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Old 06-05-2010, 04:56 PM   #31
John D Harris
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

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I am still stuck on you messing up and vanishing for a week because you got owned. Let's stay focused.
Ahh that explains alot... so you can't do more then one thing at once.... well you could start off easy with something like walking and chewing gum as the same time, but do what you want.
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Old 06-05-2010, 08:52 PM   #32
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

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Ahh that explains alot... so you can't do more then one thing at once.... well you could start off easy with something like walking and chewing gum as the same time, but do what you want.
*Takes notes* "Walk and chew gum...".
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Old 06-17-2010, 10:00 AM   #33
Cerek
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

Rolling Stones has an interesting article on the oil spill. It's rather long, but gives a comprehensive account of events surrounding the disaster.

The Spill, The Scandal and the President
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Old 06-17-2010, 05:57 PM   #34
SecretMaster
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

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Rolling Stones has an interesting article on the oil spill. It's rather long, but gives a comprehensive account of events surrounding the disaster.

The Spill, The Scandal and the President
It's an interesting story and account, but I feel that people are still putting too much blame on the side of the government. BP is solely responsible for this catastrophe. This isn't Obamas fault, it certainly isn't Bush's (I find it incredibly dumbfounding as to why that even gets hinted at in the article), it is BP who fucked up. Certainly there was a failure from the regulatory aspect, but fundementally BP wasn't doing what they were supposed to be doing from the get-go.
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Old 06-17-2010, 05:59 PM   #35
SecretMaster
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

On a side note, here is an editorial I submitted to my local newspaper.

Oil Spill a Time for Reflection

The Deepwater Horizon disaster in the Gulf Coast is a catastrophe by any standard. The temporary moratorium placed on offshore drilling in the U.S. as a result of this spill has irritated some, but in retrospect, is the right decision. With this moratorium in place and this environmental disaster, I am hoping that our country as a whole seriously stops to reflect on our current energy situation.

The United States peaked in its oil production in 1970; at this time, the U.S. produced roughly 9.5 million barrels per day. Today, the U.S. produces around 5.0 million barrels per day. This drop is not due to any political based decision; it simply is due to the natural geologic decline of U.S. oil fields. Barring some extreme scenario of territorial expansion, it is impossible to ever reach those early production levels.

Energy is the lifeblood of all economies. Our great economic success and output in the world is due to applying more energy into the economic system. This energy has primarily been in the form of oil, therefore in order to maintain economic growth, we need to increasingly add energy (oil!) into the system.

The political question then becomes, "do we use our oil or do we rely on other countries for oil?" We're all aware of the ramifications of being reliant on foreign oil inputs. For this reason, part of Obama's energy independence strategy has been to rely on our offshore fields to supplement our production. This is the start of many serious decisions and policies that need to be addressed within our country.

The Deepwater Horizon spill occurred in one of the most ecologically productive systems in the U.S. The whole of this coastal/estuarine ecosystem contributes to a staggering amount of our species. There are obvious benefits we have received from these ecosystems, such as tourism revenues, fishing based economies, etc. Hidden more indirectly however are ecosystem processes which humans directly benefit from. More subtle benefits such as nitrogen fixation, waste treatment, nutrient cycling, and soil formation are crucial components that humans use, but take for granted. An analysis at valuing these ecosystem services estimated that at a minimum, coastal and estuarine ecosystems contribute approximately $26,000 per hectare each year. Wetlands, also affected by this oil spill, are worth approximately $15,000 per hectare each year. When examining how many hectares this spill can potentially affect, the costs can quickly multiply to millions of dollars of ecosystem services lost per year.

With this moratorium in place, I am hoping that our country can truly start to reflect on our current situation. Should we drill in such ecologically sensitive and valuable areas? What chance of failure can be deemed acceptable, and are the ramifications acceptable? As a country, we must collectively make these decisions, and accept the consequences. There are no easy answers or decisions to be made, but they do require all aspects to be thoroughly examined.
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Old 06-17-2010, 10:10 PM   #36
Timber Loftis
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

You know, BP had 2 prior spills that provided earlier opportunities to have this moment of realization. Oh, cleanup for those 2 spills is also still ongoing.

You've read about what happened to the MMS under Bush. Literally sharing hookers & blow with the mining companies they were supposed to regulate.
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Old 06-17-2010, 10:35 PM   #37
SpiritWarrior
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

Man, they grilled that BP CEO today, anyone watch it? He came off as one of the stupidest people on the planet - one congressman even joked that the only question he answered was whether or not "today is Thursday".
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Old 06-17-2010, 10:46 PM   #38
Cerek
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

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You know, BP had 2 prior spills that provided earlier opportunities to have this moment of realization. Oh, cleanup for those 2 spills is also still ongoing.

You've read about what happened to the MMS under Bush. Literally sharing hookers & blow with the mining companies they were supposed to regulate.
And Obama made almost no changes when he took over.
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Old 06-17-2010, 11:11 PM   #39
SecretMaster
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

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Man, they grilled that BP CEO today, anyone watch it? He came off as one of the stupidest people on the planet - one congressman even joked that the only question he answered was whether or not "today is Thursday".
To be fair, he's a businessman and not a politician. I don't exect any CEO in these circumstances to be able to deal with our clowngress.

