Hey Guys! Check out this epiphany!

[Sir Kenyth]

I think this guy may be a genius! This is a great article I found. Please read through it and give me your opinion!


It's an endless mystery; women claim that they want a nice and caring man, but when you inspect the evidence, the only thing that will make a woman's heart go thump is the attitude of the macho, egotistical, self-serving male.
an invitation


Mike Hubberd, the producer of the Debra Duncan Show decided to see if he could find the answers to such a mystery and invited Renee Piane (author of Love Mechanics), Neil Scott (Psychotherapist), Cowboy Bill, Chris Jericho (WWF wrestler), and yours truly to debate why women keep kicking nice guys to the curb and welcoming in the jerks.
bring out de-bait


Needless to say, everyone had their respective opinion, but the ones that caught my attention were Ms. Piane's remark about traumatic experiences, and Chris Jericho's "it's all bullsh*t" outburst.
emotional void


Renee Piane remarked that when women are attracted to jerks, it's because of an emotional event that occurred at some point in their lives.
According to Piane, the most common event is when the woman loses her father at a very young age. Usually, this emotional void leads her to seek any man to fulfill this void, and when she finds him, she becomes so attached that she'll just take any abuse thrown at her.
This explanation makes sense. However, it only explains why women are addicted to and stay in abusive relationships. But it did not offer any explanation as to why women are attracted to jerks to begin with. After all, I know a lot of women who come from a stable family environment and still date jerks.
bad boy is a nice guy


Of all the comments that were exchanged back and forth between the guests, the dumbest one had to come from the genius wrestler (why does that not surprise me?) Chris Jericho.
Mr. Jericho claims to be a nice guy, and what he portrays in the ring is very different from his real personality. When asked what his thoughts were about nice guys finishing last, Chris went into his whole wrestling spiel shouting, "It's all bullsh*t, I'm a nice guy and I don't finish last. Just be yourself and you'll meet lots of fine people." That sounds perfect in a magical world where stars are flying around your head after the The Rock shows you the people's elbow.
Of course any nice guy with celebrity status, a fat bank account (even though it doesn't look like it by his fashion sense -- wearing tights for so many years will do that to a man), and an exciting bad boy persona will keep a woman interested.
no more groupies


But take away Jericho's celebrity status, wealth and bad boy persona, and let's see how far his nice guy attitude will take him, or how many women will fall at his feet.
So I guess Jericho's just going to have to keep acting like a bad boy to stay popular in wrestling, and now that the WWF owns the WCW, Mr. Jericho might have to become a little more mean, especially if he wants to reach superstar status with new bad boys coming to his playground.
curt knows


I know why women prefer jerks over nice guys. It's actually very easy to explain. In fact, once I'm finished, every nice guy is going to want to enroll in Curt's How To Be Her Dream Jerk seminar. But before continuing, it's important to clarify what constitutes jerks and nice guys.
the nice guy


The nice guy cannot set his priorities straight. He lives to please everyone around him at all costs -- even if it means he has to sacrifice his own happiness.
In other words, he's a pushover who can't say no to anyone and lets himself get walked on. He's so nice that he'd even do his girlfriend's ex a favor.
The nice guy does not practice the game of challenge and eventually gets dumped as the woman in his life becomes bored with all the niceness.
the jerk


A jerk wears his agenda on his sleeve. He's a strong, dominant, untamable man who knows the dating game and how to prioritize his life -- putting himself first. He won't let people walk all over him, and by doing so, he effectively becomes a challenge.
A lot of people think the jerk has low self-esteem and needs to prey on other souls in order to make himself feel better. I say rubbish. It's a lot more than low self-esteem.
Humans consider themselves civilized, but the fact remains that we're still animals and civilization is only skin deep. The reality is that we have millions of years of instincts programmed within us and ten thousand years of civilization will not silence the animal instincts within.
So when you notice the jerk manifest, it is not because he has low self-esteem, but rather because he knows the rules of the game: survival of the fittest.
After all, when we observe a lion copulating with all the lionesses, we don't say that the lion has low self-esteem. Instead, we say that the lion is a dominant male ensuring that his genes get passed on to the next generation. Well, why can't we accept that the human male has the same instincts? Food for thought, right?
the jerk has his act together


Through time, we evolve and adapt to our environment -- including our mating rituals. So if the bad boy strategy didn't work, it would have been discontinued many centuries ago. But because it works, jerks continue to flourish.
Remember; if it isn't broken don't fix it. And that's exactly what jerks are doing. Women are obviously interested in certain jerk behaviors. As long as women are demanding a certain type of behavior (the jerk appeal), there will always be a healthy supply of jerks to go around.
what women want


