Sex Before Marriage - Page 5

02-02-2002, 07:44 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Melusine:

Good grief Neb, you know perfectly well what he meant.
Frankly I am saddened that so many people seem to have lost all respect for each other here. I can understand where Saz's thread about rudeness is coming from. Is it really that difficult to swallow your self-righteousness just once and accept that while you have every right to express an opinion, it's polite and respectful to stop pushing a point if you notice people are hurt by it??
This goes for people on BOTH sides, I'm not ranting at you personally, Neb.
But I really fail to see why some people feel such an urge to spout and KEEP spouting opinions that are hurtful to other people.

Good points all Mel, but you should know, that for some people, the very fact that you disagree with them equates to being disrespectful to them (in their view that is). I can't tell you how often just bringing up the fact that you don't agree has led to much anguish

Sad but true!

Larry_OHF · 02-02-2002, 08:03 PM

"What? Magik, you are disagreeing with me?
Telling me that I do not know everything that there is to know?
How dare you!
I, the fearless [img]graemlins/stormy.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/tgestar1.gif[/img] Modding Mage [img]graemlins/tgestar1.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/stormy.gif[/img] of Ironworks will slay you where you stand you stinking evil, vile,...."

Larry looks around at everybody staring at him, shaking their heads and gritting their teeth in anger. He heard somebody whisper to call Ziroc immediately...

"Oh...sorry...I am in the wrong forum...er...excuse me!"

~Larry scurries away as fast as he can to his own lands of power...~

[ 02-02-2002: Message edited by: Larry_OHF ]

Cloudbringer · 02-02-2002, 08:17 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Cerek the Barbaric:
Larry,

Cerek's here to give you a little Barbarian Back-up (not that you need it).
The Bible does indeed say that a man should cleave to one woman and should not "put her out except for fornication" (if she cheats on you). It also says that "if a man look upon another woman with lust in his heart, then he has committed adultery" (paraphrased).
I can't find exact text, but the Bible and Christian faith both believe that a man and woman should save themselves for marriage. I'll be honost and admit that I didn't, but that's the beauty of being a Christainl......we aren't peerfect, just Forgiven.

And AFA Christians not being tolerant, I suggest you read the Religion thread. I held a very civil discussion with Garnet (a Wiccan) and fable (a pagan). Their beliefs come nowhere close to mine, but we were still able to discuss our ideological differences in a civilized manner.

Calling the Bible a "2000 year old novel" that "contradicts itself in every statement" is NOT being civil nor respectful - whether it is said in jest or not.

Neb (and others), what would you say if I called the Wiccan's Book of Worship (sorry, but I don't know the proper name for it) a manual for demon worship? Would you tell fable or Garnet to lighten up if they took offense?
There seems to be a real double standard when it comes to Christianity. It's perfectly OK for anybody to criticize our religion or the Bible (there just expressing an opinion), but it's NOT OK for us to say "hey, I don't appreciate you making such disparaging remarks about my religion".
Like Magik(?) said, a LOT of people DO base their life and actions on the teachings found in the Bible. If you don't, that's your choice and I respect it...all I ask is that you and everyone else show us the same respect.

Plain old member-mode engaged:

This was a good post! It bears repeating! I personally am not into anything 'wiccan or pagan' because my religous beliefs hold that I should avoid 'magic' and the 'occult'. Do I slag off the well-spoken and decent members here who have those belief systems when we meet on board? No! I respect their right to have different beliefs and as long as nobody insists I convert, I'm fine! Whatever my personal opinions, I will not go posting insulting material here.

And the part about it being fashionable to insult or ridicule things Christian.. oh Cerek! That's a pet peeve of mine from way back! In this day of Political Correctness, somehow there has come a 'backlash mentality' that says it IS ok to discredit and ridicule Christians, but not the others. Anyway.. I'm hoping we can be civil here.

