[OBV] Main quest question

[Aelia Jusa]

I've gone to the Lake Arrius Caverns to find the Mythic Dawn. I did the bit where you give all your belongings away and go find out about the initiation. But I don't really want to kill the sacrifice victim (or give up my stuff for that matter) - is this what you're supposed to do? I tried not saying that I wasn't here to join and that just obviously made them hostile - is that a viable option?

I guess I want to know if I can proceed by not blowing my cover but also not killing the sacrifice. Also when will I get my stuff back?

Thanks [img]smile.gif[/img] . If possible could spoilers be limited [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Sever]

I didn't want to let go of my stuff so i took the more direct approach and told them exactly who i was.

I can't answer your question, Aelia, but i will say it'd be par for the course if you can only advance along the non-violent path for so long. Bethesda obviously hasn't thought of too many different gaming approaches and has really only balanced the game for combat. What are your options here? Confront them head on - the righteous path. Play along until your cover's blown - the not so bold but also not so silly approach. Sacrifice the prisoner - the evil path. The first two end in combat and, without spoiling, i'm guessing the third will too. At times like this, an archive save is called for.

[Thoran]

I tried a couple options and they all ended in combat. There's only one way to do it that may not end up in combat... once the dipstick finishes talking, grab the book and RUN. Stealth doesn't seem to help, even with a high stealth they IMMEDIATELY noticed when I took the book.

Another possibility I may try is to see if I can sneak by the initial encounter and into the sacrifice room... but I suspect they won't let me, and once the initial encounter starts your only choices are to follow along, run away, or fight.

What I ended up doing is leaving all my stuff at one of my houses and running to the encounter in my undies (fine as long as you're willing to quick travel).

[Aelia Jusa]

Thanks, guys [img]smile.gif[/img] . I ended up just killing everyone from the start. I really liked the way you could hide up above while the dude was speaking then wait until they all filed out and there were only a few left to kill. Of course I had to reload when I forgot to put my torch out and they spotted me

[Thoran]

I played a bit more with that encounter yesterday. Whoever 'designed' that segment decided to throw the 'open/non-linear' game design paradigm right out the window.

There is exactly one solution to that (rather poorly designed) segment once you agree to 'join'. You can't steal the book without being spotted, you can't hide (everyone immediately sees you no matter how high your stealth), you can't get out unless you steal the book, and you have a guy following you that seems to have a psychic link to you (you can't shake him). The only way to break that stupid little segment is to go in all guns blazing (like Aelia did). Also, they have a couple improbable triggers set on the book grab... like one door closing and one opening that JUST SO HAPPENS to make it take FOREVER to get out of the area if you take the 'run away run away!' approach.

It's this sort of design that gives the 'RPG elietists' ammunition for saying Oblivion is an action game not an RPG.

[ 04-24-2006, 08:43 AM: Message edited by: Thoran ]

[Aelia Jusa]

Yes, I have to agree that I have been a bit disappointed by the limited options you have for most of the quests I've done so far. Seems like you either do it one particular way, or you don't do it at all. The quests themselves are well done in that they are interesting and not just the typical 'go there, kill/collect that', but there aren't multiple ways of solving them.

I think possibly also the journal/map-arrow system is partly to blame for this. Because of the active quest thing where you get the direction arrow for where to go next, you kind of don't have the opportunity to puzzle out what to do next and what options you have. There is one thing to do and the arrow is pointing to it, dammit!

[Thoran]

I would tend to agree that the arrow is not a good thing... but that's because I think Bethesda used it as a crutch. Instead of having to plant dialog or visual clues in the game to guide you where you need to go, they depend on the arrow. There are some quest targets that would simply be impossible to find without it.

While I may sound really negative on the game, it's only because it's soo close to being a revolutionary title... a leap forward in immersive CRPG'ing... but because of these issues (and others) it still falls substantially short. (Honestly I have to agree with the detractors who are saying that BG2 was a better overall CRPG) It didn't need to be this way, a few less nods to the console rpg-crippling market, a couple fewer corners cut and it would've been a great title instead of just a good one.

Ahh well... TES V or VI or whatever they've got next is only 2-3 years away (probably)... maybe this time the console market will be looking for something more than a pretty action game.

[ 04-24-2006, 06:39 PM: Message edited by: Thoran ]

[Kyrvias]

Quick question. What does "CRPG mean? Better question. What does the "C" stand for?

[SpiritWarrior]

Computer. Rhetorical question?

[Memnoch]

Originally posted by Aelia Jusa: Thanks, guys [img]smile.gif[/img] . I ended up just killing everyone from the start. I really liked the way you could hide up above while the dude was speaking then wait until they all filed out and there were only a few left to kill. Of course I had to reload when I forgot to put my torch out and they spotted me

I tried two options:

1. played along, offered to kill the prisoner, then I snatched the book and freed him, then used my Moonshadow ability to escape while they all attacked the hapless prisoner (the sneaky approach)

2. told Harrow to screw himself, killed him, then sneaked over to where Mankar Cameron was doing his pulpit speech and shot him in the head with an Arrow of Jolting. Unfortunately he didn't die (plot character) but he was unconscious. It was funny to see them all running around like ants in an anthill while I picked them off one by one. But Cameron regained consciousness and escaped before I could get the Amulet.

I ended up going with 2. Unfortunately the prisoner still died in the confusion.