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Old 11-15-2000, 10:11 PM   #11
Shoujo
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Bah...I couldn't see all the replies to the BG vs W&W thread... I gather though that responses weren't all that positive so here's my attempt to defend those products...

Icewind Dale has gotta have one of the best soundtracks of any RPG and the portraits for your characters are some of the best IMO. I haven't actually played W&W yet so I can't say for sure, but I'd say Icewind Dale is pretty similar in a sense to W&W. You create your party of adventurers from scratch. If you're inclined you can customize your own biography for each character (a nice touch). At first they're inexperienced and under-equipped, but of course this changes by the end of the game. The game involves hacking and slashing your way through dungeons (plenty of variety) while gathering loot. There is some kind of randomly generated treasure system so a lot of times the rewards for killing the same big bad evil guy in a nother game won't net you the same loot all the time. The story does contain some interesting twists. The voice acting for the narrator which you hear during the cutscenes are great too. The biggest problem with this game is that it won't provide you with hours and hours of gameplay unless you decide to replay the game. And in case you care the characters have no personality (unless you give them one).

Baldurs Gate I wouldn't recommend simply because BG2 is better than it in so many ways. Class kits, the inclusion of weapon styles, more options for weapons to specialize in (they made it like the D&D books), and the chance to get a stronghold depending on your character class (adds to replayability a bit, but I've heard there are tricks to get multiple strongholds in multi-player) all make character creation a lot of fun. Dual-classing adds more ways to tinker with your character. The NPCs in BG2 that join your party are mostly interesting (they have personalities). Go for the eyes Boo...go for the eyes! RAAAARGH! (I cracked up the first time I heard Minsc say this...it does get a bit old, but I still love him and Boo) Each of them come with a few sidequests (my favorite has to be Edwins where he ahhh...well...undergoes quite an interesting 'change' in his appearance lets just say...not to mention his voice "I saw you looking!" *stab stab stab*). The main character and his/her closest friends friends also have to confront some rather dark realities. It's nice to see a Big Bad Evil Guy that is kinda in the grey area. You know the Guy's evil, yet you can't help yourself from wondering whether or not you'd have done the same thing in the Guy's position. It's nice to have a variety of options at your hand to resolve a situation (basically brute force vs brains, good vs evil). Combat is pretty hard at places (liches anyone?) and the spells that enemy mages cast at your party will cause you to hit the reload button many many times. The exp cap is NOT a problem (unless you're a multi-class fighter/mage/thief or something). The game provides you with plenty of weapons that outright unbalance the game (i.e. Holy Avenger, cloak that reflects ALL offensive spells, Crom Faeyr which sets your STR to 25!!, Vorpal sword). Also because of the way the D&D system works you don't have to reach such an insanely high level to slaughter anything that comes your way. I think waxing dragons, liches, and sorcerers that are throwing level 9 spells at you is a pretty good indication that you're strong enough.

Out of the D&D Interplay products though I'd have to recommend Planescape: Torment. If you hate (or at least dislike) games where everything is black (the enemy) and white (you) then this is the game for you. EVERY single character (actually one of them is an exception but he's a robot of sorts so...) has some kind of secret he/she/it is hiding from you (guilt regarding their past actions, conflicts with their duty, revenge, emotional problems, etc). Your character, The Nameless One doesn't even know who he is (or where) and piecing together the mystery of his past is part of the fun. Your character (and his past actions) isn't exactly one suited for the chivalrous, knight in shining armor, but that's what adds more depth to his character and makes him more human. IMO out of the D&D worlds Planescape has to be one of the more interesting ones (not everyone is your standard Elf, Dwarf, Human, Hobbit and not all settings are medieval castles). In Sigil there are enough factions (with very interesting and unique philosophies which you may want to think about in your spare time), so that at least some are bound to appeal to you. There are enough side-quests (interesting too, and some may even help figure out the mystery of your identity/past), and the main quest is long enough that you will get hours of gameplay out of Planescape. The game actively encourages you to use brains over brawn (by giving more exp that is). Those previously useless (for a fighter at least) stats such as CHA, INT, WIS actually matter because higher values in those attributes increase the number of dialogue options you can get. This is one of the games which makes me just wish I could forget the plot so that I could play it again...great great story.

Ack...I've spent way too much time typing this... Time to actually start working on my fun fun take-home final which is due tomorrow...
 
Old 11-15-2000, 10:21 PM   #12
Sloth
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Shoujo - I do agree that BG does have some definate positives that are not around in W&W, but I much prefer W&W over them. The main reason is the first person view. The top down view that is in BG just does not make me feel like part of the story. In W&W you actually will jump when you round a corner and something is there to greet you. Even with all of it'ss bugginess, I love this game.
 
Old 11-15-2000, 11:29 PM   #13
Lily the Ranger
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If I am such a valued customer, why does AOL kick me off without warning? Now I have to thank you all over again. First . . . do you think my other half is made of $$$$$$$$? BUT SERIOUSLY - THANKS!