I'm not trying to defend the actions of BP here, I think they fucked up big time. I'm not pleased with the long-term magnitude of this situation. It's really bad. But I think a lot of people are missing the bigger picture. Our wonderful media certainly has done so, but I expected so.

We have a large number of Americans becoming a massively angry force. The entire body of lawmakers and policy deciders of our government are trying to get their 15 minutes of fame by attacking this CEO and feeding on public feeling for their own self-interest. The country is slowly turning this into some sort of political firestorm and having it devolve into partisan politics. It's turning into a giant circus, like every major news story. I'm thoroughly disgusted at what I see transpiring.

While all these shenanigins are going on, here is what I see. I see an oil spill that is foreshadowing of larger, more worrying concerns. BP was certainly cutting corners somewhere, which lead to this mega disaster, or at least that is what I've heard early on when this happened (I don't know if anything has been "proven" yet). Why were they cutting corners? Sure greed and profit had a large role in this. But a lot of profits go back into reinvestments in the company to fund future drilling. Oil extraction isn't as profitable as people think it is, and the margins are getting slimmer and slimmer. Why are they getting slimmer; because we are increasingly relying on deepwater, offshore drilling to get our oil. Why is this so? Is it perhaps because we've used up most of the easy to get oil? Hmm...

This spill is reflective of so many looming problems and societal questions that need to be raised and addressed. Of all the things to be discussing and arguing about, everyone is focused on some of the more trivial (and quite frankly, stupid) aspects.
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Old 06-18-2010, 02:03 PM   #40
Papa Schlumpf
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Default Re: Giant Plumes of Oil... A way to clean those up?

Wow. Further proof that today's politics have polarized so much that Republican politicians really are little more than stereotypical comic book villains now.

Quote:
GOP congressman apologizes to BP for ‘$20 billion shakedown’

We're sorry that the government wants to penalize you for creating the worst environmental disaster in the history of the United States, one Republican congressman has suggested to BP.

During a hearing of the House Energy and Commerce Committee on Thursday, Rep. Joe Barton (R-TX) called the $20 billion escrow fund that BP has promised to establish a "shakedown" and apologized to BP Tony Hayward.

"I'm speaking totally for myself and I'm not speaking for the Republican Party and I'm not speaking for anybody in the House of Representatives but myself, but I'm ashamed of what happened in the White House yesterday," Barton began.

"I think it's a tragedy of the first proportion that a private corporation can be subjected to what I would characterize as a shakedown," he continued, "in this case, a $20 billion shakedown with the Attorney General of the United States -- who is legitimately conducting a criminal investigation and has every right to do so to protect the interests of the American people -- participating in what amounts to a $20 billion slush fund that's unprecedented in our nation's history, that's got no legal standing, and that I think sets a terrible precedent for the future."

"I'm only speaking for myself," Barton repeated. "I'm not speaking for anybody else, but I apologize. I do not want to live in a country where any time a citizen or a corporation does something that is legitimately wrong and is subject to some sort of political pressure that is, again, in my words, amounts to a shakedown. So I apologize."


In a statement, White House press secretary Robert Gibbs blasted Barton following the hearing:

What is shameful is that Joe Barton seems to have more concern for big corporations that caused this disaster than the fishermen, small business owners and communities whose lives have been devastated by the destruction. Congressman Barton may think that a fund to compensate these Americans is a ‘tragedy’, but most Americans know that the real tragedy is what the men and women of the Gulf Coast are going through right now. Members from both parties should repudiate his comments.

Barton, who was chairman of the Energy and Commerce Committee when the Republicans held a majority in the House and is now its ranking member, is well known for his close ties to the energy industry. According to OpenSecrets.org, over the course of his career Barton's top industry donor has been the oil and gas industry, for a total of nearly $1.5 million in contributions.

Barton has almost always stuck by his donors. A profile at Texans for Public Justice states, "Barton stuck provisions in the 2003 energy bill to give the Dallas-Fort Worth region more time to flunk clean-air standards. The bill failed because of another Barton-championed provision to shield the petrochemical industry from liability for the carcinogenic gasoline additive MTBE. ... Westar Energy got Barton to insert special provisions into 2002 energy legislation to let Westar split off its regulated utility from its heavily indebted other businesses--a split that would facilitate saddling ratepayers with $1 billion Westar’s non-utility debts."

Barton was also an early global warming skeptic. In July 2005, the Washington Post's David Ignatius commented, "I can't remember anything quite as nasty -- or as politically skewed -- as Rep. Joe Barton's recent attack on scientists whose views on global warming he doesn't like."

Barton had sent letters to three climate change scientists "demanding information about what he claimed were 'methodological flaws and data errors' in their studies of global warming." The bullying tone of these letters was so pronounced that even a fellow Republican who chaired the House Committee on Science cautioned, "My primary concern about your investigation is that its purpose seems to be to intimidate scientists rather than to learn from them, and to substitute Congressional political review for scientific peer review. This would be pernicious."
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