Aid Money - to get things into perspective

[Silver Cheetah]

There's been a lot of screaming and yelling in this forum about how much America has contributed and continues to contribute to poorer countries (including Afghanistan) in terms of aid dollars. Decided to take a closer look, just for the hell of it......

First of all, the US is not the biggest donor, - Japan is, by a long way.

Secondly, as far as percentage of GDP is concerned, the US comes LAST out of the 22 richest industrialised nations, that is despite being the richest nation on earth, by a very long way.

It contributes just 0.10% of its GDP. Britain is also pretty crap, with 0.23%. Both figures are well below the average, sadly.

Denmark comes top, with 1.01%, closely followed by Norway, Netherlands, Sweden, and Luxembourg.

Here's a link to the chart, if anyone is interested. There's also another chart on the same site which shows donations in terms of who gives the most overall.

http://www.oecd.org/jpg/M00002000/M00002882.jpg

[Neb]

Hmmmmm.... Denmark doesn't suck QUITE as badly as I thought, still sucks even though this is one of it's good points....

[Silver Cheetah]

quote:

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Originally posted by Neb:
Hmmmmm.... Denmark doesn't suck QUITE as badly as I thought, still sucks even though this is one of it's good points....

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Hehe..... generosity doesn't make up for the climate then Neb?

[Barry the Sprout]

Thank you very much SC! Lets just put it this way, we give enough to look good in front of the cameras and keep the governments we like stable.

I am in a bit of a mood at present anyway. I have been reading the student newspaper and they have a huge article in there attacking me and my Stop the War friends at LSE. Not just attacking the principle of peace - actually attacking us and the way we have protested. I am a bit pissed off to be frank that some bloke I have never met is just writing that I am ignorant. He describes as having a "glutinous feast of Anti Americanism.", which I think is a little unfair to say the least.

Git.

[Neb]

quote:

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Originally posted by Silver Cheetah:


Hehe..... generosity doesn't make up for the climate then Neb?

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It doesn't make up for the combined effect of the climate, the terrain and the politicians to be more exact.

[Silver Cheetah]

quote:

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Originally posted by Barry the Sprout:
Thank you very much SC! Lets just put it this way, we give enough to look good in front of the cameras and keep the governments we like stable.

I am in a bit of a mood at present anyway. I have been reading the student newspaper and they have a huge article in there attacking me and my Stop the War friends at LSE. Not just attacking the principle of peace - actually attacking us and the way we have protested. I am a bit pissed off to be frank that some bloke I have never met is just writing that I am ignorant. He describes as having a "glutinous feast of Anti Americanism.", which I think is a little unfair to say the least.

Git.

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I can relate to that....

I get soooooo bored with being jumped on every time I venture to subject American (and British for that matter) motives in prosecuting this war, or methods thereof to any kind of questioning or analysis.

People taking issue with my facts/opinions is one thing - and fine. I am aware that I am not the source of all wisdom on this matter. (Yes, really...)

What does piss me off are the charges which are regularly levelled at my head of being 'anti-civilisation', 'pro-terrorist' 'anti-american' 'anti-west' 'osama -loving' &tc &tc ad nauseaum ad infinitum.

Like what do people want? For example, are we're supposed to just sit back and let a load of panic sticken politicians slap a whole load of terrorist curbing regulations in place which just happen to have huge implications for the future of the environmental and anti-globalism movements, not to mention a whole host of other things, without so much as saying boo?

I think not.

Think I'll leave it there for the time being. I can feel a rant coming on... and I don't have time... gotta go OUT into the big wide, screenless world... (although that last might be a matter of opinion....)

[Magness]

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What does piss me off are the charges which are regularly levelled at my head of being 'anti-civilisation', 'pro-terrorist' 'anti-american' 'anti-west' 'osama -loving' &tc &tc ad nauseaum ad infinitum.

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Silver Cheetah, it may "piss you off", but in the minds of many (mine included) this is a conflict in which you are either with us or against us. There is no middle ground. Attempting to place yourself in a middle ground is unacceptable. There are only two sides here, not three.

