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Old 09-24-2002, 08:59 AM   #11
Larry_OHF
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Join Date: March 1, 2001
Location: Midlands, South Carolina
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It was placed on TV to help police track her down, after the family refused to tell them where she was. The sister was even charged with felony failure to report chid abuse.The accused lady saw her self on TV and turned herself in. There were no bruises found on the child eight days after the incident, but prosecuters still want to charge her with the abuse. I beleive body injuries may be needed to hold a case...but I am not studying law, so I do not know what the real law is.

[ 09-24-2002, 09:00 AM: Message edited by: Larry_OHF ]
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Old 09-24-2002, 09:09 AM   #12
Hexa
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Join Date: September 17, 2002
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Well there are ways to hit somebody without externaly showing for much dmg... but then we are mising the general argument here ... people shouldn;t hit there kids...

Ofcourse it is hard to draw the line between a slap on the bottoms or hands when they have done something wrong ... but hitting a child with your fist because u have had a bad day (or any other lame excuse, like the child didn't listen.. etc etc) shoudln't be discussed .. that is just plain wrong
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Old 09-24-2002, 09:25 AM   #13
VulcanRider
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Join Date: July 25, 2002
Location: Melbourne FL
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Quote:
Originally posted by The Hunter of Jahanna:
...how do we know the kid didnt earn a smack?

Ok, maybe the kid did something to deserve a smack. Spanking a 4-yr old, IMHO, only requires 1 or 2 open-handed slaps on the butt, not the can of whoopass this woman opened. And before you ask, no I'm not a parent. But I do remember when I was a kid and needed a spanking and that's what I got. Worked for me...

One of the articles I read said that the woman in the video was trying to return somethings to the store and they wouldnt take them back. Maybe while she was talking to whom ever to return the stuff her kid was terrorizeing the store.

This woman is part of a group called The Travellers. They're famous for running scams on people -- bogus home repair, or shoplift & try to return the merchandise for a refund, for example. They're taught from early childhood to lie, cheat, & steal. Maybe the kid just didn't play her part very well... You suggested "maybe THIS happened in the store", and I suggested "maybe THAT happened in the store". Has the store clerk been interviewed? I don't know.

There ia a big diffrence between a whuppin and abuse. Abuse is burning kids with cigaretts , briuseing them and breaking their bones. A whuppin will be forgotten in an hour and there arent any marks because it might be excessive , but it isnt abuse.
Oh, so if if doesn't leave a permanent mark, it's never abuse???
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Old 09-24-2002, 09:30 AM   #14
realbinky
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Join Date: March 14, 2001
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How any of you are parents? If there is a HISTORY of abuse, there is an issue. Answer me this: is it better to let your kid be an out-of-control terror, in which case they could certainly end up hurt or dead by themselves; or control the kid with a good thrashing so that they fear it enough to not misbehave and not get in trouble and never get it again? She may have warned the kid a number of times. I have 2 children, and I believe in corporal punishment. Spanking and swatting is used in my house. This is not because I dislike my children, I love them very much. I think they will be better children for the discipline they get. And lately, neither of them misbehave a lot, and are always under control, but it only takes a few quiet words in most cases. I can go to any store, restaurant or park, and my kids are well behaved. I get comments on it. I have wigged out a couple times, when my youngest, 2, tried to stick something in an oultet, and another time when he played with the power sitch on power strip. He got some serious spanking, and a couple cheek smacks, as it was seriously dangerous. I'll tell you this, though- he will think twice about playing with outlets and such and I breathe easier knowing this. Should I coddle him, but wonder when he will next do this? No I make it so onerous that he doesn't want to do it again.

Did you know in 10+ states, it is still legal for SCHOOLs to use a paddle on your kids for punishment? I wish they would use it on a few kids.

Sorry for the lenghth. But I think she should get off, but with probation or something. She states actual regret, and I believe her. She took it too far, but sometimes, we have to protect kids from themselves.
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:16 AM   #15
WillowIX
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Join Date: July 10, 2001
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I thin we´re referring to the difference between a smack on the bottom and smacking your child several times in a row. I saw at least 10 blows handed out
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:23 AM   #16
realbinky
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But at the hospital THAT night, there were no signs of injury, or past abuse. So I say that it looks worse than it is. If she really pounded the kid as it seems, there would have been sings. Sometimes, my kids get a smack to the back of the head, as it is all I can reach.
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:24 AM   #17
Azred
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Belle and I are parents, of course. We have, on rare occasions, spanked TJ but do not do so now. As Belle was just saying to me here, "corporal punishment instills only fear and I want my child to respect me, not fear me". TJ may be a little rambunctious at times, but he is never a wild terror. If we are out shopping and this happens, either one of us takes him to the car to sit and wait for the other, or we all simply leave and go home (Belle and I can always shop while he's at school).

