The definitive monk thread

[Aerich]

I need one. The manual is SO unhelpful in explaining the pros and cons of different decisions.

Here's the basic information, with questions to follow.

Monks get:

Stunning Blow (lvl 1?) - make opponent save or be stunned
Evasion (lvl 1) - reflex save to completely avoid spell; if failed, save normally
Deflect arrows (2) - +1 AC against missiles
Still Mind (3) - +2 against Enchantment school
Purity of Body (5) - immunity to disease
Wholeness of Body (7) - heal 2x level, once per day
Improved Evasion (9) - half damage on a failed save
Ki Strike (10) - does damage to creatures with damage reduction as if striking with a +1 weapon
Diamond Body (11) - immunity to poison
Diamond Soul (13) - spell resistance of 10 + level
Quivering Palm (15) - kills creature unless Fortitude save is made
Timeless Body (17) - immune to fatigue
Empty Body (19) - enter the ethereal state once a day for every two levels
Perfect Self (20) - damage reduction 20/+1

In addition, monks get extra movement every 3 levels, a +1 AC bonus every 5, Ki Strike improves to +3 by level 16, and they get a faster attacks/round progression than any other class and have the best saving throws.

Ok, now the questions:

I read somewhere that monks lose the benefits of the unarmed bonus if they have a BAB of higher than +1 from another class. Is this true?

What feats work the best for monks? Can you ignore the feats that increase saves? Will Improved Initiative work for a monk's unarmed attacks?

I note that Bozos of Bones recommended Power Attack, Cleave, Dodge, Dirty Fighting, and Improved Critical. Any others that come to mind?

Feel free to post any other monk-related tips or questions about tactics, ability score allotment, multiclassing, skills, feats, etc.

[Marty4]

the BAB rule that you heard is IIRC completely false.

Bozos of Bones' recommended feats are the main ones for a monk. I also like giving them WF in a ranged weapon, though that's optional.

Here are good monk stats:

STR 18
DEX 18
CON 16
INT 3
WIS 18
CHA 3

This is a completely powergamed human monk. Good monks are Drow and Svirneblin.

A single class monk is very powerful, but monks are good for multiclassing with other classes. One of the most untouchable character classes in the game is a monk1/dreadmaster of Bane deep gnome. Adding a monk level to a cleric allows the cleric to get an obscene amount of wisdom and slap the modifier onto the AC, making it more powerful than any armor in the game.

For example, start with 20 wisdom, add another 7 over leveling up, +4 for normal and HoF banite quests, +2 total from both of the divine transference potions, and +5 from Every God's Ring gives you 36 Wisdom, meaning an armor of 13 with no limit to dexterity bonus.

[Bozos of Bones]

I'd make it more of a monk 13/Dreadmaster 17. You get the spells and you get +2 to AC. You also get a few nice benefits, like magic resistance and diamond body.
Improved Initiative is a broken feat, does nothing to non-spellcasters. Only spellcasters cast spells a bit faster with it.
A monk at 20th level will become untouchable weapons for it's Damage Resistance and AC, untouchable by magic for it's Magic Resistance and saves and will kill anything with a touch. Pureclass monks are IMHO better than multi if you're going for more than the WIS-to-AC bonus.
If you're willing, download the WeiDu Ease of Use mod to add DEX to attack rolls, instead of STR, and a couple of other nice benefits.

[Aerich]

You can add me to the list of gamers that love using monks.

Aside from sneaking up to or charging up to orc archers and whaling the tar out of them, monks are great for making enemies bunch up. My latest trick, which I am sure 3/4 of monk/rogue users do on a regular basis, is to take advantage of the Evasion ability. Agannazar's Scorcher is a great spell for doing loads of damage with a monk in front. You can also toss the various area-effect fire potions without worry.

Tonight I fought the battle for the Shaengarne bridge (for the first time). The monk was invaluable for her ability to run down and stun the spellcaster. I've also given her Rapid Shot, so she's good up close AND from range.

[shadowolf03]

Hm...IMHO, Rapid Shot for a Monk may have been a wasted feat. Could have been better spent on something like Dodge, Dirty Fighting etc...

[Aerich]

Maybe. But I gave the monk Rapid Shot for two reasons: one, she's a svirfneblin, and the 3-level ECL penalty means she has very low HP in the start. She does have a good AC, but one critical hit and she's gone. I'm keeping her out of the front lines for now, although she does make forays after the battle is started to get after spellcasters and archers. Two, my party lacks a dedicated archer, so I thought I'd make up for it by having two characters who are pretty decent in that respect. With such a high Dex, it seems a waste not to get as much out of her as I can, missile-wise.

Rapid Shot is also nice for run-and-gun style sneak attacks with a monk. You can hit stealth, sneak up to something, hit it, run away and get separation because you have extra movement, hammer it with Rapid Shot, run around a corner, hide again... It's a good way to cut the odds while bringing a horde of monsters back to the party.

Rapid Shot adds quite a bit of diversity to a monk, although I agree that it puts off turning it into a true melee terror. But I've got two tanks already, and a bit of a shortage of heavy-hitting missile users. It has worked well so far.

[Marty4]

With evasion and magic resistance behind it, the monk can become an untouchable decoy. I had a duo game where the monk ran into melee against a swarm of barbarians and my cleric of Lathander cast fire storm followed by flamestrike. About 150 damage to all enemies, and the monk was still at full health to clean up the survivors.

Good choice on the rapid shot. I did that, too, and I have no regrets.