A few months ago, I attended a single women group meeting. I took this opportunity to ask the women what kind of a man they're looking for. Every woman claimed that she wanted a nice man.
I asked if the nice guy is "the perfect guy", and all of them agreed that there is no such thing as a perfect guy. Then I asked the women to assume for a moment that perfection was attainable and if so, would it eventually become a disappointment or lead to boredom. Amazingly, 90% of the women said yes.
Thus if the perfect man is a myth and perfection leads to boredom, these women were essentially saying that the perfect man doesn't exist and even if he does, he's boring. So what do women want or rather, what do women need?
what women need


What women want and what they need are two different things. You see, civilization dictates that women want a nice family-oriented man. But evolution tells women they need a strong dominant male to mate with and ensure strong offspring. Unfortunately for them, it's their animal instincts that override their learned behavior.
It is not that women deliberately look for jerks, but rather, they're attracted to certain behaviors that satisfy their genetically programmed mating instincts. This has a lot to do with estrogen -- the emotion hormone -- as opposed to testosterone -- the reaction hormone. Therefore women are attracted to men who can make them feel, feel, feel excited -- not bored.
Unfortunately, these behaviors are also the ones observed mainly within the jerk persona. So women are not bad people at all, they have no choice but to fall for these dominant, strong and untamable males.
the truth hurts... we're animals


We like to think of ourselves as the superior beings of this planet. In order to separate ourselves from the animal kingdom, we come up with civil explanations for our behaviors such as women love jerks because they think they can change them, they're exciting, there's a mystique element, bad guys are cooler, jerks are better in bed, and women feel sorry for them because they are lower life forms.
But the reality is that women are at the mercy of their genetically programmed instincts. The sooner we realize this, the faster men will understand what women need and combine it with the chivalrous traits the women want.
If men can have a balance of those dominant behaviors that women instinctively need and those nice behaviors that women want in order to remain satisfied, they'll maintain a lethal combination that will attract and retain any woman. Here are some of the traits you should have on your list.
Women want a man who:
· Can make them think.
· Can make them feel excitement, sexy, and turned on rather than bored.
· Can prioritize his life and doesn't let anyone walk over him.
· Is not afraid to voice his opinion.
· Keeps them on their toes through challenge.
· Holds and maintains an element of mystery.
· Is spontaneous.
· Gives them space and freedom, and keeps his own space.
· Is a lover, not a son.
· Is a Romeo, not a Fabio.
· Is chivalrous.
curt's corner


So what did you learn today? If nice guys are what women want, and jerks are what women need, it is important to keep a balanced character towards the relationship.
Get it on!

[Black Knight]

Wow - that was long... [img]smile.gif[/img] I dunno why some women like the "bad boy" type, but it would never work for me, so I just go with the 'Shit-Eating-Grin' that has worked well for me so far...

BK

[SSJ4Sephiroth]

im with BK... cant be a bad boy, so im just gonna agree with whatever life throws at me. and of course, turn on my charm whenever i feel the need... which is often. (although i will certainly get physical with anyone who messes with my woman... part of that chivalry/honor thing)

[Silver Cheetah]

As a female who has had, well, let's just say more than her fair share of guys, both fabulous and jerky, I have to say 'you learn by experience'. Some women are more able to learn than others, some take a lot longer or don't learn at all (especially common if they've been very damaged or traumatised in childhood).

My dad was and is one of the biggest jerks out, and when I was a big eyed wondering little cutie in my teens and twenties, I did go for a few jerks - as being what I was comfortable with.

You go with what you know when you're young - and if what you know is violent crap, then you're likely to go for that. It's not nice, but it's familiar. There's also the eternal (doomed from the outset) hope of 'making it better', - getting 'daddy' to love you and treat you right, changing the pattern.

Once I got to my thirties, I saw the light, realising one day that the world was full of nice men - why was I putting up with shit from idiots? From that day on, I never went out with another jerk, - nowadays, I can spot 'em a mile off. I have been known to cross the road to avoid a leering jerk.

Personally, I think the most important thing before entering into a relationship with any man, jerk or otherwise, is to spend a little time finding out who YOU are, - what you want, what you like, and so on. That doesn't mean becoming a ball breaker or man hater - I'm talking about being a person who is centred in themself and happy with who they are. (Like lovely, talented, gorgeous, clever moi )

After a while, you might find, to your surprise, that you don't need a man to give you these things (specially self confident, self esteem, love etc - it is possible to find them within yourself, at which point you are free to enjoy a man (yummy scrumminess mmmm....) and all he has to offer, without 'needing' him to be this way or that way.

If you don't like a bloke the way he is, well, why bother getting with him, or staying with him? Go find one you do like, or do without for a bit. As I intimated at the start of my post, I've had more men than hot dinners in my time (ok, maybe a slight exaggeration ), and I can tell you for a fact doing without now and then is a lot more fun that a lot of people make it out to be!