Just liked what you had to say. hehe.. did you say you were a southern Baptist? LOL.. see stereotypes are not always right! Don't see you thumping a Bible and burning books while spouting about Fire and Brimstone at us all!

edit: to the topic! LOL.. nearly forgot! I know that regarding procreation, my church does push abstinence outside of marriage. They do not excommunicate anyone for having sexual relations, but they do preach that such things are special and should be kept for marriage/love. Having said that, I admit, Nacht and I did not just hold hands all the time I was in Idaho. [img]smile.gif[/img] And to whoever mentioned fidelity after marriage - I believe in it then AND when in a dating relationship. If you are sleeping together, in my book it means a very special committment.. not just a pleasant passtime. Apologies to anyone who thinks that way, but as a friend of mine said recently "Sex is just exercise if it's not with someone you love." I can do aerobics if I need exercise, thanks! I prefer that intimate relations be just that.. intimate and special.

Cloudy

[ 02-02-2002: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ]

Tarox · 02-02-2002, 08:40 PM

Just how many so called "religions" does America have?

Im curious, as all the new religions are made up there and all the ones with strict orders or wierd beliefs seem to come from there too

Wiccan? wtf is that and when did that get invented haha
(Kinda noticed anyone saying they are a Wicca or whatever you call it is a Yank too.......coincidence? [img]tongue.gif[/img] )

Cloudbringer · 02-02-2002, 09:37 PM

Tarox, maybe you'd like to take that question to the thread(s) on religion.

02-02-2002, 10:58 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Tarox:
Just how many so called "religions" does America have?

Im curious, as all the new religions are made up there and all the ones with strict orders or wierd beliefs seem to come from there too

Wiccan? wtf is that and when did that get invented haha
(Kinda noticed anyone saying they are a Wicca or whatever you call it is a Yank too.......coincidence? [img]tongue.gif[/img] )

Err actually I seem to recall several rathere severe religions coming out of europe...coming here to escape state forced coercion to a specific religion.....so the USA has no copyright on having strict religions..and as far as I know none of the religions so far developed in the US has mass numbers of suicide bombers running around the wolrd trying to hurt innocents.... Just thought Id point these things out.

02-02-2002, 11:00 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Cloudbringer:
Tarox, maybe you'd like to take that question to the thread(s) on religion.

Oops quite right cloudy didnt realize what thread I was in...definately off topic with my reply to him as well

So....you did more than hold hands while out west eh??? hehehehe Imagine that [img]smile.gif[/img]

I agree with what you said about sex and relationships and fidelity.

Cloudbringer · 02-03-2002, 12:26 AM

quote:
Originally posted by MagiK:

Oops quite right cloudy didnt realize what thread I was in...definately off topic with my reply to him as well

So....you did more than hold hands while out west eh??? hehehehe Imagine that [img]smile.gif[/img]

I agree with what you said about sex and relationships and fidelity.

No problem! Things got a little cross topiced anyway. [img]smile.gif[/img] Just that a debate on the stuff you and Tarox are doing would merit it's own thread, so go ahead if you think it needs more discussion.

[img]graemlins/blush.gif[/img] err.. Ok, well, in the interests of honesty here... yes, we did. But for the sake of showing I put my money where my mouth is, I'll add that we have talked pretty seriously about the future and it is a committed relationship. [img]graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

02-03-2002, 12:32 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Cloudbringer:

[img]graemlins/blush.gif[/img] err.. Ok, well, in the interests of honesty here... yes, we did. But for the sake of showing I put my money where my mouth is, I'll add that we have talked pretty seriously about the future and it is a committed relationship. [img]graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

We already knew that [img]smile.gif[/img] I will admit that at one point in my life sex was umm...well just a fun thing to do with whoever you were with, but as I grew up and had children I have changed my stance a bit. As I said earlier I think two people should know EVERY part of their intended mate before comitting to a long term relationship. It certainly wouldnt be fair to find out after the fact that one person had a SERIOUS need/desire for S&M and the other had a SERIOUS aversion to it. (I use that only as an example..for myself Im allergic to pain...pain hurts!).

