Most powerful class - a minor rethink

[Andraste]

Obviously party make up, and personal style of play are crucial, and no class is going to give the same results for every player in every game, which is why this perennial question has no absolute right answer. This being said, my opinion has always been that the sorcerer (god of magic) has the edge on all other classes, until somewhere in TOB, when the HLAs kick in and the mage/cleric (god of cheese) eases ahead.

I was playing around yesterday putting together an 'ethnic diversity' party, which would contain all my favourite classes but have no two party members of the same race (for reasons I'd be hard put to explain even to myself ). It took a bit of juggling due to race restitutions. In the course of this I noticed for the first time that Gnomes have the option Cleric/Illusionist.

The reason I've missed this before is that I never bother with gnomes, and I get the feeling that I'm not alone in this.

A bit of experimentation showed that the block on necromancy mage spell does not apply to the cleric spells, so the Cleric/Illusionist gets Animate Dead and Finger of Death as cleric spell, leaving only Skull Trap missing from my list of commonly used spells.

So, with the extra spells and 19 int, the Cleric/Illusionist has just moved to the top of my powergaming class list. I can't help feeling somewhat amused that a gnome has taken the position.

[Armen]

Originally posted by Andraste: so the Cleric/Illusionist gets Animate Dead and Finger of Death as cleric spell, leaving only Skull Trap missing from my list of commonly used spells.

hmmm

animate dead is a good spell not to loose but from what i read on here, high-level magic super-power-dom is a lot about ADHW - personally i'd miss death spell

gnomes are very good though what with the save bonuses and all

what's the rest of your party?

[Andraste]

Yes - you're right, I overlooked ADHW, which will be sadly missed. As a sorcerer or a pure mage, I'll often have 3 ADHW in a chain contingency. But as a mage/cleric I'll have some of the cleric HLA spells there - summon Deva if I'm feeling really cheesy. So I still think the extra spell per level will outweigh the loss.

The rest of the party are

Dwarf - berserker
Half elf - ranger/cleric
Elf - sorcerer
Human - skald
Halfling - fighter/thief

[Armen]

indeed - looking at your party i think you'll be fine . .

i see what you've done in the 'race for class' thing there too - nice

[SixOfSpades]

The Illusionist restriction is best skirted by a player who is primarily interested in buffing spells. e.g. take a Cleric/Mage over a Cleric/Illusionist so you don't miss out on ADHW (pretty much the only good Level 8 spell for a party spellcaster), but a Fighter/Illusionist has one more Stoneskin and PfMW per day than a Fighter/Mage does.

[Klorox]

FYI: A Gnome Cleric/Illusionist with an 18 CON has the best saving throws in the game!

[SixOfSpades]

False. Dwarven and Halfling Fighters with 19 CON have the best Saving Throws in the game.

[Klorox]

1) 18 and 19 CON gives the same modifier to saving throws.

2) The statement is actually level dependent, and I still think, over the long haul, I'll take my chances with the Gnomes. The Dwarves and Halflings will always win against poison, with the Gnomes and Dwarves doing better against magic (the more important one IMO). Fighters have the worst saves vs. magic, which is where I was making my statement from.

[timothy trotter]

doesn't that mean that a dwarf fighter will have a better save Vs poison than a gnome and an equally good save Vs Magic as a gnome, making him a better choice than a gnome?

[Klorox]

No. The spellcasting classes have inherently better saving throws overall than the non-spellcasting classes.


note: I wish I could find a saving throw chart online.