HOW YA LIKE US NOW ?!?!?!?!? (Part 2--Liliara's Thread)

Sazerac · 10-09-2001, 09:02 PM

Just starting a new one for you guys...

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AzureWolf · 10-09-2001, 09:38 PM

Hey guys for future in this post can you please not insult people in direct or round about ways. This is meant or a debate not a flame fest. Thanx

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"I was born of darkness. My fathers eyes closed before mine opened. I am not of this world or the other, and I have the right to be what I am..."

Overlord of all that I behold and anything that i happen to not notice either.

Founding Hamlet of the HADB.

Cloudbringer · 10-09-2001, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AzureWolf:
Hey guys for future in this post can you please not insult people in direct or round about ways. This is meant or a debate not a flame fest. Thanx

*giggle* Isn't he preeeeeeeeecious!? *pinches little blue cheeks*

LOL.. sorry HamletMaster, I do get carried away sometimes!

I agree with you, if this goes on, it should be calmer and lack personal insults or flames as well as comments that encourage them.

Cloudy

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Raindancer of the Laughing Hyenas Clan
CloudDragon of the OHF
Storm-Queen
Raven's Cloud
StormCloud of the Black Knight: Heart Mind Soul Forever
"To sleep, perchance to dream..."

AzureWolf · 10-09-2001, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cloudbringer:
*giggle* Isn't he preeeeeeeeecious!? *pinches little blue cheeks*

LOL.. sorry HamletMaster, I do get carried away sometimes! I agree with you, if this goes on, it should be calmer and lack personal insults or flames as well as comments that encourage them.

Cloudy

Well you got the HamletMaster part right

But I do not have wittle bwue chweeks.

------------------

"I was born of darkness. My fathers eyes closed before mine opened. I am not of this world or the other, and I have the right to be what I am..."

Overlord of all that I behold and anything that i happen to not notice either.

Founding Hamlet of the HADB.

Moridin · 10-09-2001, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Silver Cheetah
G'kar asked for comments, etc, or even just agreement. I agreed, so I said so. Sometimes it is nice to show solidarity.

Ok, that's it for me. No more serious threads for a while. Being sniped at and sniping in return, that's no way to live. It gives me a headache and makes me feel sick. Plus I'm very very bored with it.

See you later alligators!! Byeeeeeeeeeeeee...........

I know I know...and I apologise for not reading G'kar's post more closely. I didn't mean to snipe, I'm sorry

------------------

Never try to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and it annoys the pig
I've got to admit it's getting better, it's getting better all the time
Bossman of Better Funny Stuff.....of the Laughing Hyenas!

10-09-2001, 10:44 PM

I officially apologize for accusing Liliria of being disrespectful of other peoples beliefs.

I reread that entire original thread, I saw alot of strong opinions and viewpoints (my own included) but it seems that for the most part, people grew closer by working out the disagreements and misunderstandings that naturally arose from such a heated issue. Agreeing to disagree can go along way in maintaining the dignity of all concerned parties.

And to everyone, I may disagree with you, I may have a strong viewpoint myself, but I mean no disrespect, and I would expect someone to call it out if it were percieved that way. Only by honestly confronting issues can we ever hope to work them out.

Some people have expressed the urge to leave this place, partly because of the serious topics that arise on occassion, I just ask that you look for the good that comes out of disagreeing, the good that comes after a misunderstanding is resolved. I mean, for the most part we all come here because we love this place and the folks that visit here. It is a diverse crowd with all sorts of varied beliefs and opinions, debating is one way of celebrationg diversisty. It allows us to know where another person is coming from, and to develop our own beliefs and veiwpoints, if we keep an open mind.

Done, cooked and ready to eat.

Liliara · 10-10-2001, 12:30 AM

[Quote]ORIGINALLY POSTED BY SILVER CHEETAH:
Cloudy, sorry, no, I was not being sarcastic about Christian beliefs per se, I was responding to what Liliara wrote, as follows:

'I do not gloat over those that the Lord will squell baecause they use his name to kill and maim innocent people. But as a human with a human spirit, I cannot help but feel a satisfaction with today's events. I shall pray tonight for forgiveness, but I'm afraid that you, my friend, have no one to ask forgiveness of, seeing that you are an atheist. Worry not though, I shall pray for you, as I pray for myself. In the meantime.... HOW YA LIKE US NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This doesn't seem to me to quite the same thing as you describe above!

