WAR MISCALCULATIONS

pritchke · 04-02-2003, 02:46 PM

http://www.macleans.ca/xta-doc2/2003...er/57743.shtml

ARTHUR KENT reports on how Washington's planners got the math wrong

WAS IT just another random collage of video streams, or did the juxtaposition of live TV feeds on Britain's Sky News this past Wednesday reveal much more than the sum of its parts? On the left frame of the split screen, above the title "War on Iraq," Tony Blair was facing Prime Minister's Questions at Westminster and being quoted as saying "enormous progress has been made." Simultaneously, at frame right, a body was being pulled from the wreckage of a Baghdad bazaar, allegedly hit by misguided U.S. or British missiles.

So is it progress or predicament in the war on Iraq? The former, insist officials at the Pentagon, who, after waffling for a time, finally declined to accept responsibility for bombing. But with mounting civilian casualties -- including another gruesome bombing at a second Baghdad bazaar -- and grim reports from the battlefield, an unsettling pattern is developing in this second week of the U.S.-led campaign: a good number of physical objectives are being achieved, but almost invariably without gaining the desired results. Armoured infantry columns ate up 300 km of desert on the way to Baghdad, only to be stalled by overstretched supply lines that are regularly ambushed by Iraqi troops and militia. Despite the bombing, Baghdad functioned behind its thick veil of smoke from surrounding oil fires. And while American and British firepower is brought to bear on strategic cities such as Basra and Nasiriyah, it's not grateful civilians providing the welcome, but fanatically determined militiamen willing to fight and die.

"You could have expected that the Fedayeen would be fanatical," says Daniel Neep, a Middle East specialist for Britain's Royal United Services Institute, referring to the young irregulars who have emerged from obscurity to make their mark on the front lines. "But the fact that they've actually translated their fanaticism into organized resistance is quite surprising."

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An article that digs a little deeper into Donald Rumsfeld blunders, and shows. I really believe the Rumsfeld'sd and the Perle's of the world are influencing Bush's decisions and that is not a good thing for anyone except maybe themselves and a few friends.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Perle wrote: "The 'good works' part [of the UN] will survive, the low-risk peacekeeping bureaucracies will remain, the looming chatterbox on the Hudson will continue to bleat. What will die with Iraq is the fantasy of the UN as the foundation of a new world order."

One senior member of Secretary General Kofi Annan's staff shakes his head in disbelief. "I don't think there's any way to change the minds of people like this," he told Maclean's. "They're diehard rejectionists and there's probably no way of turning them around. But I believe there are many more people who understand the great potential benefits of the United Nations, and it's these people who will help us get around the Richard Perles.

[ 04-02-2003, 02:49 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

Timber Loftis · 04-02-2003, 02:50 PM

Pritchke, I agree with you 100%: the forest reminds me of pansy elves, too.

Maybe you think this is offtopic, but maybe it's not.

khazadman · 04-02-2003, 03:10 PM

What a crock! Do you really want to know why these Fedayeen animals are fighting? They know that because of the things they've done over the years that, when Saddam is dead, so are they. I'd like to know how this war plan is failing. They are less than twenty miles from Baghdad, and the last twenty-four hours has witnessed the destruction of two of these supposedly elite Republican Guard divisions (or what was left of them). And these attacks on the rear echelons are a complete failure. All they've done is see hundreds, if not thousands, of these goons killed.....well maybe they are not a failure for us. Not after being pounded from the skies twenty-four hours a day.
[img]graemlins/tomcat.gif[/img]

[ 04-02-2003, 03:18 PM: Message edited by: khazadman ]

pritchke · 04-02-2003, 03:25 PM

What a crock!

Possibly, but it is good to get a rise.

But I won't shed any tears when Donald Rumsfeld, Pearle, and the other 8 officials in Washington who composed the first strike policy are out one way or another. Bush can stay president though.

Personally I feel those 10 are a threat to Canadian interest as well as the rest of the world.