Cerek the Barbaric · 02-03-2002, 01:19 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Cloudbringer:

Just liked what you had to say. hehe.. did you say you were a southern Baptist? LOL.. see stereotypes are not always right! Don't see you thumping a Bible and burning books while spouting about Fire and Brimstone at us all!

[ 02-02-2002: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ]

Well, you know the saying about catching more flies with honey [img]graemlins/angel.gif[/img]

Besides, you have to gently lure the heathens into the church before you can lock the doors behind them! [img]graemlins/showoff.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img]

Seriously though, I AM a legitimate Southern Baptist, but I do prefer the "kinder, gentler" approach. My own personal circle of friends includes a Wiccan, a couple of agnostics (one of which I roomed with in college), and one VERY dedicated atheist. He and I have had several "theological debates" and I've learned a lot from them.

I've never been one to force my religion on another. I accept the fact that some people have no interest in Christianity at all. Nothing I do or say will change that, but that doesn't mean that we can't be friends and respect each other.

Thanks for the support, though. Your kind words really meant a lot.

02-02-2002, 07:44 PM	#41
MagiK Guest Posts: n/a	quote: Originally posted by Melusine: Good grief Neb, you know perfectly well what he meant. Frankly I am saddened that so many people seem to have lost all respect for each other here. I can understand where Saz's thread about rudeness is coming from. Is it really that difficult to swallow your self-righteousness just once and accept that while you have every right to express an opinion, it's polite and respectful to stop pushing a point if you notice people are hurt by it?? This goes for people on BOTH sides, I'm not ranting at you personally, Neb. But I really fail to see why some people feel such an urge to spout and KEEP spouting opinions that are hurtful to other people. Good points all Mel, but you should know, that for some people, the very fact that you disagree with them equates to being disrespectful to them (in their view that is). I can't tell you how often just bringing up the fact that you don't agree has led to much anguish Sad but true!

02-02-2002, 08:17 PM	#43
Cloudbringer Ironworks Moderator Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: Upstate NY USA Posts: 19,737	quote: Originally posted by Cerek the Barbaric: Larry, Cerek's here to give you a little Barbarian Back-up (not that you need it). The Bible does indeed say that a man should cleave to one woman and should not "put her out except for fornication" (if she cheats on you). It also says that "if a man look upon another woman with lust in his heart, then he has committed adultery" (paraphrased). I can't find exact text, but the Bible and Christian faith both believe that a man and woman should save themselves for marriage. I'll be honost and admit that I didn't, but that's the beauty of being a Christainl......we aren't peerfect, just Forgiven. And AFA Christians not being tolerant, I suggest you read the Religion thread. I held a very civil discussion with Garnet (a Wiccan) and fable (a pagan). Their beliefs come nowhere close to mine, but we were still able to discuss our ideological differences in a civilized manner. Calling the Bible a "2000 year old novel" that "contradicts itself in every statement" is NOT being civil nor respectful - whether it is said in jest or not. Neb (and others), what would you say if I called the Wiccan's Book of Worship (sorry, but I don't know the proper name for it) a manual for demon worship? Would you tell fable or Garnet to lighten up if they took offense? There seems to be a real double standard when it comes to Christianity. It's perfectly OK for anybody to criticize our religion or the Bible (there just expressing an opinion), but it's NOT OK for us to say "hey, I don't appreciate you making such disparaging remarks about my religion". Like Magik(?) said, a LOT of people DO base their life and actions on the teachings found in the Bible. If you don't, that's your choice and I respect it...all I ask is that you and everyone else show us the same respect. Plain old member-mode engaged: This was a good post! It bears repeating! I personally am not into anything 'wiccan or pagan' because my religous beliefs hold that I should avoid 'magic' and the 'occult'. Do I slag off the well-spoken and decent members here who have those belief systems when we meet on board? No! I respect their right to have different beliefs and as long as nobody insists I convert, I'm fine! Whatever my personal opinions, I will not go posting insulting material here. And the part about it being fashionable to insult or ridicule things Christian.. oh Cerek! That's a pet peeve of mine from way back! In this day of Political Correctness, somehow there has come a 'backlash mentality' that says it IS ok to discredit and ridicule Christians, but not the others. Anyway.. I'm hoping we can be civil here. Just liked what you had to say. hehe.. did you say you were a southern Baptist? LOL.. see stereotypes are not always right! Don't see you thumping a Bible and burning books while spouting about Fire and Brimstone at us all! edit: to the topic! LOL.. nearly forgot! I know that regarding procreation, my church does push abstinence outside of marriage. They do not excommunicate anyone for having sexual relations, but they do preach that such things are special and should be kept for marriage/love. Having said that, I admit, Nacht and I did not just hold hands all the time I was in Idaho. [img]smile.gif[/img] And to whoever mentioned fidelity after marriage - I believe in it then AND when in a dating relationship. If you are sleeping together, in my book it means a very special committment.. not just a pleasant passtime. Apologies to anyone who thinks that way, but as a friend of mine said recently "Sex is just exercise if it's not with someone you love." I can do aerobics if I need exercise, thanks! I prefer that intimate relations be just that.. intimate and special. Cloudy [ 02-02-2002: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ] __________________ "Don't take life for granted." Animal (may he rest in peace)