Here is someone who has started a thread called HOW YA LIKE US NOW!!! gloating if ever I saw it, and says quite happily that she knows that 'the satisfaction with today's events' that she feels is wrong, but that she will pray tonight for forgiveness. So if I decide to steal something from my friend today, that is ok, as long as I have it in my mind, whilst I'm doing it, that I will pray tonight for forgiveness? Hence my sarcasm - because if that is the way you're going to use forgiveness (which is a beautiful and soul enhancing concept) - then you can just go out and commit any old crime secure in the knowledge. I'm not saying for a moment that that is the way all Christians view divine forgiveness. Just that it is the way that Liliara seems to be viewing it.

However, I do believe the confessional, just to take an example, has been used in the way that Liliara seems to be using it by many and amany, both in the past and now. Sin today, confess, and tomorrow you can go and sin again.

However, please believe that I am NOT saying for one moment that all Christians treat it that way!!!

To go back to Liliara's post, I find her total unconcern with cause and effect nauseating, as I've said already. Her constant assumption (shared by others on this board) that the terrorists attacks came out of no-where, for no reason, is childish and ridiculous. Being simplistic in response to what is happening is not the answer.

And gloating won't get us anywhere. We've taken the first step into something that may evolve into a horror the like of which the world has never yet seen. Gloating is hardly a appropriate response.[/Qoute]

I fully stand by the title of this thread! I have had to listen to bin Laden put down American's as cowards, saying that we have pulled out of places like Bosnia because we are scared. I have listened to him declare war on American citizens in the late 90's. Now I restate HOW YA LIKE US NOW?!?!

So yes, in that way I AM gloating! Now he sees that he was wrong to judge our willingness to act! Heck, even the Taliban broadcast that America was too afraid to attack Afghanistan! So yes, I am happy that we acted.

What I was refering to in asking for forgiveness, was that aside from gloating
about us being there and taking well deserved action, I felt a bit of joy watching the bombs drop hoping they would take a few of those Taliban and Al Queda bastards with them! (O.K., stop gasping and looking in shock at the monitor!

) This I realized was wrong, and this is what I was refering to in my post, though I should have made it more clear!

Yes, you may see something in my posts that would lead you to believe that I think I can sin, ask for forgiveness, then sin again. The simple fact is that it is TRUE!! Like Yorick said, forgiveness is given freely by God, if you are repentant! My sins have been paid for. Does that mean I can do what I want? OF COURSE NOT!

When you were a child, when you would do things your mother had told you not to, when you were caught, were you not upset with yourself that you had disapointed her? In return, did she not forgive you, because of the immense love she had for you? She did, knowing you would do it again, if only because of your immaturity no matter how badly you never wanted to hurt her again. She knew more than you did, she was older and wiser.

Now God is PERFECT! He loves more deeply than we can possibly imagine! He also knows a man's heart! I can't pull one over on God! Just because it's hard to understand Him, doesn't mean He doesn't understand us!

Man cannot judge one another's heart no matter how hard we try so please don't pretend to know mine Silver!

------------------

Captain of Bouncers, Boogre Bar

LH Member

"I've had it up to here, listening to a small segment of people try to put down America! America's the greatest land on Earth, and we oughta be proud of what we have! I'm proud of America, I'm proud of our people, and I'm gonna prove it. We're American and DAMN proud of it! Frankly I'm getting a little ticked off...go ta ****"... Dink (if anyone knows who originally said this, please let me know!)

Liliara · 10-10-2001, 12:31 AM

Oh and if I may go off topic myself....PLEASE, PLEASE send ME the test too, Dragon!!!!!!!!!

------------------

Captain of Bouncers, Boogre Bar

LH Member

"I've had it up to here, listening to a small segment of people try to put down America! America's the greatest land on Earth, and we oughta be proud of what we have! I'm proud of America, I'm proud of our people, and I'm gonna prove it. We're American and DAMN proud of it! Frankly I'm getting a little ticked off...go ta ****"... Dink (if anyone knows who originally said this, please let me know!)

Liliara · 10-10-2001, 01:30 AM

BTW for any new comers, the link for the first thread is as follows:

www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/NonCGI/Forum10/HTML/003924.html

------------------

Captain of Bouncers, Boogre Bar

LH Member

"I've had it up to here, listening to a small segment of people try to put down America! America's the greatest land on Earth, and we oughta be proud of what we have! I'm proud of America, I'm proud of our people, and I'm gonna prove it. We're American and DAMN proud of it! Frankly I'm getting a little ticked off...go ta ****"... Dink (if anyone knows who originally said this, please let me know!)