Bardan the Slayer · 04-02-2003, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by khazadman:
What a crock! Do you really want to know why these Fedayeen animals are fighting? They know that because of the things they've done over the years that, when Saddam is dead, so are they. [img]graemlins/tomcat.gif[/img]

And it won't be the allies that kill them. I've heard predictions that it will be the outraged iraqi citizens that root out the Saddam-sympathisers and deal with them.

Personally, I wouldn't have it any other way.

Thoran · 04-02-2003, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pritchke:
http://www.macleans.ca/xta-doc2/2003...er/57743.shtml

ARTHUR KENT reports on how Washington's planners got the math wrong

WAS IT just another random collage of video streams, or did the juxtaposition
...(snip)...
understand the great potential benefits of the United Nations, and it's these people who will help us get around the Richard Perles.

Now there's an unbiased article!

As they used to sing on every episode of Hee-Haw (which I watched every week when I was a 'yungun.) [img]smile.gif[/img]

"Gloom, Despair, and agony on me... deep dark depression, excessive misery... if it weren't fer bad luck I'd have no luck at all... Gloom, Despair and agony on me!"

Larry_OHF · 04-02-2003, 04:26 PM

I'm with you, Thoran...Hee-Haw...Saturday nights at my grand-mother's home. Thanks for the flashback!

Sir Taliesin · 04-02-2003, 04:48 PM

I grew just down the road from Archie Campbell. For those of you who don't know who Archie Campbell was, he was the Creator, producer and one of the Stars of HeeHaw. He was a pretty neat guy to all of us kids. How did we get so off topic!

BTW, my saturday nights at Grandma's was Lawerance Welk, THEN HeeHaw. Talk about extremes!

[ 04-02-2003, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Sir Taliesin ]

Thoran · 04-02-2003, 05:32 PM

Hee-Haw then Walt Disney on sunday nights for me. [img]smile.gif[/img] That was the number one TV day until I got old enough to discover Daisy Duke. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Timber Loftis · 04-02-2003, 05:48 PM

Whur, oh whur, are you tonite?
Why did you leeeeaave me here all alone?
I searched the world o'er an' thought I found true love,
but you met another, and *pffft* you were gone. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

04-02-2003, 02:50 PM	#2
Timber Loftis 40th Level Warrior Join Date: July 11, 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 11,916	Pritchke, I agree with you 100%: the forest reminds me of pansy elves, too. Maybe you think this is offtopic, but maybe it's not. __________________

04-02-2003, 04:26 PM	#7
Larry_OHF Ironworks Moderator Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: Midlands, South Carolina Age: 49 Posts: 14,759	I'm with you, Thoran...Hee-Haw...Saturday nights at my grand-mother's home. Thanks for the flashback! __________________

04-02-2003, 04:48 PM	#8
Sir Taliesin Silver Dragon Join Date: March 4, 2001 Location: Knoxville, TN USA Age: 62 Posts: 1,641	I grew just down the road from Archie Campbell. For those of you who don't know who Archie Campbell was, he was the Creator, producer and one of the Stars of HeeHaw. He was a pretty neat guy to all of us kids. How did we get so off topic! BTW, my saturday nights at Grandma's was Lawerance Welk, THEN HeeHaw. Talk about extremes! [ 04-02-2003, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Sir Taliesin ] __________________ Sir Taliesin<br /><br />Hello... Good bye.

04-02-2003, 05:48 PM	#10
Timber Loftis 40th Level Warrior Join Date: July 11, 2002 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 11,916	Whur, oh whur, are you tonite? Why did you leeeeaave me here all alone? I searched the world o'er an' thought I found true love, but you met another, and pffft you were gone. [img]tongue.gif[/img] __________________