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Like what do people want?

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Pure and simple ... the utter and complete destruction of those murdering terrorist bastards!!! Those attempting to stop that goal place themselves, whether they accept it or not, whether they like it or not, on the side of the aforementioned murdering terrorist bastards.

quote:

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For example, are we're supposed to just sit back and let a load of panic sticken politicians slap a whole load of terrorist curbing regulations in place which just happen to have huge implications for the future of the environmental and anti-globalism movements, not to mention a whole host of other things, without so much as saying boo?

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While I am a bit leary of the long term implications of some of the new proposed/passed laws, I am not terribly concerned about the future of a bunch of whining socialist/anarchist troublemakers who have been left behind by the advance of history (i.e. the environmental and anti-globalism movements).

Ah well, enough ranting for now.

[Neb]

quote:

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Silver Cheetah, it may "piss you off", but in the minds of many (mine included) this is a conflict in which you are either with us or against us. There is no middle ground. Attempting to place yourself in a middle ground is unacceptable. There are only two sides here, not three.

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Magness, being with the US is to send help against the Taliban and Osama, being against the US is to help the Taliban and Osama, the middle ground is to NOT to send either troops or help to the US attacks while at the same time not harboring terrorists, sending help to Osama and the Taliban and having compassion with the loss that the US has endured.

[Silver Cheetah]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Magness:
[QB]quote:

Silver Cheetah, it may "piss you off", but in the minds of many (mine included) this is a conflict in which you are either with us or against us. There is no middle ground. Attempting to place yourself in a middle ground is unacceptable. There are only two sides here, not three.

MY ANSWER Claptrap. Not only claptrap, this is a postively dangerous attitude. This black/white, good/evil crap is totally simplistic, and does away with all need (in the opinions of those that tout it) for examining cause and effect.

Questioning of government aims and actions is fundamental if we are to continue to live in a democratic society that is moving towards (in theory anyway) securing a decent life for all global citizens. The US is the only remaining world power, for the time being anyway. What is does and how it does it is of HUGE concern to all global citizens.

So you want us all to sit here doing our Noddy imitation? Cheers, Big Ears, you can do the robot thing all you want - me, I've got a brain and I like using it.


Pure and simple ... the utter and complete destruction of those murdering terrorist bastards!!! Those attempting to stop that goal place themselves, whether they accept it or not, whether they like it or not, on the side of the aforementioned murdering terrorist bastards.

MY ANSWER Simplistic in the extreme. No-one here is against attempts to stop international terrorism, and that includes me. What is being questioned is a. the methods that are being used and b. the efficacy of those methods both in the long and short term.

Dictators of the world unite, you have nothing to lose but your brains... YES, I can question all I damn well like! I live in a democracy where free speech is allowed. (Didn't America used to be that way once upon a time?? (Don't question, either for us or against us... next thing we know, it'll be 'off with her head'!! Where have we heard all this before......... )

While I am a bit leary of the long term implications of some of the new proposed/passed laws, I am not terribly concerned about the future of a bunch of whining socialist/anarchist troublemakers who have been left behind by the advance of history (i.e. the environmental and anti-globalism movements).

MY ANSWER If you don't give a shit about the future of this planet and the legacy we're going to be leaving our children and grandchildren, there are plenty that are.

Socialist/anarchist troublemakers, eh? Well, duckie, I'm one of those 'troublemakers', as you've probably sussed by now. My fellow 'troublemakers' are nurses, doctors, IT professionals, writers, artists..... the list is a long one. Dippy hippies are definitely in the minority as far as activism goes these days ..... (BTW, I work in the finance sector, mostly for IT. My feet are firmly on the ground, mister.)

[tracey]

well said s/c!

i think there's been far too much faffing about on the with us or against us attitude to make any thinking person on the planet puke.

it's amazing how much of it comes out of the mouths of people who on the surface seem like bright intelligent beings. however, i suppose propaganda is more rife and effective than we thought. or is it?