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Old 01-03-2001, 07:38 PM   #41
Armisael
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Fair enough. Advanced specialisation in BG2, now I've considered it, is pretty shitty, so you were right about the barbarian. They also level up at the same rate as a normal fighter. Many apologies.
The anti-paladin thing, however, I still believe is a crock. I can understand where you're coming from, but if there were going to be evil-only kits, they shouldn't just be the good-only kits turned around on themselves. A paladin is a holy knight whose sole purpose is to right wrong. If they all swore to different gods it might make more sense, but they worship Torm, see? An anti-paladin is like a ten foot halfling, it's an oxymoron. Same goes for rangers, they're wanderers sworn to protect the land and its people. What's an evil ranger, someone who wants to burn the land and kill the people? In a pinch, evils or neutrals can always just play berserkers, barbarians, or, heaven forbid, a pureclass fighter, even dualling it to a cleric or mage if they want spellcasting, which is what I did. I play chaotic neutral and evil characters myself, mind, so I'm not just trying to be judge, jury and executioner here. To me, pallies and rangers are more like exclusive clubs than anything else.
 
Old 01-03-2001, 07:42 PM   #42
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Personally I've always played a ranger type. BG 1 I loved my ranger, Hide in shadows and sneak next to a known cast then Wham! Caster is in serious trouble now. Trabsfered it to BG 2, and despite the fact that yes every class can dual wield now, but I still like the ranger. I guess I assosciate better with rangers. AS far as a class I would least play, most druids fit that bill. I actually go with clerics over druids. Not only do clerics get all the spells, but they turn undead rather well, real nice when in the shadow temple. If you have too many shadows, well the trusty cleric can just stand aside and turn, causing them to run or even be destroyed if high enough. Goes with any undead. I think most people only used Aerie for her healing and her mage spells, but I was rather devastating with her. With Bracers of defense AC 3, and a few other items, Aerie was running around with her mace of disruption, that necklace that prevents level drains, and her undead turning abilities and she devastated undead, including vampires. I think clerics often get looked by. I think maybe Lathander clerics should have been given the turning bonus like the original FR rules, but that's just me.
 
Old 01-03-2001, 07:48 PM   #43
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Oh, I do however want to comment on this whole anti paladin thing. The way I see it is this, why should only the "good" gods have holy warriors? I felt the same way with the demihuman races getting the shaft as far as paladins went, leaving humans sole rights to become paladins (Unless you count saurials) I am so glad the third edition changed that so every race can be a paladin. I always felt that every god, good evil or neutral should have holy (unholy or whatever) knights to serve them. Seems far more balancing to me.
 
Old 01-03-2001, 07:54 PM   #44
Ertai, Wizard Adept
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Well, your reasoning is fair but I still think there should be more evil kits. Youre right maybe they shouldnt be just Antipaladins and antirangers but... maybe a sort of fighter-necromancer with only a few spells and 2 * in weapons spec but able to cast magic while wearing armor ?? Or a shadow-summoner with bonuses on the number of creatures capable to summon, special shadow summoning abilities and more duration of the summoned creatures but only able to cast abjuration and summon spells ?? I think they would be fine. Please if anyone is with me post here you EVIL ALIGNED KITS !!!

Oh and another question. In shadowkeeper ive found a VERY good sword called something like blackarm. Where is it ?? It´s definitely good (level draining, increases your strength and speed...). I tried a halforc berserker dual wielding this and the equaliser and was pretty killer.
 
Old 01-03-2001, 08:43 PM   #45
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Halo, clerics don't get all the spells. Druids are used because of insect plague and their faultless elemental summoning, and the fact that they get stoneskins can make them better at tanking than a cleric. Yes, most people only use Aerie for her healing and mage spells. That's because she's a mage/cleric, has pretty bad strength, the second lowest HP in the game and can't wear armour. I give the mace of disruption to Minsc or Viconia.
And paladins only serve one god, Torm. Does it actually make sense to you to have a 'paladin' whose creed is to make right things wrong? Perhaps it's viable in bizarro land, but I think it makes about as much sense as tits on a bull.
Let's see, a solution for evil alignments? It's tough. You'd need to think up a class that has its own creed and purpose, and that implies order. Bah, work sucks the creativity out of me, I'll let other people think of stuff.
The blackrazor can only be found in the endgame, where you only have it for ten minutes or so.
 
Old 01-03-2001, 08:44 PM   #46
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Um, I belive you are referring to the Blackrazor, one of the more devastating long swords, but only available at the very end of the game. I agree that the Cavalier is the best paladin, even at a low level. With the Holy Avenger, mine is a kiling machine. I nearly finished Firkragg's dungeon by myself, at the measly level of 9 ( leveled up to 10 in the middle of the dungeon). All I need now is that amulet that makes you immune to level drain, and I am set. =)
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Old 01-03-2001, 08:46 PM   #47
Yorick
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Now, now, Ertai. I think you're fibbing about prefering a naked lvl 1 Beggar aren't you....
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Old 01-03-2001, 08:59 PM   #48
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Note: The amulet of power can't be used by nonmages (or nonbards). Hence the power of the kensai mage.
 
Old 01-03-2001, 09:14 PM   #49
Archlich Azuth
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fighter-mages-anything, no spells with armour, low levels, need i say more. in the anti paladin debate the should be allowed, warriors of evil destorying the forces of good, doing the work of their gods, but shouldn't mystra's have mage spells, gond's have guns and Mask's have thieves skills. and what of antai or whatever from bg1 that served helm????? he even shout "by helm." and you say he serves only torm????? besides the ghizyhti have them.
 
Old 01-03-2001, 09:18 PM   #50
Lord of Alcohol
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I tried the archer. I couldnt stand it. I mean I love shooting with the bow first. They are already down in hit points brfore they get near you. But even using the called shot it didnt seem worth it. After a day and 1/2 of real play I just started over with a fighter and two + in bows and he hits all the time. They get near and then its two-handed sword, bam bam bam done. Most of the time But hey, its a great game made for experimenting. Find what you like!
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