04-02-2003, 02:46 PM	#1
pritchke Bastet - Egyptian Cat Goddess Join Date: September 5, 2001 Location: Calgary, AB Age: 50 Posts: 3,491	http://www.macleans.ca/xta-doc2/2003...er/57743.shtml ARTHUR KENT reports on how Washington's planners got the math wrong WAS IT just another random collage of video streams, or did the juxtaposition of live TV feeds on Britain's Sky News this past Wednesday reveal much more than the sum of its parts? On the left frame of the split screen, above the title "War on Iraq," Tony Blair was facing Prime Minister's Questions at Westminster and being quoted as saying "enormous progress has been made." Simultaneously, at frame right, a body was being pulled from the wreckage of a Baghdad bazaar, allegedly hit by misguided U.S. or British missiles. So is it progress or predicament in the war on Iraq? The former, insist officials at the Pentagon, who, after waffling for a time, finally declined to accept responsibility for bombing. But with mounting civilian casualties -- including another gruesome bombing at a second Baghdad bazaar -- and grim reports from the battlefield, an unsettling pattern is developing in this second week of the U.S.-led campaign: a good number of physical objectives are being achieved, but almost invariably without gaining the desired results. Armoured infantry columns ate up 300 km of desert on the way to Baghdad, only to be stalled by overstretched supply lines that are regularly ambushed by Iraqi troops and militia. Despite the bombing, Baghdad functioned behind its thick veil of smoke from surrounding oil fires. And while American and British firepower is brought to bear on strategic cities such as Basra and Nasiriyah, it's not grateful civilians providing the welcome, but fanatically determined militiamen willing to fight and die. "You could have expected that the Fedayeen would be fanatical," says Daniel Neep, a Middle East specialist for Britain's Royal United Services Institute, referring to the young irregulars who have emerged from obscurity to make their mark on the front lines. "But the fact that they've actually translated their fanaticism into organized resistance is quite surprising." ------------------------------------------------------------------------ An article that digs a little deeper into Donald Rumsfeld blunders, and shows. I really believe the Rumsfeld'sd and the Perle's of the world are influencing Bush's decisions and that is not a good thing for anyone except maybe themselves and a few friends. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Perle wrote: "The 'good works' part [of the UN] will survive, the low-risk peacekeeping bureaucracies will remain, the looming chatterbox on the Hudson will continue to bleat. What will die with Iraq is the fantasy of the UN as the foundation of a new world order." One senior member of Secretary General Kofi Annan's staff shakes his head in disbelief. "I don't think there's any way to change the minds of people like this," he told Maclean's. "They're diehard rejectionists and there's probably no way of turning them around. But I believe there are many more people who understand the great potential benefits of the United Nations, and it's these people who will help us get around the Richard Perles. [ 04-02-2003, 02:49 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

04-02-2003, 03:10 PM	#3
khazadman User suspended until [Feb13] Join Date: December 6, 2001 Location: the south side of ol virginny Age: 64 Posts: 1,172	What a crock! Do you really want to know why these Fedayeen animals are fighting? They know that because of the things they've done over the years that, when Saddam is dead, so are they. I'd like to know how this war plan is failing. They are less than twenty miles from Baghdad, and the last twenty-four hours has witnessed the destruction of two of these supposedly elite Republican Guard divisions (or what was left of them). And these attacks on the rear echelons are a complete failure. All they've done is see hundreds, if not thousands, of these goons killed.....well maybe they are not a failure for us. Not after being pounded from the skies twenty-four hours a day. [img]graemlins/tomcat.gif[/img] [ 04-02-2003, 03:18 PM: Message edited by: khazadman ]

04-02-2003, 03:25 PM	#4
pritchke Bastet - Egyptian Cat Goddess Join Date: September 5, 2001 Location: Calgary, AB Age: 50 Posts: 3,491	What a crock! Possibly, but it is good to get a rise. But I won't shed any tears when Donald Rumsfeld, Pearle, and the other 8 officials in Washington who composed the first strike policy are out one way or another. Bush can stay president though. Personally I feel those 10 are a threat to Canadian interest as well as the rest of the world.

04-02-2003, 05:32 PM	#9
Thoran Galvatron Join Date: January 10, 2002 Location: Upstate NY Age: 57 Posts: 2,109	Hee-Haw then Walt Disney on sunday nights for me. [img]smile.gif[/img] That was the number one TV day until I got old enough to discover Daisy Duke. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

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