Plotting the murder of Bambi's family!

[adam warlock]

13-year-old got struck by a hunter's stray bullet

she was in her room doing her homework at that time

[Epona]

Originally posted by MagiK: Just a thought here, but ummm what better way for anti-hunting types to curb hunting? Just start making noises about deer having mad cow disease or bad prions or whatever. Hunting would die off and no arguments or debates would be needed. Of course this is just bing instagatory but [img]smile.gif[/img] Its a slow friday morning [img]smile.gif[/img]

Er... sorry Magik, but I have to disagree here! I work for the English agriculture department, in the section that deals with Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy (known to most of the world as mad cow disease). This is not some mad plot by animal rights people - it is a real disease, and a similar (but not the same) disease *is* affecting your deer. I'm all in favour of any attempts to wipe it out, especially since it can be passed to humans, if that is done properly it should not affect hunting in the long-term. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 11-22-2002, 09:10 AM: Message edited by: Epona ]

[Atrayu]

Thats great news Epona! What would cause an outbreak like this? Can they eat any parts at all of the infected deer?

On the other hand statistics show that through careful conservation efforts, there are more deer and turkey in the U.S. then when the pilgrims hit Plymouth. And that is good news to say the least. Just hate to see any animal killed for any reason.

Sorry to hear that Adam.

[Epona]

Originally posted by Atrayu: Thats great news Epona! What would cause an outbreak like this?

There seems to be a certain level of prion disease which occurs naturally in many mammals - such as Creuzfeld Jacob Disease (CJD) in humans, and scrapie in sheep - a predisposition to it seems to be genetically inherited. I don't know about your deer, but in our cows it was predominantly the feeding of animal matter from animals infected with this naturally occurring prion disease which caused BSE on a large scale - since heat treatment used on animal matter fed to ruminants does not seem to deactivate the disease. Consequently the increased level of disease led to it being passed on to humans as vCJD (Variant Creuzfeld Jacob Disease) through consumption of infected tissues, probably the brain and other parts of the nervous system, bone marrow, and some offal.

Can they eat any parts at all of the infected deer?

I don't know how much the disease in deer differs to that in cows, and I don't know your govt regulations on what is considered fit for human consumption, so I can only say what we do here. No part of any infected cow is allowed into the food chain. If a cow is showing symptoms it will be culled, and the disease confirmed by post-mortem examination of the brain. The carcass will then be incinerated, and the offspring of the cow traced, culled and incinerated. No cattle over 30 months old can enter the food chain (the disease only rarely occurs in young cattle). Specified Risk Material (those parts of the animal most likely to contain prions) are not allowed into the food chain, are removed whole and incinerated. These include brain, spinal column and vertebra (the head and backbone are removed intact without cutting into the spinal column to prevent potential contamination of surrounding flesh), offal including the tongue, spleen, pancreas etc, and the tongue. The muscle itself is unlikely to contain prions even if the animal is unknowingly infected, so should be safe to eat provided the risky parts are removed safely.

On the other hand statistics show that through careful conservation efforts, there are more deer and turkey in the U.S. then when the pilgrims hit Plymouth. And that is good news to say the least. Just hate to see any animal killed for any reason.

That's certainly good news!

Just to add that of course as an employee of the agric. dept. I am not allowed to give official statements about BSE unless sanctioned to do so. This is my own interpretation, and not an official statement. For more information, please visit the Defra website. < /arsecovering>

[ 11-22-2002, 10:00 AM: Message edited by: Epona ]

[Nachtrafe]

Originally posted by MagiK: quote: Originally posted by The Ornery One: Yea, it's hunting season! I'm hoping my dad and uncles get a deer this year. Gotta love venison steak, sausage or roast. Is it hunting season anywhere else, this weekend?

Made my mouth water just thinking about it [img]smile.gif[/img]

I cook venison steak in a preasure cooker, for about 25 minutes, it comes out so tender that I have to se a spoon to get it out of the cooker. the stuff just falls apart and melts in your mouth...yummy! [/QUOTE]DUDE!! Stop it...you're making my mouth water over here. *goes to look for a [img]graemlins/1drool.gif[/img] napkin.

Hmmmm...Haven't been hunting in awhile, but I miss it. People here in NY are a bit...hmmm...pushy with their gun laws, so my firearms are still back in Idaho. Who knows...maybe next year.

[WillowIX]

LOL Epona! [img]graemlins/biglaugh.gif[/img] That´s a tag I have to remember! [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] I have never understood the point of hunting. You go out shoot a deer and get a nice dinner. Isn´t it more conveniant to call a hunter and get the game/venison delivered at the door step? That´s my kind of hunting

[Nachtrafe]

Originally posted by Epona: quote: Originally posted by Atrayu: Thats great news Epona! What would cause an outbreak like this?

There seems to be a certain level of prion disease which occurs naturally in many mammals - such as Creuzfeld Jacob Disease (CJD) in humans, and scrapie in sheep - a predisposition to it seems to be genetically inherited. I don't know about your deer, but in our cows it was predominantly the feeding of animal matter from animals infected with this naturally occurring prion disease which caused BSE on a large scale - since heat treatment used on animal matter fed to ruminants does not seem to deactivate the disease. Consequently the increased level of disease led to it being passed on to humans as vCJD (Variant Creuzfeld Jacob Disease) through consumption of infected tissues, probably the brain and other parts of the nervous system, bone marrow, and some offal.