Nachtrafe · 10-10-2001, 03:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by G'kar:
I officially apologize for accusing Liliria of being disrespectful of other peoples beliefs.

I reread that entire original thread, I saw alot of strong opinions and viewpoints (my own included) but it seems that for the most part, people grew closer by working out the disagreements and misunderstandings that naturally arose from such a heated issue. Agreeing to disagree can go along way in maintaining the dignity of all concerned parties.

And to everyone, I may disagree with you, I may have a strong viewpoint myself, but I mean no disrespect, and I would expect someone to call it out if it were percieved that way. Only by honestly confronting issues can we ever hope to work them out.

Some people have expressed the urge to leave this place, partly because of the serious topics that arise on occassion, I just ask that you look for the good that comes out of disagreeing, the good that comes after a misunderstanding is resolved. I mean, for the most part we all come here because we love this place and the folks that visit here. It is a diverse crowd with all sorts of varied beliefs and opinions, debating is one way of celebrationg diversisty. It allows us to know where another person is coming from, and to develop our own beliefs and veiwpoints, if we keep an open mind.

Done, cooked and ready to eat.

Awesome and eloquent post G'Kar!

I know that technically that's spam but its also almost exactly what I was planning on saying. G'Kar just beat me to it.

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"In Memorium of those who are gone, and all those that bought our freedom with their hearts blood!"

"May the Colors of Liberty never run"

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10-09-2001, 09:02 PM	#1
Sazerac Ironworks Moderator Join Date: January 7, 2001 Location: Monroe, LA Age: 60 Posts: 7,387	Just starting a new one for you guys... ------------------

10-09-2001, 09:38 PM	#2
AzureWolf 20th Level Warrior Join Date: May 3, 2001 Location: . Age: 40 Posts: 2,762	Hey guys for future in this post can you please not insult people in direct or round about ways. This is meant or a debate not a flame fest. Thanx ------------------ "I was born of darkness. My fathers eyes closed before mine opened. I am not of this world or the other, and I have the right to be what I am..." Overlord of all that I behold and anything that i happen to not notice either. Founding Hamlet of the HADB.

10-09-2001, 10:44 PM	#6
G'kar Guest Posts: n/a	I officially apologize for accusing Liliria of being disrespectful of other peoples beliefs. I reread that entire original thread, I saw alot of strong opinions and viewpoints (my own included) but it seems that for the most part, people grew closer by working out the disagreements and misunderstandings that naturally arose from such a heated issue. Agreeing to disagree can go along way in maintaining the dignity of all concerned parties. And to everyone, I may disagree with you, I may have a strong viewpoint myself, but I mean no disrespect, and I would expect someone to call it out if it were percieved that way. Only by honestly confronting issues can we ever hope to work them out. Some people have expressed the urge to leave this place, partly because of the serious topics that arise on occassion, I just ask that you look for the good that comes out of disagreeing, the good that comes after a misunderstanding is resolved. I mean, for the most part we all come here because we love this place and the folks that visit here. It is a diverse crowd with all sorts of varied beliefs and opinions, debating is one way of celebrationg diversisty. It allows us to know where another person is coming from, and to develop our own beliefs and veiwpoints, if we keep an open mind. Done, cooked and ready to eat.