There does NOT need to be a history of abuse to qualify behavior as abusive. It takes only one event for a parent to be arrested and/or have the child taken away by CPS (child protective services).

Abuse is not only physical; emotional and mental abuse is far more prevalent than physical. Calling children "stupid", "ugly", etc. on a regular basis damages their self-image; some children never recover from this. Besides, physical abuse is not only burning, cutting, or breaking--bruising is classified as abuse, as is shaking. Sexual abuse of children rarely leaves physical bruises but its effects can last a lifetime. If that happens only once and the parent expresses regret, does that make it ok?

I know someone who was sexually abused as a child. She still has nightmares at times, despite having made great progress over the years. The abuse caused her to misunderstand what love really is; thus, she made bad choices for many years.

That is the real danger of abuse--it causes children to misunderstand, and they grow up thinking that the abuse is love.
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Old 09-24-2002, 11:39 AM   #18
Timber Loftis
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"I see everyone here is against this woman for smacking her kid. I have a question for everyone , how do we know the kid didnt earn a smack?"

Sorry, but you just didn't see the tape. I got my fair share of smackings, spankings, paddlings, and whuppins when I was young, and I believe I more-or-less deserved it. And, though I'm not a parent yet, if and when I am so lucky, I intend to use corporal punishment. But what this woman did was criminal. Forget child abuse - it's called aggravated battery. Trust me, I see kids in my local store all the time and wish the parent would just spank the shit out of 'em right there. But this was so obviously wrong.

And Azred, I don't entirely agree with you. I think corporal punishment has its place. Children are not logical at all times, and an open discourse can only go so far. And, punishment of some nature must be given for wrong acts. At certain ages, I don't think children comprehend the future "no TV for a week" ramifications of acts as well as the immediate "Ow that hurt." At other ages and stages, I think other forms of punishment work better - so long as the parent has the willpower to see them through.

I will say that I respected my father when he spanked me. He would not spank me in the immediate moment, when tempers were flared, but would send me away and tell me he would be there to spank me. He would say "you did X, we've discussed the price of doing X before, and now I'm going to spank you." I think it was effective.

"That's why I go to Wal-Mart - to watch people hit their kids." - Jeff Foxworthy
"If the people do not love you, at least let them fear you" George RR Martin, I think this is a Lord Tywin quote.
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Old 09-24-2002, 12:18 PM   #19
Sir Taliesin
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What Ms Toogood did was a far cry from a smack on the butt. That was a beating if I ever saw one! She deserves to go to jail and loses her children. All three of them. No child deserves that!

As far as corporal punishment goes, I think it's acceptable within limits. Case in point. I was at a football game last night watching my 7 year old daughter cheerlead, when I noticed two boys around 4 or 5 setting on the ground, one on top of the other. The one on top was BITING the others arm. His momma noticed what was going on and yanked him up and made him set in her chair. He was also told "NO". she went back to watching the game, at which time he got up and began hitting her with a chair bag and kicking her. What did she do? She continued to watch the game. The other little boy went to his mom, who was setting behind me and showed her what happened. He had pretty bad tooth marks and probably a nasty bruise today. The moms had a "discussion" about the incident. I wasn't able to overhear what was said, but it looked heated. The biter was never punished other than being sat in a chair, that he promptly got out of. I thought he deserved a smack on the bottom, a good scolding and should have been made to set in the chair for the duration of the ballgame. He learned nothing except that he could get away with it again.

He obviously had no respect or fear of his momma.
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Old 09-24-2002, 12:20 PM   #20
Sir Taliesin
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Quote:
Originally posted by realbinky:
But at the hospital THAT night, there were no signs of injury, or past abuse. So I say that it looks worse than it is. If she really pounded the kid as it seems, there would have been sings. Sometimes, my kids get a smack to the back of the head, as it is all I can reach.
It's my understanding that they didn't get the little girl back in custudy until late this weekend. Not the night it happened.
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