[IWD2]What's YOUR power party look like?

[Klorox]

Jeeze, I've shared enough of my crap over the past few months. Lemme see what you guys like!

[Aerich]

I go for power and versatility. The party as a whole should have one offensive and one defensive tank, several potent spellcasters, and enough other abilities (rogue skills, identifying, dialogue) to get by.

Generally, I like to have at least one offensive and one defensive tank. An offensive tank is your typical tanker, optimized for dealing big damage in melee. It could be a Ftr/Warrior combo or a cleric with one level of Ftr (to begin; add more after getting to at least cl lvl 20). A defensive tank in my setup has to have evasion and spell resistance, with Expertise a big plus. I commonly use monks here.

I have to have at least one sorceror. Not only is the class overpowered, it's also more adaptable in combat than a wizard.

I generally have at least two divine casters. As with all of my characters, they have to be able to do other things. One is often a meleer, and the other may be optimized as a sniper.

The main party that I'm currently running is almost finished the Severed Hand and is as follows:

1) DG Monk13/Illusionist1 - defensive tank. Hardly does any damage, but doesn't take much either. Will go to Monk20 then put the rest in Illusionist.

2) Pal3/Ro3/Wiz10 - offensive tank but can also be defensive in a pinch. Slow to develop as offensive tank, so was an archer to begin.

3) Barb1/Druid16 - pure offence, as spellcaster and melee. Spirit of Flame, Scion of Storms, GSF: Evocation and Transmutation. I have the shapeshift mod but am not using it until HoF, because it's waaaay too powerful for the normal game.

4) Pal2/Sorc15 - pure offensive caster, except for Stoneskin and Mirror Image. GSF: Ev, Nec, and Ench.

5) Pal2/Cleric15 (Lathander) - 14s in Str and Dex, so is fill-in as necessary for ranged and melee combat. A healer with some offensive ability. Spirit of Flame, GSF: Ev and Ench

6) Ro2/Bard14 - talker, skills, singing, and support - if I had this one to do again, I'd make it a Bard11/WizX.

Notice that 5 out of the 6 can handle themselves in melee in the normal game if necessary. Three of the six are major spellcasters, with the other three being able to contribute a little (the Monk/Ill uses wands for buffing) at present and more as the game goes along. I've also got three characters with GSF: Enchantment - arguably the best spell focus type for HoF.

[Aerich]

Having now played with the above party (exception: switched out the Rogue/Bard for a beginner Bard that will go to lvl 11 then switch to Wizard) through to the goblin fortress on HoF, I'm considering some tweaks for a more powerful party. That's not to say that I'm going to drop this one, though, as it is more than powerful enough to do very well indeed the rest of the way. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Observations for this party in HoF: While #1 is a very good decoy (when and if I bother to buff her up to the max), I'd like to get more out of the character. It's a long wait to lvl 20 monk with a 3 ECL race. #2 is fine, although the heavy emphasis on wizard levels hurts the BAB and thus the number of attacks/round. #3 is actually by far the best tank, with the shapeshifting mod. The AC on the half-dragon forms is terrible, but they have good damage resistance and huge, I mean huge, HP and attacks. I never used Call Lightning much in the normal game, but I found out that it "follows" the character around like Static Charge (contrary to how it operated in IWD/HoW), even to other maps. Static Charge + Call Lightning (if outside) + shapeshift + the occasional Heal makes for an incredible tank. #4 is good, but still hasn't received lvl 9 spells yet. #5 is fine. #6 as presently constituted will, I anticipate, be of more use as an offensive caster.

Based in part on the above observations, here's my newest "built for success" power party.

1) Mk3/Ftr4/Wiz4/Cl19 - decoy. Is likely to have a better AC than the decoy in the party above (*cough* Every God Ring), and can do a bit more than just throw axes if it needs a break from tanking.

2) Barb3/Ftr4/Druid23 - battle druid. Nasty offensive spells, great summons, great tank with the shapeshift mod; case closed. Druids get a bad rap, but they are gold with the shapeshift mod (which also fixes some of the worst bugs with the shapeshift toolbar).

3) Pal2/Sorc28 - a bomber. I may buff up Str a bit, since I found a cool staff (which I don't remember finding before, or maybe I just sold it without really looking) that acts at range like a Mordenkainen's Sword (called Phantom Staff +5).

