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Old 09-23-2001, 04:08 PM   #31
skywalker
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Um! What does "cyber-ephrix" mean? (I feel ignorant!)


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Old 09-23-2001, 04:21 PM   #32
Fljotsdale
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Quote:
Originally posted by J.J.:
Holy Cow!!!
I just read past Dan's post to everything else. I have to admit that I just do not understand those of you who do not want us to attack because there may lives of people not actively involved in orchestrating the sneak attack. Innocent children, women and men may die - they already have, as Moridin pointed out.
Here's a little factoid for digestion,those of you who wish to not do anything:
in just two of the hundreds of companies in the towers (saw this this morning on fox pregame nfl show, of all places) Boomer Esiason was a quarterback in the nfl, and has a child with a congenital birth defect, cerebral palsy, cystic fibrosis, something that guarantees an early death at this point, and a painful life up to that point. He established a foundation to generate revenue for reseach into cures for this condition, knowing that his son will die before a cure can be found, realistically speaking. His offices were with the Cantor-Fitzgerald floors of the tower, ones that were directly struck by the plane in tower 1. The death toll was almost 100% (only employees not there survived) the over 700 people in JUST THOSE TWO COMPANIES left over 1200 fully or partially ORPHANED CHILDREN!!!! by my extrapolation, with over 6500 dead, from all over the world, means something like 12,000 (TWELVE THOUSAND) instant orphans and widows(ers) were created in over 80 countries world wide. So, how do you like them now? wanna natter at me, JD, Moridin, and others whose passion you just can't seem to grasp? I do not know, other than Tobbin, who else on the board has lost friends and family, but even if I had not, You would not see any less passion out of me, nor will you. Shame for hiding behind innocents - we have lost more than those jihad jerks in the last 20 years, hardly any of them even connected to the military.

J.J., I don't think ANYONE has said we should just sit on our hands and do nothing!
But to ADD to the loss of life when we can be almost CERTAIN we will not even GET bin Laden and his cronies is utter folly and utterly shameful!
Yes, we have orphans, widows, widowers, parents who have lost children and grandchildren at the hands of the terrorists - but face the FACT that they will be cared for, they will not starve, they will have all the comforts of civilisation around them. Yes they suffer. Yes they are to be pitied. But they will NEVER have to suffer the way the Afghans (and many other eastern peoples) have ALREADY suffered and will suffer further if we attack them.

I am hoping that all this show of force is just to frighten the Taliban into handing over bin Laden.... but I am not confident.
And if we DO use military force you can be darn SURE that the US and the rest of the West will suffer FAR more than the Two Towers and the Pentagon deaths. Believe it. We will be making things worse for OURSELVES as well as killing already wretched innocent people.

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[This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 09-23-2001).]
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Old 09-23-2001, 04:24 PM   #33
J.J.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fljotsdale:
John? Remember? 'love your enemies'. 'Vengeance is MINE, I will repay, saith the Lord'

THE LORD HELPS THOSE WHO HELP THEMSELVES - Proverbs. We're just gonna help those suckas. Think of us as real estate brokers - just your friendly, worldwide real estate agent. We feel their pain, we're just going to help them with their final real estate deal, and buy them their very own piece of real estate, 6 feet under. Really, our intentions are just misunderstood, the jealous mewlings of those who are not so fortunate as to recieve our help in the real estate field. Well, you know how to get it now, don't you?

------------------
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Defender of Those Unable To

To Err is Human To Forgive Divine, However Neither is U.S. Marine Corps Policy. Nuke'm til the damn camels glow.
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Old 09-23-2001, 04:27 PM   #34
skywalker
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JJ! I don't think I've ever heard anything quite like what you just posted.

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Old 09-23-2001, 04:27 PM   #35
Fljotsdale
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Quote:
Originally posted by tracey:
that's very sad indeed. however, you seem perfectly happy to indulge a few more orphans in the world.

there is no absolute answer. however, retaliation does not even come close to helping the situation one iota. all it will do is aggravate the current crisis and add a few more corpses. cool your heels and use your logic circuits.
Great thread, tracey. I agree wholeheartedly!