Can they eat any parts at all of the infected deer?

I don't know how much the disease in deer differs to that in cows, and I don't know your govt regulations on what is considered fit for human consumption, so I can only say what we do here. No part of any infected cow is allowed into the food chain. If a cow is showing symptoms it will be culled, and the disease confirmed by post-mortem examination of the brain. The carcass will then be incinerated, and the offspring of the cow traced, culled and incinerated. No cattle over 30 months old can enter the food chain (the disease only rarely occurs in young cattle). Specified Risk Material (those parts of the animal most likely to contain prions) are not allowed into the food chain, are removed whole and incinerated. These include brain, spinal column and vertebra (the head and backbone are removed intact without cutting into the spinal column to prevent potential contamination of surrounding flesh), offal including the tongue, spleen, pancreas etc, and the tongue. The muscle itself is unlikely to contain prions even if the animal is unknowingly infected, so should be safe to eat provided the risky parts are removed safely.

On the other hand statistics show that through careful conservation efforts, there are more deer and turkey in the U.S. then when the pilgrims hit Plymouth. And that is good news to say the least. Just hate to see any animal killed for any reason.

That's certainly good news!

Just to add that of course as an employee of the agric. dept. I am not allowed to give official statements about BSE unless sanctioned to do so. This is my own interpretation, and not an official statement. For more information, please visit the Defra website. < /arsecovering>[/QUOTE]Awesome post Epona! [img]smile.gif[/img] Thanks for the info. Back in the Pacific Northwest we always had to worry about 'Beaver Fever'(sorry, I dont know the proper name). It's similiar to Dysentary in effect. It's not deadly(unless you get weakened by dehydration and cant get to help), but it's thoroughly uncomfortable. It is carried by small woodland rodentia(mostly beaver, hence the name) and you can get it by eating undercooked infected meat, or drinking in un-sanitized creek water...erm...apparently it's in the beaver poop. [img]graemlins/1disgust.gif[/img] Fortunately, if you boil the water, or use standard water purification tablets, it takes care of the problem. LOL...We used both when we were camping. The pills, then boiled the water. The pills leave a funky aftertaste, but after you boil it, the taste is mostly gone. With the meat, as long as you make sure you cook it thoroughly, there's no problem.

Fortunately, at least when I was an active hunter, Mad Cow wasn't that big of an issue. Back then it was just E-Coli. :S

[Nachtrafe]

Originally posted by WillowIX: LOL Epona! [img]graemlins/biglaugh.gif[/img] That´s a tag I have to remember! [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] I have never understood the point of hunting. You go out shoot a deer and get a nice dinner. Isn´t it more conveniant to call a hunter and get the game/venison delivered at the door step? That´s my kind of hunting

[img]graemlins/laugh2.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/laugh3.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/biglaugh.gif[/img]

HAHAHAHAHAHA Too funny Willow! HEHE I could get into that sort of hunting myself. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Erm...to respond though...from my own perspective, I hunt because I love the taste of most game animals. There's nothing quite like deer, or elf(MMMMMMMM) or most wild animals. Farm raised geese or turkeys are fine, but they all taste the same. Wild ones taste much different. Each one tastes slightly diffent from another. Has to do, I assume, with their diet, since all farm raised animals are fed pretty much the same thing. Anyhew...that's my :twosents:.

Nacht

EDIT: You know...I was going to edit this for spelling...but the typo is just too damn funny. HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE

[ 11-22-2002, 10:26 AM: Message edited by: Nachtrafe ]

Originally posted by Epona: quote: Originally posted by MagiK: Just a thought here, but ummm what better way for anti-hunting types to curb hunting? Just start making noises about deer having mad cow disease or bad prions or whatever. Hunting would die off and no arguments or debates would be needed. Of course this is just bing instagatory but [img]smile.gif[/img] Its a slow friday morning [img]smile.gif[/img]

Er... sorry Magik, but I have to disagree here! I work for the English agriculture department, in the section that deals with Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy (known to most of the world as mad cow disease). This is not some mad plot by animal rights people - it is a real disease, and a similar (but not the same) disease *is* affecting your deer. I'm all in favour of any attempts to wipe it out, especially since it can be passed to humans, if that is done properly it should not affect hunting in the long-term. [img]smile.gif[/img] [/QUOTE]I know it isn't Epona [img]smile.gif[/img] I was just being silly trying to inject a bit o humor into a sad situation. But you have to admt...it's not a bad plot for PETA to try

[Epona]

Originally posted by MagiK: I know it isn't Epona [img]smile.gif[/img] I was just being silly trying to inject a bit o humor into a sad situation. But you have to admt...it's not a bad plot for PETA to try

It's OK, I realise you were being tongue in cheek - but just wanted to stick my oar in in case anyone thought it was a serious proposition.

I don't like to see cruelty to any living creature, but PETA are really quite quite mad IMO, anyone who puts the lives of animals before the lives of humans has their priorities arse about face. At work we receive all kinds of hate mail from animal rights groups (not all of them, I hasten to add, there are plenty of groups that campaign peacefully), including things like rotting meat, razor blades taped under the flap of envelopes, packets claiming to contain anthrax, even nailbombs, that sort of thing. Fortunately all our post is screened [img]smile.gif[/img]

I don't mind the idea of shooting animals too much but wouldn't do it myself, and if it is for food then fine, I don't like it if it's just for the sake of it. It's probably less cruel than what goes on in slaughterhouses anyway!