American terrorists

[Sir Taliesin]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: Depended: If Khaz saw it happening, got enraged, and killed the little ELF, he'd get murder in the heat of passion - in some states this is 2nd Degree Murder, in others its Manslaughter 1 - usually carries up to a life sentence. Since we know he's premeditated it, however, he'd get premeditated murder - in most all states called First Degree Murder. This carries a mandatory life sentence (almost always) and gets you a chance at the death penalty in states that have it. But, from me he'd get a thumbs up. [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

In Tennessee, he'd get a wink, a nod and a pat on the back for good aim! And honestly that could happen if it was a PETA instead of an ELF. As far as most are concerned here, they are one and the same!

[Timber Loftis]

Wrong on PETA. AFAIK, PETA does not use violence as protest - it simply exercises its 1st Amendment right to voice its opinion on those who:

1. consume dead carcasses of once-living beings,
2. wear skin, or
3. subjigate other living creatures to absolutely useless testing of 20-yr-old well-known products in the name of consumer safety (but in reality so the fat cat pharmaceutical and hygeine companies can get still yet more government research and testing money while they act as if the poor are actually the drain on our taxes).

Not that I'm a PETA-freak or nothing - just pointing out they're not the same.

[ElricMorlockin]

Originally posted by Eisenschwarz: Those SUV’s are a waste of our finite resources and energy.

As we understand the energy sources of today. In likeness we used to burn whale oil for lighting etc. and no longer do so.

You don’t need one unless you’re actually going to be driving off road. Not only that, but they are also very inefficient and waste much oil and create much pollution.

First off, I like the fact that we have the right to own one (even though I share your b*tch regarding the majority of owners. Most do not know how to drive one!)
Second your point about pollution is well taken, since they obviously are not very fuel efficient. However, why dont the "green peace" type groups invest their money into alternative fuel source research that would be a viable alternative? Waiting for the government to "do it for them" is a waste of their resources and energies.

This is bad, since it contributes towards environmental damage and global warming etc and dependency on oil.

A whole other topic of debate. We know global warming is occuring but do we really know that its because of what mankind is doing? If so, since when has this science come about to differntiate between planetary anomoly and human activity?

Now, The American government is not going to do anything, so these people have decided to take Direct Action, Sometimes This can be justified, And I find it hard to feel sympathy for people who can afford those great machines while there are people starving for the want of a little Maize in Africa.

Point by point:

1.) Is it the job of the American government to "do anything" about it, other than gentle prodding?
2.) The people taking matters into their own hands in this method are criminal. In likeness to spiking trees in an area known to be logged, with the intention of killing or maiming the lumberjack. That, IMO, is nothing short of terrorism. If ends justifies the means in this instance, than I am sure no one would have a problem with a culprit being executed for this crime?
3.) While there are people starving in Africa.....
First, starvation in Africa is almost always caused by the governmental systems vying for control of "xyz" country and has absolutely nothing to do with a person owning a SUV. In many cases plenty of food is available, only, its not distributed or distributed properly. In fact starvation is a highly used weapon in the battles for control of a given country.
Second, "genetically modified" cereal grains were offered by the USA to several countires starving presently, and was rejected as if we were giving spoonfulls of rat poison. It makes me wonder, do they want to alleviate the problem or propetuate the problem so as to "have an issue"?

[Ronn_Bman]

Welcome to Ironworks Elric! [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Rokenn]

Originally posted by ElricMorlockin: Second your point about pollution is well taken, since they obviously are not very fuel efficient. However, why dont the "green peace" type groups invest their money into alternative fuel source research that would be a viable alternative? Waiting for the government to "do it for them" is a waste of their resources and energies.

Personally I would be happy if the government spent as much on alternate energy sources as they spend on coal and oil companies. Sadly they give far more 'assistance' to these sources then clean energy alternatives.

and welcome to the fray! [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Eisenschwarz: Those SUV’s are a waste of our finite resources and energy. You don’t need one unless you’re actually going to be driving off road. Not only that, but they are also very inefficient and waste much oil and create much pollution. This is bad, since it contributes towards environmental damage and global warming etc and dependency on oil.

I agree.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by ElricMorlockin: quote: Originally posted by Eisenschwarz: Those SUV’s are a waste of our finite resources and energy.

