War Crimes

I heard on the news the other day about a 5 year old girl in Iraq who was having to have her legs amputated due to being caught by a US missile.

A five year old girl, nice one Bush. I can't think of a worse crime.
Bush and Blair should be tried in court for this and for their illegal war.

Don't tell me that they are trying to minimize civilian casualties, and that it is for Iraqs own good.
Try telling that to a little girl who will grow up crippled, never being able to run and play with her friends. Without a normal life ever again. A family of suicide bombers in the making?.

What gives the US the right to impose it's opinion on the rest of the world?.

[MarkyMark]

I suppose Bush thinks he is right, or knows something he is not telling everyone else. Or has some hidden agenda ?.
But you're right, this is why a lot of the world hates the US, it's the we know whats good for you better than you do attitude.

[Ronn_Bman]

I guess in your book, it's ok for Saddam to have intentionally killed and maimed the tens of thousands of innocents he's responsible for since you don't mention them.

[MarkyMark]

Just my opinion, but I think both sides are wrong. Saddam is evil as his orders killed many of his own people, ie Kurds etc.
Bush is also evil as his orders led to the deaths and possibly even worse, horrible injury of equally innocent civilians if the story at the top o' the post is right. i'd rather be dead personally.

[Ronn_Bman]

But Saddam's method has gone on for 30+ years and would continue after his death under his equally vile sons, and then under their sons until someone does something. I think it's better to do something now instead of later. I think it's better to do something than to do nothing.

I've heard lots of Iraqis in America who don't think Bush is evil. That want their country to be freed of Saddam... they want their families and friends freed of Saddam.

The tens and tens of thousands of innocents killed by Saddam will not really be comparibly to the small number of innocents accidentally killed in this Gulf War by the coalition. All death is tragic, but there can be little doubt that those tens and tens of thousands of intentional deaths are quite different from a small number of unintentional deaths. So yes, there have been innocents killed, and there will be other innocents killed by accident, but that will be a small number compared the innocents who have been killed intentionally by Saddam, and those who would be at left at risk of a similar fate in the future under Saddam.

Of course, the freedom of the Iraqi people is a by product and not the main goal. The main goal is to disarm Iraq. The man who illegally spent billions on weapons during the last 12 years, and who also spent billions on presidential palaces while his people starved would have never disarmed peacefully. He's proved it over and over for 12 years.
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Bush isn't evil, he's just doing what he thinks has to be done. I agree with him, so if he's evil, so am I. The world isn't always a pretty place. You have to look no further than a Saddam ruled Iraq to know that's true.

[ 03-24-2003, 11:14 AM: Message edited by: Ronn_Bman ]

[Charean]

Originally posted by Maximus67: I heard on the news the other day about a 5 year old girl in Iraq who was having to have her legs amputated due to being caught by a US missile. A five year old girl, nice one Bush. I can't think of a worse crime. Bush and Blair should be tried in court for this and for their illegal war. Don't tell me that they are trying to minimize civilian casualties, and that it is for Iraqs own good. Try telling that to a little girl who will grow up crippled, never being able to run and play with her friends. Without a normal life ever again. A family of suicide bombers in the making?. What gives the US the right to impose it's opinion on the rest of the world?.

Saddam has not made it a secret that he WILL use civilians as human shields. That he also will put civilians next to targets. That he will dress up his own militia in US military clothing and torture civilians and tape it.

[MarkyMark]

What does he get out of torturing civilians and taping it?. When did he mention he was doing those things?. It was no surprise to me that in the few days before the war there was a huge upsurge in "Saddam is a Demon" stories in the media. I'm sure in Iraq there were "Bush is a Demon" stories, it's all propaganda.

[Rokenn]

Originally posted by MarkyMark: I suppose Bush thinks he is right, or knows something he is not telling everyone else. Or has some hidden agenda ?. But you're right, this is why a lot of the world hates the US, it's the we know whats good for you better than you do attitude.

Actually the administration's 'Hidden Agenda' has been a well known secret in neoconservitive circles since the end of the cold war, hashed over in white papers and op-ed pieces:

Just the Beginning
Is Iraq the opening salvo in a war to remake the world?

Excerpt:

For months Americans have been told that the United States is going to war against Iraq in order to disarm Saddam Hussein, remove him from power, eliminate Iraq's alleged stockpiles of weapons of mass destruction, and prevent Baghdad from blackmailing its neighbors or aiding terrorist groups. But the Bush administration's hawks, especially the neoconservatives who provide the driving force for war, see the conflict with Iraq as much more than that. It is a signal event, designed to create cataclysmic shock waves throughout the region and around the world, ushering in a new era of American imperial power. It is also likely to bring the United States into conflict with several states in the Middle East. Those who think that U.S. armed forces can complete a tidy war in Iraq, without the battle spreading beyond Iraq's borders, are likely to be mistaken. "I think we're going to be obliged to fight a regional war, whether we want to or not," says Michael Ledeen, a former U.S. national-security official and a key strategist among the ascendant flock of neoconservative hawks, many of whom have taken up perches inside the U.S. government. Asserting that the war against Iraq can't be contained, Ledeen says that the very logic of the global war on terrorism will drive the United States to confront an expanding network of enemies in the region. "As soon as we land in Iraq, we're going to face the whole terrorist network," he says, including the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO), Hezbollah, Hamas, Islamic Jihad and a collection of militant splinter groups backed by nations -- Iran, Syria and Saudi Arabia -- that he calls "the terror masters." "It may turn out to be a war to remake the world," says Ledeen.

[Sir Taliesin]

K, Marky, I went out to google nad did a search just for you. Notice that most of the sources sited are what most would deem neutral.

http://web.amnesty.org/ai.nsf/Index/...UNTRIES%5CIRAQ

http://homepage.eircom.net/~yahussai...e.html#english

http://www.flipsideshow.com/Fact_-_M...Of_Torture.htm

http://www.iraqfoundation.org/news/2...ec/3_rape.html

http://www.amnestyusa.org/countries/iraq/
This is a great site! It has reports going back to the eighties! Just look around!

I might add that before I shipped out to Gulf-1, my unit recieved a briefing on what to expect if we were captured and also on past attrocties Saddam and his henchman had committed. The briefings came complete with pictures. Not very pleasent ones either.