4) Sorc30 (human) - a bomber with earlier access to the big bombs. Talking skills. May actually add two or more fighter levels late if I decide that I want more feats over more spells.

5) Cleric - not sure of the race, order, or mix-ins yet. I'm mulling it over. May add one fighter lvl early, mostly for the weapon feats. I know the race will be human or aasimar. The order will be Lathander if I decide I want more bomber support, or Helm just because it's a "typical" clerical type without the irritating "I must suffer" aspect of Ilmater. It won't be Tempus (been there, done that; I want a backrow cleric), Oghma (good domain spells, useless "bonus" powers, unless you skimp on the ID skills with the party), Mask (evil so cannot cast Holy Word, bad bonus unless multiclassing to rogue), or Selune (domain spell overlap with Druid). It could be a Dreadmaster, although it's got to be the most overused clerical type. Maybe Talos, although it lacks the AoE might of the Lathander clerics. There are a couple of really good portraits for a domineering battle cleric, though. I'm sure there'll be some fighter mix-in levels for this character, but maybe nothing else.

6) Rogue(lvls?)/Wizard20 - somebody has to do the thieving and ID duties, as well as provide arcane support for offence and buffing. About 4-5 rogue levels, spread out, should suffice so I can maximize skill points allocated to the skills I really need (DD, Search, OL, and PP). This character might finish off with fighter levels if I want more feats.

[ 07-02-2007, 03:22 AM: Message edited by: Aerich ]

[Dancing Virginia]

So what is the benefit of taking only one or two levels of a certain class? Example: Aerich's Pal2/Sorc28.

I'm trying to glean as much information as possible from the board before starting an IWD2 game but I'm finding the methodology for character builds impossibly complicated even with some of the explanations.

There are some good strategy guides for character builds out there but they get so into the weeds with minutiae that I'm hopelessly lost after a while.

Am I just an idiot or did anyone else feel this way when starting out?

[Aerich]

The 3rd ed rules as used in IWD2 are indeed complicated for anyone accustomed to 2nd ed. rules, as I was. I felt confused when I started out, and built and restarted I don't know how many parties while I was figuring it out. The best way to learn besides playing (as Klorox knows) is to post parties for critique.

The key thing to remember is that powerful spells make the game a lot easier. That means you ideally should advance casting characters fairly quickly so you get access to the best spells earlier (hence why I have a human Sorc in the party above - it will gain a given spell level 3 character levels before the Pal2/Sorc). Keeping equal levels in two casting classes with the same character is a no-no. A lvl 16 Wiz is far more useful than a Wiz8/Cl8.

The primary reason to take a level or two in a class is to gain access to particular class-based abilities or bonuses. In the case of the Pal2/SorcX build, the paladin gets Aura of Courage at 2nd level (character immune to Fear, allies within 10 ft gain +4 to saves vs fear effects, including dragon-induced fear). The paladin also gets Divine Grace at 1st level (add Charisma modifier to saves, which is great for sorcs since their casting stat is Cha), as well as some other minor benefits (proficiency with every weapon, lay on hands, smite evil, and better HP).

Consider the following advantages to taking one level of each of the following classes:

Fighter - proficiency with every weapon, all armor feats, shield proficiency, and an extra feat to assign.

Barbarian - proficiency with every weapon, light and medium armor feats, shield proficiency, 1 Rage, faster movement, cannot be flanked (e.g. sneak attacked), 12 HP.

Ranger - same weapon/armor access as Barbarian, favoured enemy, two-weapon fighting if wearing light or no armor.

Monk - evasion, faster movement, add Wis bonus to AC if not using armor or shield, stunning blow.

Rogue - skill points (and class access to rogue skills), sneak attack. Evasion if you take 2 rogue levels.

One level in a casting class gives lvl 1 spells (generally not too useful). One or more levels in any class also allows the character to use items only useable by that class - e.g. the Pal/Sorc can use the Holy Avenger sword, and an Illusionist1/Monk can use wands. Further, the character will gain class access to the class' skills for that level. There are situations where it's advantageous to have a few points in certain skills (Wilderness Lore comes to mind) but a character doesn't have enough skill points to take the skills as cross-class skills.