As we understand the energy sources of today. In likeness we used to burn whale oil for lighting etc. and no longer do so.

You don’t need one unless you’re actually going to be driving off road. Not only that, but they are also very inefficient and waste much oil and create much pollution.

First off, I like the fact that we have the right to own one (even though I share your b*tch regarding the majority of owners. Most do not know how to drive one!)
Second your point about pollution is well taken, since they obviously are not very fuel efficient. However, why dont the "green peace" type groups invest their money into alternative fuel source research that would be a viable alternative? Waiting for the government to "do it for them" is a waste of their resources and energies.

This is bad, since it contributes towards environmental damage and global warming etc and dependency on oil.

A whole other topic of debate. We know global warming is occuring but do we really know that its because of what mankind is doing? If so, since when has this science come about to differntiate between planetary anomoly and human activity?

Now, The American government is not going to do anything, so these people have decided to take Direct Action, Sometimes This can be justified, And I find it hard to feel sympathy for people who can afford those great machines while there are people starving for the want of a little Maize in Africa.

Point by point:

1.) Is it the job of the American government to "do anything" about it, other than gentle prodding?
2.) The people taking matters into their own hands in this method are criminal. In likeness to spiking trees in an area known to be logged, with the intention of killing or maiming the lumberjack. That, IMO, is nothing short of terrorism. If ends justifies the means in this instance, than I am sure no one would have a problem with a culprit being executed for this crime?
3.) While there are people starving in Africa.....
First, starvation in Africa is almost always caused by the governmental systems vying for control of "xyz" country and has absolutely nothing to do with a person owning a SUV. In many cases plenty of food is available, only, its not distributed or distributed properly. In fact starvation is a highly used weapon in the battles for control of a given country.
Second, "genetically modified" cereal grains were offered by the USA to several countires starving presently, and was rejected as if we were giving spoonfulls of rat poison. It makes me wonder, do they want to alleviate the problem or propetuate the problem so as to "have an issue"?[/QUOTE]Good to see you here Elric. Welcome, welcome. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Cloudbringer]

Elric! You snuck past my Welcome Wagon alerts!

WELCOME WELCOME WELCOME!!! It's good to see you here, my friend! Come on in and...oh I see you have already made yourself at home! TEEHEE....good job!

HEY everybody, say howdy to Elric and CONGRATS to him too....he's a new daddy!!!! [img]graemlins/kissy2.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/balloons.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/1partyguy.gif[/img]

Cloudbringer
Official Welcome Wagon of the Ironworks Forums

[Timber Loftis]

Okay guys, for the past 20 years several different methods of using alternative fuels have been developed. Many are now efficient enough to be viable economically - as evidenced by the recent swell in popularity of hybrid vehicles.

But, groups like GreenPeace realize the hurdle now is not *having* the technology but undertaking grass roots campaigns and slinging a bit of mud at the big companies so we can convince the people, the corps, and the government to have the *will* to implement the technology. This will take a lot of work, and will only likely happen slowly over time.

Purely electric cars are not an alternative at this point not because the cars aren't technologically sufficient, but rather because there are no recharge stations and one can only carry so many batteries. That's why hybrids have fared better in the market.

[Sir Taliesin]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: Wrong on PETA. AFAIK, PETA does not use violence as protest - it simply exercises its 1st Amendment right to voice its opinion on those who: 1. consume dead carcasses of once-living beings, 2. wear skin, or 3. subjigate other living creatures to absolutely useless testing of 20-yr-old well-known products in the name of consumer safety (but in reality so the fat cat pharmaceutical and hygeine companies can get still yet more government research and testing money while they act as if the poor are actually the drain on our taxes). Not that I'm a PETA-freak or nothing - just pointing out they're not the same.

Hey I understand where you are coming from (I just don't agree with most of PETA's agenda)! Just try and explain that to you average East Tennessee Redneck. I don't care how many degrees you may have. To a redneck they are all tarred from the same brush so to speak.

Elric Hello! Welcome to the board and congradulations on being a new daddy. As a Daddy to three, one of which is 4 months old, I can tell you there is not greater thing in the world than having kids (they are instant fun)! Well, my dad might not agree with that. He says having grand kids is a whole lot better and if he'd have known how much fun grand kids were, he'd have skipped having kids and gone straight to having kids!