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Old 09-23-2001, 04:32 PM   #36
Fljotsdale
Thoth - Egyptian God of Wisdom
 

Join Date: March 12, 2001
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Quote:
Originally posted by J.J.:
THE LORD HELPS THOSE WHO HELP THEMSELVES - Proverbs. We're just gonna help those suckas. Think of us as real estate brokers - just your friendly, worldwide real estate agent. We feel their pain, we're just going to help them with their final real estate deal, and buy them their very own piece of real estate, 6 feet under. Really, our intentions are just misunderstood, the jealous mewlings of those who are not so fortunate as to recieve our help in the real estate field. Well, you know how to get it now, don't you?

It is NOT, however, a BIBLE proverb. Belongs in the Book of Thieves, perhaps. The rest of your post deserves no reply.

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Old 09-23-2001, 04:35 PM   #37
John D Harris
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Skywalker,
I have no problem with you being a pacifist or wanting peace. I may have come off stronger then intended in my earlier reply to one of your posts. I was just suprised that you would have fallen for the bombing of innocent Afghani people line. While you and I are polar opposites on the political front, I have found you to be intelligent,repectful, not given to emomtional statments, or the hypocritical "My way is the only way and if you don't agree with me then you must be THE closeminded, argumentative one" view.
If you have any suggestions on how to get rid of the terrorist without military strikes I'm all ears. But please bare in mind that we have tried the diplomatic, economic sanction, and failed miserbly on the intel. route. The only option I see left to us is the military route. As General W.T.Sherman said "war is hell" (gags as his southern mind quotes Gen. Sherman). I'm willing to compromize, as I beleive you are inorder to find a solution, who knows maybe we can come up with something.

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Old 09-23-2001, 04:47 PM   #38
skywalker
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John. I just made a statement in this thead that I didn't understand why we are always have trouble taking out 1 guy, but have no trouble going for broke and blowing up stuff!

The problem is that getting rid of terrorism by spouting off about the "NEW WAR" and "INFINITE JUSTICE" is a little bit juvenile. Deaths won't stop it, it will help a little, but it won't cure hatred. Is that so hard to understand.

I'm not sure we can get rid of terrorism, but if killing a lot of people makes the majority feel better, fine. Just don't expect me to cheer about it.

I don't get paid to or have the education to come up with the bright ideas needed to end terrorism. I only finished 12 grades in a trade type High School. I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, but people in power are supposed be that smart, it's their job, not mine!

I never said do nothing, John.

Mark [Edit for dumb spelling errors!]

[This message has been edited by skywalker (edited 09-23-2001).]
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Old 09-23-2001, 04:51 PM   #39
John D Harris
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fljotsdale:
John? Remember? 'love your enemies'. 'Vengeance is MINE, I will repay, saith the Lord'

Yes, but I believe that is speaking of an individual's actions, not an nation's actions. Please see my post to G'kar on his peace thread, and please pay attention to the first and, last lines on the subject in my post. I say that because there has been alot finger pointing and accusations of emotional reactions, because some us "say there is a time for war, and a time for peace".



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are deeds of a man in his prime"
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Old 09-23-2001, 04:59 PM   #40
Fljotsdale
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Quote:
Originally posted by John D Harris:
Yes, but I believe that is speaking of an individual's actions, not an nation's actions. Please see my post to G'kar on his peace thread, and please pay attention to the first and, last lines on the subject in my post. I say that because there has been alot finger pointing and accusations of emotional reactions, because some us "say there is a time for war, and a time for peace".
[/b]
I was of the understanding that it applies to christians and christianity as a whole, regardless of whatever nation they happen to belong to. The 'time for war' was past for christians since the baptism of Jesus. Even though christians and christianity have not lived up to that Christlike standard of love since the first century AD.
Sorry to disagree with you, John.


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[This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 09-23-2001).]

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