Cheers, me dears!! Bottoms up!!

[Garnet FalconDance]

I'm with the lovely Cheetah on this one. No one has the responsibility, the right,or the ability to make you happy if you aren't happy with yourself already. Jerks? No way. But nice guys aren't all pushovers and welcome mats, either. I happened to be married to a 'nice guy' who can be a jerk, but *never* has he ever been the sort of bombastic asshole described here as 'jerk'.

Read "Women want a man who:..." and you have my husband perfectly. All wrapped up in a nice package.

::blows raspberries at all those people who insist on putting definite lables on everyone::

[Morgeruat]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Silver Cheetah:
Once I got to my thirties, I saw the light, realising one day that the world was full of nice men - why was I putting up with shit from idiots? From that day on, I never went out with another jerk, - nowadays, I can spot 'em a mile off. I have been known to cross the road to avoid a leering jerk.

---

ok, but what hope does that offer me, a nice guy in his early 20's(and the even younger readers)trying to date people my own age, if it takes so long for women to figure out what they want...

... sorry if i seem slightly annoyed but i got dumped yesterday for a jerk

[Garnet FalconDance]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Morgeruat:


ok, but what hope does that offer me, a nice guy in his early 20's(and the even younger readers)trying to date people my own age, if it takes so long for women to figure out what they want...

... sorry if i seem slightly annoyed but i got dumped yesterday for a jerk

---

Are you looking for someone to date casually or for a long term? 'Cause that's two totally different ballgames!

For the same matter, what is it you look for in a woman? I know the old standard, there's the kind of girl you want to date and there's the kind you take home to meet the parents.....

[Sir Kenyth]

Remember guys, the point of the article isn't why women stay with guys who make them unhappy. It is about what characteristics attract women to a certain person over another to begin with. Most young women I've talked to agree that they simply FEEL more attracted to one person over another. They can't put their finger on exactly what. They simply FEEL more attracted to one over another. Looks are a big part of it, but the other part is an instinctive "Dominant Alpha Male" attraction. One guy seems boring and the other exciting. I've been slowly changing my personality over the past few years from being passive to being more agressive and assertive. It seems that if other women want you, even if you're only playing with them, other women find you more attractive for some reason. Be loud, be proud, and don't let anything get in your way. Do this and all of a sudden you have a boost in your attractiveness. Strange, huh? Because the minute you get into a serious relationship you're expected to be sweet and sensitive too! This is what she has LEARNED is supposed to be a good mate. I think instinct plays a great deal in initial attraction and is a viable theory. I think instinct is a strong part of human nature and can explain a lot. Not just dating.

[Gaelic]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Garnet FalconDance:


Are you looking for someone to date casually or for a long term? 'Cause that's two totally different ballgames!

For the same matter, what is it you look for in a woman? I know the old standard, there's the kind of girl you want to date and there's the kind you take home to meet the parents.....

---

I think the problem lies in categorizing. My personal feeling is that if you go out looking for someone to date, you will fail. You may "hook up" or have some flings, but you won't really date anyone. My successes with the fairer sex have only come when I met someone while pursuing my own interests. Then I date them because I enjoy spending time with them, then sometimes something more serious developed. Thus there was no short or long term plan at the outset, just an allowance for life to develop.

The categorization stuff makes it tough on the nice guys as well because IMHO women want to date one sort of guy and marry another. Thus, as I find myself in my late 20's I find it easier to attract women in general than it was in my teens or early 20's. I figure this is because the stable, kind, and giving qualities I have are more attractive to women who have decided it is "time to settle down."

Of course, that presents its own set of problems, hehe.

[Silver Cheetah]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Morgeruat:


ok, but what hope does that offer me, a nice guy in his early 20's(and the even younger readers)trying to date people my own age, if it takes so long for women to figure out what they want...

... sorry if i seem slightly annoyed but i got dumped yesterday for a jerk

---

Sorry you got dumped, sweetheart... Never mind, it frees you up for a female with slightly better instincts......

Not all women are screwed up in childhood by dreadful fathers - you may be lucky enough to meet someone who's 'normal'. (Ugh, hate that word...)

Another aspect of the problem has to do with the type of male stereotypes that are projected as desirable by films, TV, advertising all over. Both women and men are brainwashed by these stereotypes, to some extent, into seeing the characteristics portrayed as desirable.

So what you're looking for is a. a woman who hasn't been screwed up by bad parenting, b. who is aware enough (of herself and the world around her) not to fall for the old macho male crap.

Good luck, dude! (And don't forget, many of us slightly more experienced females are not adverse to a guy that's younger. I went through a whole decade when I only went out with men a lot younger than myself..... ) Get creative! Explore the options!