How hard is it for a rogue in Undermountain?

[shamrock_uk]

I'm having rogue-like urges, but seem to remember some on here saying it was a tough server for a rogue.

Would somebody mind expanding on this a little?

Are many enemies immune to sneak attacks and criticals?

[robertthebard]

Actually, I've had some success with rogue type builds, I just had to amp up the feats I chose. There are a lot of creatures that are immune to sneaks, but that's not a big deal, if they don't have true seeing, sometimes getting the first attack is still worth the effort. I'd suggest a dagger though, as there are some really nice ones out there. I did a human fighter/rogue/wm with daggers, and he is highly successful.

[shamrock_uk]

Thanks for the speedy reply Robert!

Would you go for daggers over kukri's?

[Mozenwrathe]

Until the new hackpak comes out, you would be wiser to go with daggers or rapiers over kukri. Sure, the kukri have a higher critical range, but right now there are no kukri that match the two best daggers currently available in the Undermountain. I have tried going with a fighter/rogue/weaponmaster as well, and she was a fairly successful character. I should have planned it out better, but I've never been big on gaming mathematics. *laughs a bit* In any case, if you wish to go with kukri, there is at least one fairly nice one around, but apparently it is a little hard to find.

Oh, if you are going rogue, carry a LOT of spells. Main reason for this: YOU CAN! You'd never believe how many times I have used Isaac's Greater Missle Storm with my rogue-based characters. Probably my favourite rogue attack of all time is to whip out a scroll and blast my foes from a distance before sliding in for the slashing kill.

-edited after looking through some older posts-

Kill my noise about the kukri not equalling the daggers. There is at least one which is really, REALLY nice. If you are going with dual wield, it couldn't hurt to find that kukri AND roll with the Ancient Dagger Of Shadow. I have a feeling as a combination they could be lethal. I am a huge proponent of the Ancient Dagger Of Shadow, however, so I am biased. As well I have found myself a little iffy about the singular dagger more powerful than the ADoS. So I'll have to see that kukri in action to give a more detailed analysis.

[ 03-26-2006, 08:30 PM: Message edited by: Mozenwrathe ]

[Greything]

Out of curiosity I built a Rogue/Bard/RDD combination.

Tha AB came out lower than I like but a combination of defensive roll, epic dodge and dev crit made it quite formidable in melee.

And,yes, I did use daggers. However the stats for the best daggers and kukris (the one from level 8) look when compared, the daggers work far better in practice. Robertthebard did explain this to me once but I don't pretend to understand how it works.

[Larry_OHF]

One of my most successful characters used to be a Rogue with Shadowdancer's ability to not be seen. I used to be able to get my way to Level 6 without even a fight! In a party, he was really helpful, too.

[roddybug]

The only problem that I've had with pure rogues is that they can't hit much, it's best to take a few fighter levels before level 20. I've had a lot of success with rogues, not just a few levels either. A lot of players just wander over traps thinking that everyone is immune to every bad effect, I do prefer to disarm them if I'm playing a rogue, some of them hurt a lot.

One prestige class that you might want to consider is shadowdancer, hide in plain sight is a great ability for rogue types. I hope that you will take more than the one required level in that though. I'm not keen on people who take just one level of rogue at level 37+ just to max out tumble and use magic device either.

Edit: Heh heh! Great minds think alike Larry, simultaneous post syndrome has hit again!

[ 03-27-2006, 10:37 AM: Message edited by: roddybug ]

[robertthebard]

Originally posted by Greything: Out of curiosity I built a Rogue/Bard/RDD combination. Tha AB came out lower than I like but a combination of defensive roll, epic dodge and dev crit made it quite formidable in melee. And,yes, I did use daggers. However the stats for the best daggers and kukris (the one from level 8) look when compared, the daggers work far better in practice. Robertthebard did explain this to me once but I don't pretend to understand how it works.

I think it was the base damage type immunity. Daggers will do far more consistent dmg, because almost nothing is immune to piercing dmg, while the Greater Swordsman's belt, slashing immunity bonus, is a hot seller. Note it's only like 20% though. However, that can be a significant amount.
Roddy, weapon finesse. When using a dex based char, with dex based weapons, always invest in that feat. I have a rogue/assassin/shadowdancer at around lvl 22 now, and when I took the weapon finesse feat, lvl 21, I think, his ab increased by 12 points. A rogue will never hit like a fighter of similar lvl, but with the potential for sneak attacks, or even getting to catch the opposition flat footed, and get the first attack, rogues can do well.
Bard/RDD/Rogue is a great combination, and if you keep perform maxed out on bard lvls...Oh yeah...Killing machine.

[Tomin]

He he the commment about carrying a lot of spells is my character montra... I've spent probably 3million gold in spells and I'm only 26. If I can't hit the monster with my daggers I'll spell it to death. Heck I even carry around a few wands of hellball Chain lightning Bigby's fist spell wands and a bunch of others. I'm basicly a wizard who never runs out of spells as long as I have money.... which is really easy to get.

[roddybug]

Originally posted by robertthebard: Roddy, weapon finesse. When using a dex based char, with dex based weapons, always invest in that feat. I have a rogue/assassin/shadowdancer at around lvl 22 now, and when I took the weapon finesse feat, lvl 21, I think, his ab increased by 12 points. A rogue will never hit like a fighter of similar lvl, but with the potential for sneak attacks, or even getting to catch the opposition flat footed, and get the first attack, rogues can do well.

Of course I take the weapon finesse feat! And I often wear an amulet that gives divine power at will (which gives you the roll to hit of a fighter of the same level), but I still struggle to hit and do enough damage to take down the tougest monsters. The divine power doesn't last long and a lot of critters are immune to sneak attack and criticals. I've reached stalemate so often, they can't hit me, I can't hit them enough times to counter their regeneration. I like dexterity based characters because not much can hit me and I've a fair chance to hit back with missiles and weapon finesse in melee. It's just not enough to take down those that are immune to sneak attacks. Often the only way is Use Magic Device and pile on the spells.

One little warning about weapon finesse is that there is a set list of weapons that it effects. I'm sure that I've mentioned this before but the light CEP weapons that should be effected are not e.g. the assassins dagger found in the docks, it took me a while to notice that I wasn't hitting much with it.