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Old 09-12-2001, 09:01 AM   #61
MagiK
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Luther I was not ragging on Kaz out of the blue, I was responding to a direct comment from him to my post. I try to address my posts tothe individuals they are ment for..such as this one being for you. Since I was responding to you, I put your name as the first word...understand? It is not because I am "ragging" on you.

Now my first post with your name in it WAS ragging on you, but you deserved it and asked for it with your.....post of dubious intelligence.

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[This message has been edited by MagiK (edited 09-12-2001).]
 
Old 09-12-2001, 09:05 AM   #62
MagiK
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Mel I agree with you about the innocents, which is one reason why the USA has invested huge fortunes into developing "smart" weapons, it is to reduce the casualties to the innocents. You cannot wage war without having innocents killed, but we do everything we can to reduce the number of innocents as much as we can and yet still get the mission accomplished. On the other hand...if you allow a terrorist to camp out in your back yard and do nothing to try and stop him from killing other innocents are you truely innocent?

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Old 09-12-2001, 09:06 AM   #63
Luther
Manshoon
 

Join Date: July 11, 2001
Location: Dae Han Min Guk
Age: 35
Posts: 185
Quote:
Originally posted by MagiK:
No Kaz what I was trying to get accross was that we are being touted as destroyers of peoples lives because we have been trying for the couple of decades to bring peace to areas that are being ripped apart now because of religions, the peoples of that part of the world were trying to wipe each other out before the crusades and have continued to this day.

The USA has tried to help the people of the region, we helpped Iraq defend itself against Iran..and look how Iraq turned out, Afghanistan exists today because we helpped them devend against the Soviets ...now look how we are repaid. We rebuilt France after world war 2...look how friendly france is to us....Frankly with results like that I think we should quit helpping people and let them fend for themselves.....but we don't because we actually care about people. No it isn't all altruism, we also know that if everyone is at peace then trade and economies run smoother...War disrupts trade, and is bad for everyone but the arms dealers.


Ever considered that American intervention to try and bring 'peace' to these areas has merely upped the stakes? They had been killing each other through tribal feuds for thousands of years (and these feuds long outlasted the Roman Empire, another foreign body which marched in and stomped on them in an attempt to bring 'Peace'), these feuds have not wiped the people out, they maintained a delicate balance. Now the Americans and all their ideological bravado about 'freedom' and such have brought in an upsetting amount of foreign weaponry, techonology and ideals.

Of course why would the U.S.A. give a shit about the middle-east if it didn't have all that oil. We've seen how quick they were to abandone Vietnam after practically obliterating it with Bombs and defoliant after they lost too much face.
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Old 09-12-2001, 09:08 AM   #64
MagiK
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Quote:
Originally posted by Luther:
You say you've been here and there (in intelligence or whatever), doesn't mean you're right.

Yeah you are right. I wouldn't want to confuse the issue with facts. got to say you made me smile with that lil bit of inadvertant humor


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Old 09-12-2001, 09:08 AM   #65
Kaz
Thoth - Egyptian God of Wisdom
 

Join Date: August 16, 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 2,891
People, as I posted in another thread, calm down, all right? We're all very upset, so tempers are flaring and people are lashing out at other people because of misunderstandings. Trust me - this isn't making things better. Let's keep this a civilized, objective discussion, okay?

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Old 09-12-2001, 09:12 AM   #66
Melusine
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Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands
Age: 37
Posts: 6,540
Quote:
Originally posted by nick1979:
Mel that's the problem with war. I'm sure if anything is done that we will be very careful of where we bomb. We will not go after the innocents like these monsters did. Thats what sets us apart from terroists. We do not go out and try to kill innocents. Some may die, but it is not our intention. The problem is that we must stop terrorists. They can stike anywhere in my country or yours. We cannot let this happen again anywhere?
I that case, I think we actually agree on the matter. To me, really the only thing that matters is that we MUST prevent innocent people's deaths. I just cannot bear to think that there are people out there willing to kill for their cause...to me, taking a life is unthinkable, the worst crime a (wo)man can commit. Still, I think that even I would want to see the person responsible for this killed. I could never kill a human being, but the one who consciously planned yesterday's events, to me is not a human.



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Old 09-12-2001, 09:21 AM   #67
Luther
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Join Date: July 11, 2001
Location: Dae Han Min Guk
Age: 35
Posts: 185
Quote:
Originally posted by Melusine:
the one who consciously planned yesterday's events, to me is not a human.



A good way to calm your conscience in wanting revenge isn't it. Dehumanise them and they're all just cattle.
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Old 09-12-2001, 09:23 AM   #68
Sir_Tainly
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Quote:
Originally posted by MagiK:
from this coutry, they received aid in the form of weapons, training and military advisers. The single most important thing they got fromt he uSA were stinger missiles which allowed them to fend off the Soviet Helocopters which were tearing them up.
I know this but don't you think another country could supply aid to THEM if they were attacked by the USA? Iran and Sudan have both developed domestic munitions industries. As with the Mujahadeen all they need is small arms/SAMs etc and they would be deadly. Also Libya another Anti-US country has significant arms dumps .

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Old 09-12-2001, 09:23 AM   #69
MagiK
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kaz:
People, as I posted in another thread, calm down, all right? We're all very upset, so tempers are flaring and people are lashing out at other people because of misunderstandings. Trust me - this isn't making things better. Let's keep this a civilized, objective discussion, okay?

Kaz no emotional fit here, Im not raging at you, just commenting on your response to my post. I think you really missed the mark with your first response and since then it has been just an ordinary discussion...at least in my mind it has been sorry if you have preceived anger or anyother sort of negative emmotional content.



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Old 09-12-2001, 09:23 AM   #70
Melusine
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Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands
Age: 37
Posts: 6,540
Quote:
Originally posted by Luther:

A good way to calm your conscience in wanting revenge isn't it. Dehumanise them and they're all just cattle.

*SIGH* that is JUST the attitude I am trying to prevent! Read my posts again.


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