10-10-2001, 12:30 AM	#7
Liliara Red Wizard of Thay Join Date: August 17, 2001 Location: Florida Posts: 874	[Quote]ORIGINALLY POSTED BY SILVER CHEETAH: Cloudy, sorry, no, I was not being sarcastic about Christian beliefs per se, I was responding to what Liliara wrote, as follows: 'I do not gloat over those that the Lord will squell baecause they use his name to kill and maim innocent people. But as a human with a human spirit, I cannot help but feel a satisfaction with today's events. I shall pray tonight for forgiveness, but I'm afraid that you, my friend, have no one to ask forgiveness of, seeing that you are an atheist. Worry not though, I shall pray for you, as I pray for myself. In the meantime.... HOW YA LIKE US NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This doesn't seem to me to quite the same thing as you describe above! Here is someone who has started a thread called HOW YA LIKE US NOW!!! gloating if ever I saw it, and says quite happily that she knows that 'the satisfaction with today's events' that she feels is wrong, but that she will pray tonight for forgiveness. So if I decide to steal something from my friend today, that is ok, as long as I have it in my mind, whilst I'm doing it, that I will pray tonight for forgiveness? Hence my sarcasm - because if that is the way you're going to use forgiveness (which is a beautiful and soul enhancing concept) - then you can just go out and commit any old crime secure in the knowledge. I'm not saying for a moment that that is the way all Christians view divine forgiveness. Just that it is the way that Liliara seems to be viewing it. However, I do believe the confessional, just to take an example, has been used in the way that Liliara seems to be using it by many and amany, both in the past and now. Sin today, confess, and tomorrow you can go and sin again. However, please believe that I am NOT saying for one moment that all Christians treat it that way!!! To go back to Liliara's post, I find her total unconcern with cause and effect nauseating, as I've said already. Her constant assumption (shared by others on this board) that the terrorists attacks came out of no-where, for no reason, is childish and ridiculous. Being simplistic in response to what is happening is not the answer. And gloating won't get us anywhere. We've taken the first step into something that may evolve into a horror the like of which the world has never yet seen. Gloating is hardly a appropriate response.[/Qoute] I fully stand by the title of this thread! I have had to listen to bin Laden put down American's as cowards, saying that we have pulled out of places like Bosnia because we are scared. I have listened to him declare war on American citizens in the late 90's. Now I restate HOW YA LIKE US NOW?!?! So yes, in that way I AM gloating! Now he sees that he was wrong to judge our willingness to act! Heck, even the Taliban broadcast that America was too afraid to attack Afghanistan! So yes, I am happy that we acted. What I was refering to in asking for forgiveness, was that aside from gloating about us being there and taking well deserved action, I felt a bit of joy watching the bombs drop hoping they would take a few of those Taliban and Al Queda bastards with them! (O.K., stop gasping and looking in shock at the monitor! ) This I realized was wrong, and this is what I was refering to in my post, though I should have made it more clear! Yes, you may see something in my posts that would lead you to believe that I think I can sin, ask for forgiveness, then sin again. The simple fact is that it is TRUE!! Like Yorick said, forgiveness is given freely by God, if you are repentant! My sins have been paid for. Does that mean I can do what I want? OF COURSE NOT! When you were a child, when you would do things your mother had told you not to, when you were caught, were you not upset with yourself that you had disapointed her? In return, did she not forgive you, because of the immense love she had for you? She did, knowing you would do it again, if only because of your immaturity no matter how badly you never wanted to hurt her again. She knew more than you did, she was older and wiser. Now God is PERFECT! He loves more deeply than we can possibly imagine! He also knows a man's heart! I can't pull one over on God! Just because it's hard to understand Him, doesn't mean He doesn't understand us! Man cannot judge one another's heart no matter how hard we try so please don't pretend to know mine Silver! ------------------ Captain of Bouncers, Boogre Bar LH Member "I've had it up to here, listening to a small segment of people try to put down America! America's the greatest land on Earth, and we oughta be proud of what we have! I'm proud of America, I'm proud of our people, and I'm gonna prove it. We're American and DAMN proud of it! Frankly I'm getting a little ticked off...go ta ****"... Dink (if anyone knows who originally said this, please let me know!)

10-10-2001, 12:31 AM	#8
Liliara Red Wizard of Thay Join Date: August 17, 2001 Location: Florida Posts: 874	Oh and if I may go off topic myself....PLEASE, PLEASE send ME the test too, Dragon!!!!!!!!! ------------------ Captain of Bouncers, Boogre Bar LH Member "I've had it up to here, listening to a small segment of people try to put down America! America's the greatest land on Earth, and we oughta be proud of what we have! I'm proud of America, I'm proud of our people, and I'm gonna prove it. We're American and DAMN proud of it! Frankly I'm getting a little ticked off...go ta ****"... Dink (if anyone knows who originally said this, please let me know!)

10-10-2001, 01:30 AM	#9
Liliara Red Wizard of Thay Join Date: August 17, 2001 Location: Florida Posts: 874	BTW for any new comers, the link for the first thread is as follows: www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/NonCGI/Forum10/HTML/003924.html ------------------ Captain of Bouncers, Boogre Bar LH Member "I've had it up to here, listening to a small segment of people try to put down America! America's the greatest land on Earth, and we oughta be proud of what we have! I'm proud of America, I'm proud of our people, and I'm gonna prove it. We're American and DAMN proud of it! Frankly I'm getting a little ticked off...go ta ****"... Dink (if anyone knows who originally said this, please let me know!)

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