I may never get to play these games as freud (hi freud keeps appealing to my masochistic side and finding more for me to do.

Graphics is not tops on my list of qualifications (she dodges rotten tomatoes and the contents of chamber pots) (Hey, honey don't leave . . . my husband just walk out the front door) are graphics really THAT important?

THANKS GUYS
 
Old 11-15-2000, 11:52 PM   #14
Sloth
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It completely depends on the game. If the game is horrible and has great graphics, it will be fun for about an hour. Betrayal at Krondor was like this. The game was good, but was WAY to short. I say go for content. You will be much happier. Did I metion that Bane of the Cosmic Forge and Crusaders of the Dark Savant are good games? They are both made by D.W. Bradley as well.
 
Old 11-16-2000, 12:44 AM   #15
Gaijin
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I gotta go with Sloth on this one.

Crusaders is my absolute all-time most favorite bestest RPG in the whole wide world.

Why take my word for it? Because I've been playing RPG's since the dawn of time! (well, for about 16 years anyway, same difference...)

There's not a game out there with more personality and panache. PERIOD. Name just ONE I dare ya! See? You can't! MWAHAHAHA!!!

Seriously, if you can find Bane of the Cosmic Forge and/or Crusaders of the Dark Savant, you will NOT be disappointed (unless you HAVE to have super-duper flashy graphics and sound; btw Sloth, I'll have you know that Crasaders boasts a whopping 256 color palette! Not bad at all!). My 3.5" Crasaders floppies are treasured even to this day. Still got my notebook full of maps for it too and I've got a floppy with my original party members saved from all those years ago. No way I'm EVER deleting them. No siree. Ultimate Wizardry Archives rules if you can get your hands on that.

Freud's right about the Fallout games too, loved 'em, but for the purest fantasy RPG experience available, you gotta go with Bane/Crusaders!
 
Old 11-16-2000, 02:53 AM   #16
Shoujo
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Sloth- Ack...please it wasn't my intention to start a flame war between BG & W&W or anything. I prefer the first person view myself. I do wish it were a bit more realistic though. Like being able to maybe select one of the characters and view the world in first person from that person's perspective while having the rest of the party follow that character. I would like to be able to look at the rest of my party (other than just their portraits, and paper dolls) during combat.

Recent games have spoiled me too much with all the eye-candy they provide... I can only play games with dated graphics which I played in the past and had positive experiences with. My friend gave me a copy of the Ultima Collection and I desperately tried to like them (especially Ultima 4) but the graphics... I just couldn't make myself play...

Not to mention I just have to somehow justify (to myself) the cost of my computer (basically a very expensive gaming machine, which also occasionally gets used for work). Graphics intensive games help me do that. Having to use MoSlo on the other hand makes me think (I'm the type that thinks of the past in terms of "What ifs..." and "I should'ves...") of all the money I poured down the drain a few years ago...

They should have the Wizardry Archives at the Interplay Store online... Believe I got mine there (was a life-saver especially because that was the summer I had a minimum wage job painting buildings)
 
Old 11-16-2000, 04:06 AM   #17
freudianslip
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Bane and Crusaders! Man, I'd almost forgotten about those.. I have yet to finish them, as my computer had a major melt down when I was about 1/3rd of the way through bane, and I lost my hard drive; now that I have my new system, I'm going to have to get those bad boys installed again. I remember being very impressed.

Did anyone here play the "gold-box" series from SSI? I still have fond memories of shelling out $150 for an extra floppy drive for my 8088 so I could play Pool.. heh.
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Old 11-16-2000, 05:15 AM   #18
xenotoca
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Freud
yes played all the gold box games and of course the final Fantasy realms unlimited adventures were they released the engine and you could make your own. These are still available as boxed sets as I have seen them advertised online.
Combat a click fest in Daggerfall shurley you jest W&W is a click fest in daggerfall you held down the mouse (you could see your hand and weapon on screen in front of you) and the weapon followed the mouse. You could hack, slash or stab, dont know if it made a difference but you at least felt you were fighting and when you were a werewolf those two hairy paws scything away at your victim were somehow very satisfying (especially if it was some innocent maiden)
THe daggerfall followup you are thinking of was redguard, not there finest hour.
THe up and coming Morrowind is the actual followup.
Am I the only one ever to have played Cybermage.
 
Old 11-16-2000, 06:19 AM   #19
Squee!
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Jagged Alliance 2.
Brilliant game.
The end.

=)
 
Old 11-16-2000, 08:55 AM   #20
GlennRN
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Great: Wiz 6 & 7.

Good The Elder Scroll, The Gold Box Series,Ultima 4, Planetscape, Diablo 1. Jagged Alliance 1 and 2. The first 2 Realms of Arcainia. Fallout. BG1 and IWD.

Fair Daggerfall,Kings Quest (most recent)

Just My 2 cents.
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