Dual F/T

[Hunguard]

Well, fist of all: hi everyone!

So...last week I created a - guess what - fighter, and dualled him to a thief at level 9. Lots of HP, weapon profs, etc. Now he's a lvl 20 thief, dual-wielding, backstabbing, hiding, and crushing everyone he meets. Well, except for golems and beholders, since they can't be backstabbed...
I layed a few traps, but it's VERY unlikely, that i'll be bombarding everyone with those...not my style.
The only problem is my THAC0...way too high, with the giant girdle bought at Ribald it's 5/7 IIRC, dual-wielding CF and Belm. It' still 4 attacks per round with the BoS, but still. So, a few tips would be appreciated, regarding THAC0.
Btw, my party is: Erkanith (me), Keldorn, Minsc (later Sars), Anomen, Aerie and Imoen. So 3-4 tanks, cleric, thief, mage...got everything, I think. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Xen]

Welcome to Ironworks.

If you have ToB I strongly suggest that you take F/T multi-class, becuase you get HLA`s from both pools.

[Hunguard]

It's a pity that I can't stand non-human PC-s. [img]smile.gif[/img] You know, role-playing.
Actually, my THAC0 is 2/3 now (with Usuno's Blade), I was mistaken last time.
I'll get the Fire Giant Girdle soon, plus the gauntlets of weapon expertise, that would be +4 THAC0 (STR 19 -> 22), and with +4/5 weapons i should get along.
Ah, well...next time I'll probably dual a fighter to a mage, or a cleric.

[SixOfSpades]

If you really want a good THAC0 with a Fighter->Thief, don't Dual until you hit Level 21. Level 21 (or thereabouts) is where all classes' THAC0 progression stops, and since Warriors have the fastest THAC0 progression, it's to your advantage to have 21 Warrior levels.

For Multi-classes, the game calculates the THAC0 that each half of your character would have, and grants you the better one.

Dual-classes are trickier: When you Dual, your THAC0 progression becomes that of your second class (in your case, Thief). When you come out of the Dual (in your case, when you hit Thief Level 10), the game compares the THAC0 that each half of your character would have, and grants you the better one.

A Level 9 Fighter would have a THAC0 of 12, and a Level 10 Thief would have a THAC0 of 16. So, when your Fighter half reactivated, your THAC0 was 12. Ever since then, your THAC0 has been improving at the rate of 1 point every 2 levels (which stops at Level 20 or 22), so at Thief Level 20, your base THAC0 is now 7.

Now, if you had postponed Dualing.......
A Level 21 Fighter would have a THAC0 of 0, and a Level 22 Thief would have a THAC0 of 10. So, when your Fighter half reactivates, your THAC0 will be 0. You would not gain any more THAC0 progression from your Thief side, so your base THAC0 would now be locked at 0.

[Hunguard]

The problem is, that I'm playing with 5 NPC-s, so even at the end of SoA (no WK) I would have 3-3,100,000 XP. That's lvl 19-20 for a fighter, AFTER that I dual him, and wait a loooong time until his fighter class reactivates.
Still, I should have waited until lvl 12-13, the +3/4 THAC0 would be still very good. But, it doesn't matter now, I still own the party, with 50% of all the kills... [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Potato]

Originally posted by Hunguard: The problem is, that I'm playing with 5 NPC-s, so even at the end of SoA (no WK) I would have 3-3,100,000 XP. That's lvl 19-20 for a fighter, AFTER that I dual him, and wait a loooong time until his fighter class reactivates. Still, I should have waited until lvl 12-13, the +3/4 THAC0 would be still very good. But, it doesn't matter now, I still own the party, with 50% of all the kills... [img]smile.gif[/img]

Maybe you should dual a kensai to a thief at level 13.
Kensai has better thac0 and ac than normal fighter (plus other abilities), and you can get Use Any Item HLA once you get high thief level, then you can equip any armors you like and get even better ac.

[mad=dog]

Everything basically stops at level 20, so you are "stuck" with an inferior fighter. A thief can become level 40 for all it matters - he will never become better than a level 10 fighter unless he is a Swashie.
This is a big big problem in AD&D because it lacks (lacked) scope. D&D was within a well defined scope. 36th level was the highest and everythung builds up to that in a nice fashion. Development is linear and while you do not gain THAC0 at each level you feel some progression.
AD&D suffers greatly because it never had that scope. 20 was set a the highest concievable level and (unfortunately) all charts where based on that. An addendum called "Dungeon Masters Option - High Level Campaigns" was released and in there the level limit was pushed up to 30. There it was clearly stated (in contrast to the base rule books) that 30 WAS the highest level AT ALL.
Now blackisle have tried to blast through those charts with little success. Your character just loose more and more flavour for each level. So you get UAI. Yummy yummy. My thief just lost his niché. Worst are the Bards who gains practically nothing for several million XP.
Why did it come to this? Because XP are handed out left and right like it was candy. SOA went overboard completely.
Between D&D and AD&D I consider D&D supperior if you have the material simply because it is designed to take you from farmer to divinity. Everybody with either the boxed sets or Rules Cyclopedia & Wrath of the Immortals + the gazetteers will know what I mean, though they may certainly disagree.

[Xen]

Welcome to Ironworks potato! [img]graemlins/happywave.gif[/img]