Possible bugs or are they features?

[fung]

1) I have built several fighters and notice this happen, fighters always begin with a ranged combat skill of 4 at level 1 (unless u put points into it). But when they advance to level 2 their ranged combat skill always grows to 5 (even if u have never practiced ranged combat and not put a single point in through the level up)...this could be a tiny bug in the game [img]smile.gif[/img]

2) Ok I also have made this interesting observation concerning spell leraning. Sometimes the charc. is eligible to learn a spell from a spellbook where they are unavailable through the level up screeen. I believe the spells are often unavailable through the level up because of insufficient skill level in the realms. But when u then learn that spell from a spellbook, your realm skill will rise (*note* I am not talking about spell points...)

I point this out because this feature is useful in the late game when u have heaps of gold but might have neglected a certain realm earlier. Hence u can buy heps of spellbooks in that realm and laern them to pump up the realm skill.

[Gimli]

Interesting, especially #2 - I've never noticed that myself. How big a bump in a realm have you seen? I forget though, does it have you learn spells first at a level up and then raise your skills? If that's the order and I think that's how I remember it (not sure), then maybe you raised the realm skills to where you qualified after the part where you got to choose spells? But if not then you're saying right after the level up, the same spell you weren't allowed to learn then you can pick up from a book, and that bumps your realm skill as well?

[otter]

Reading the book in itself can make your skill points increase. I've noticed that almost everything you're within a point of qualifying for is possible if the thing you're doing gives you the point you need to qualify for it. Read that until it makes sense...
As to the skill increase for doing nothing, maybe you could test that, have a char on defend the whole first level, then see how many skills got another point. Something you may have overlooked: If you raise a character's "controlling" attribute, you will increase the starting skill points automatically as you pass whatever thresholds are there.

[ 07-23-2002, 01:22 AM: Message edited by: otter ]

[fung]

"Reading the book in itself can make your skill points increase. I've noticed that almost everything you're within a point of qualifying for is possible if the thing you're doing gives you the point you need to qualify for it" - Otter

Otter phrased it much better than me above, it is exactly what I was trying to say.

hence yeah I have just tried it....if u feel that your charc. is lacking in whatever realm...sometimes getting him to read books of spells that he is not eligible to learn will bump up both his magic (wizardry, alchemy etc.) school and/or spell realm.

Note: it is NOT a huge bump up of stats...it is quite marginal whether it is worth it is really up to you.

Hope u understand what I was saying

[Oruboris]

Think I know what you mean, but am a little unclear: are you saying if you are carrying, say, a 'hex' book, you've leveled without having 'hex' as a spell pick, but after leveling were able to use the book? I've seen that a LOT, but assumed it was because your spell pick comes before you assign your level up points. I'm frequently bummed when a much anticipated level doesn't offer a higher level of spell picks, but found I was able to access these picks via books after assigning points.

OTOH, I've seen a lot of boosts from using books: often artifacts, sometimes realm, less often one of the 'big four' categories-- wizardry, etc.

So, have you actually saved just before a level, found that 'hex' or the like wasn't offered, then reloaded [pre-level] and been able to use a book [prior to assigning points? That would be cool, might be enough to convince me to replay the game, AGAIN, even though I planned to take a month or two off from games in general...

Oru

[the_young_one]

IMHO the reason is that when you level up, your primary skill (wizardry/alchemy/psionics/divinity) may not be sufficient to learn the spell. However, later when you do reach the threshold, then the book is readable. Then when you read the book and learn the new spell, you often get more spell points, school goes up and if you're really lucky the primary skill too. The key numbers are 15/30/45/60/75/90 for level 2/3/4/5/6/7 spells - Wolfie has an excellent spell availability spreadsheet to calculate which spells are available..

[fung]

After some testing the following is my theory...cannot be 100% sure it is correct, since there appears to be a random factor involved or something...if anyone out there knows exactly how this works plz share your knowledge [img]smile.gif[/img]

Spell learning theory

Check Wolfie's site and u'll find that spell availability upon leveling up is based on (School + 10%relam) to meet your threshold.

However, it is to my believe that spell learning from books operates under a slightly different *somewhat lower* threshold system.

hence sometimes when u do not meet the leveling up threshold...but u *do* meet the book threshold...u can learn the spell from the book but not on leveling up. The catch is that after u learn it from the book, the game realises that u do not meet the minimum school and/or realm skill threshold...hence it rises your school and/or realm skills so that it meets the minumum skill requirements. hence u get that message...that after u learn the spell that your wizardry and realm skill has increased.

[Rhea]

^I'm thinking that what happens may be that if your skill/spell points meet the minimum *with* reading the book, it'll let you read it.

I've seen it happen repeatedly, just didn't think too much about it - after all, I just figured you were getting a pat on the back for being so studious.

[otter]

Yah, it works that way with potions, too; if your alchemizer has, say 49 Alchemy, within one action of making 50--if you mix the Renewal, that'll make the skill go up, just like reading a L4 Spellbook can be the action that gets you 45 Alc. Just like when your Locks-n-Trapsist's % increases for the action that makes the Skill increase. Etc.