't work, that's my back-up plan.

Originally Posted by Uatu The racial maximums of 19 for some races is pretty important, I think (I mean, that was the whole reason for being an elf (DEX 19), dwarf (CON 19), etc., right?).

I always played dwarves b/c they could be multi-class fighters and elves b/c they were cool.

Originally Posted by Uatu Another important one is that any natural attack roll of 20 should hit, and any natural attack roll of 1 should miss...

I haven't looked at this yet, but I'm guessing it's a bit harder to take care of.

Originally Posted by Uatu Actually, how does DC roll up stats for PCs, anyway? It does seem that stats are pretty nice in general, so I don't think it is a flat 3d6 kind of thing right now... (I made a javascript PC roller, and it is quite hard to get a PC that is not average )

DC cheats. B/c you pick the class first, you're guaranteed at least the min in your required stats, plus it does some other stuff that I'm still trying to figure out.

Originally Posted by Uatu Hey, maybe you could do the teeeeny little adding monks/illusionists/assassins thing...

No problem, this will be done probably by tomorrow morning when I release the psionics system for DC.

[SilentThief]

It was a request for script towards having a record of the attack roll you could test. This would apply to Vorpal swords (roll of 20 to decap) and was something FRUA did for the vorpal attack. I think it could be used for making your own critical hit table, as well.

ST

[manikus]

I'm not going to do any scripts. Since I'm one of like five people in the universe that has VS C++ 6, I'm going to try and get stuff done that requires it.
Unless I've misunderstood something, all scripts can be added through the editor or the GPDL engine, neither of which require MFCs.

I'm not trying to say that they are not important or anything, but when you have very limited resources, you have to apply them very carefully.

Plus, ST, I think once you get a little more free time, that you would he a perfect candidate for working on scrips.

[Uatu]

Psionics, yay! (Er...?)

Anyway, dwarves always rocked because, as fighters (or partial fighters), they could have CON 19 and +5 hp per level, woo hoo! This would also give them a +5 bonus to their saves vs. magic (and poison), which means that they were mostly invincible (or as invincible as a 1st-level PC could be) (Hmm... do racial save bonuses work in DC yet?)

Elves had the nice +1 attack with swords and bows (with DEX 19, they would also get a +3 attack with the bows, not to mention a -4 bonus to AC) - very nice as well, quite nice at 1st level (the charm resistance didn't come in so often, but it was also useful in battles where that happened).

Halflings were kind of like elves (but less cool ), but lots of thief bonuses and sling +1 attack were quite nice.

Gnomes... well, it is kind of unfortunate, but DC right now has no illusionists, so noone is going to play a gnome, I think...

As for stat-rolling, DC is surely cheating but there are various ways to cheat... For example...

1. Roll ALL stats over and over until you get a stat set that is eligible for the wanted class(es)/race.
2. Roll EACH stat until each stat is within the requirements for the wanted class(es)/race.
3. Round up each stat to at least the minimum requirements for the wanted class(es)/race.

(I don't think DC is doing #3, since even fighters (who only need STR 9 and CON 7) reliably roll pretty good stats... Or maybe it is, but is supplanting this method with a "nice" rolling method (such as, 5d6, pick the best 3 dice)