02-02-2002, 08:40 PM	#44
Tarox Manshoon Join Date: November 2, 2001 Location: Nottingham, UK Posts: 171	Just how many so called "religions" does America have? Im curious, as all the new religions are made up there and all the ones with strict orders or wierd beliefs seem to come from there too Wiccan? wtf is that and when did that get invented haha (Kinda noticed anyone saying they are a Wicca or whatever you call it is a Yank too.......coincidence? [img]tongue.gif[/img] ) __________________ <IMG SRC=\"http://tarox.homestead.com/files/TaroxE.jpg\">

02-02-2002, 09:37 PM	#45
Cloudbringer Ironworks Moderator Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: Upstate NY USA Posts: 19,737	Tarox, maybe you'd like to take that question to the thread(s) on religion. __________________ "Don't take life for granted." Animal (may he rest in peace)

02-02-2002, 10:58 PM	#46
MagiK Guest Posts: n/a	quote: Originally posted by Tarox: Just how many so called "religions" does America have? Im curious, as all the new religions are made up there and all the ones with strict orders or wierd beliefs seem to come from there too Wiccan? wtf is that and when did that get invented haha (Kinda noticed anyone saying they are a Wicca or whatever you call it is a Yank too.......coincidence? [img]tongue.gif[/img] ) Err actually I seem to recall several rathere severe religions coming out of europe...coming here to escape state forced coercion to a specific religion.....so the USA has no copyright on having strict religions..and as far as I know none of the religions so far developed in the US has mass numbers of suicide bombers running around the wolrd trying to hurt innocents.... Just thought Id point these things out.

02-02-2002, 08:03 PM	#42
Larry_OHF Ironworks Moderator Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: Midlands, South Carolina Age: 48 Posts: 14,759	"What? Magik, you are disagreeing with me? Telling me that I do not know everything that there is to know? How dare you! I, the fearless [img]graemlins/stormy.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/tgestar1.gif[/img] Modding Mage [img]graemlins/tgestar1.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/stormy.gif[/img] of Ironworks will slay you where you stand you stinking evil, vile,...." Larry looks around at everybody staring at him, shaking their heads and gritting their teeth in anger. He heard somebody whisper to call Ziroc immediately... "Oh...sorry...I am in the wrong forum...er...excuse me!" ~Larry scurries away as fast as he can to his own lands of power...~ [ 02-02-2002: Message edited by: Larry_OHF ]

02-02-2002, 11:00 PM	#47
MagiK Guest Posts: n/a	quote: Originally posted by Cloudbringer: Tarox, maybe you'd like to take that question to the thread(s) on religion. Oops quite right cloudy didnt realize what thread I was in...definately off topic with my reply to him as well So....you did more than hold hands while out west eh??? hehehehe Imagine that [img]smile.gif[/img] I agree with what you said about sex and relationships and fidelity.

02-03-2002, 12:26 AM	#48
Cloudbringer Ironworks Moderator Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: Upstate NY USA Posts: 19,737	quote: Originally posted by MagiK: Oops quite right cloudy didnt realize what thread I was in...definately off topic with my reply to him as well So....you did more than hold hands while out west eh??? hehehehe Imagine that [img]smile.gif[/img] I agree with what you said about sex and relationships and fidelity. No problem! Things got a little cross topiced anyway. [img]smile.gif[/img] Just that a debate on the stuff you and Tarox are doing would merit it's own thread, so go ahead if you think it needs more discussion. [img]graemlins/blush.gif[/img] err.. Ok, well, in the interests of honesty here... yes, we did. But for the sake of showing I put my money where my mouth is, I'll add that we have talked pretty seriously about the future and it is a committed relationship. [img]graemlins/blush.gif[/img] __________________ "Don't take life for granted." Animal (may he rest in peace)

02-03-2002, 12:32 AM	#49
MagiK Guest Posts: n/a	quote: Originally posted by Cloudbringer: [img]graemlins/blush.gif[/img] err.. Ok, well, in the interests of honesty here... yes, we did. But for the sake of showing I put my money where my mouth is, I'll add that we have talked pretty seriously about the future and it is a committed relationship. [img]graemlins/blush.gif[/img] We already knew that [img]smile.gif[/img] I will admit that at one point in my life sex was umm...well just a fun thing to do with whoever you were with, but as I grew up and had children I have changed my stance a bit. As I said earlier I think two people should know EVERY part of their intended mate before comitting to a long term relationship. It certainly wouldnt be fair to find out after the fact that one person had a SERIOUS need/desire for S&M and the other had a SERIOUS aversion to it. (I use that only as an example..for myself Im allergic to pain...pain hurts!).

02-03-2002, 01:19 AM	#50
Cerek the Barbaric Ma'at - Goddess of Truth & Justice Join Date: October 29, 2001 Location: North Carolina Age: 61 Posts: 3,257	quote: Originally posted by Cloudbringer: Just liked what you had to say. hehe.. did you say you were a southern Baptist? LOL.. see stereotypes are not always right! Don't see you thumping a Bible and burning books while spouting about Fire and Brimstone at us all! [ 02-02-2002: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ] Well, you know the saying about catching more flies with honey [img]graemlins/angel.gif[/img] Besides, you have to gently lure the heathens into the church before you can lock the doors behind them! [img]graemlins/showoff.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img] Seriously though, I AM a legitimate Southern Baptist, but I do prefer the "kinder, gentler" approach. My own personal circle of friends includes a Wiccan, a couple of agnostics (one of which I roomed with in college), and one VERY dedicated atheist. He and I have had several "theological debates" and I've learned a lot from them. I've never been one to force my religion on another. I accept the fact that some people have no interest in Christianity at all. Nothing I do or say will change that, but that doesn't mean that we can't be friends and respect each other. Thanks for the support, though. Your kind words really meant a lot. __________________ [img]\"http://img.ranchoweb.com/images/cerek/cerektsrsig.jpg\" alt=\" - \" /><br />Cerek the Calmth

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Marriage?	Yorick	General Discussion	28	02-19-2004 03:13 PM
Something you should know about marriage	Harkoliar	General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005)	7	01-17-2004 12:34 AM
Gay Marriage	Son of Osiris	General Discussion	16	10-18-2003 06:28 AM
On Marriage	Arvon	General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005)	1	07-15-2002 11:08 AM
Marriage	Arvon	General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005)	3	10-27-2001 11:02 AM