Another NERRRRRRRRD poll

[PurpleXVI]

Illumina is the sort of die where the number on the face isn't what you roll, it's how many San points you lose.

[shadowhound]

I am a GURPS kinda guy, you can pretty much do ANYTHING with that system.

[Felix The Assassin]

Originally posted by PurpleXVI: Illumina is the sort of die where the number on the face isn't what you roll, it's how many San points you lose.

Uhm, excuse me Mr. head squirrely, but in order to lose San points, one would need to have sanity first? Therefore, without sanity, a loss of San would be; what would you call it? Irrelevant!

[Illumina Drathiran'ar]

Here might be the place to interject that the... "game" to which we are referring gave us the word "die." Yes, it's short for "Roll this and pray that you die" but they shortened it to an innocuous-sounding word to make it more palatable to the mass market. It's true- you can look it up.

[Man Who Fights Like Woman]

AD&D 2nd edition for life, dawg. Also have a soft spot for Alternity without the skill limiting house rule from the time I became walking ranged death. The only problem is that I don't get to use my enormous d20 for that.

[Luvian]

Originally posted by PurpleXVI: And hey, just what are we going on about, here? You keep going: "BUT THEY DON'T DIE EASILY." and I respond: "Yes, because it's a heroic system, they're not supposed to." You respond: "BUT THEY GET TOO POWERFUl." I respond: "Yes, because it's a heroic system, they're supposed to."

Now that I've got some time to think, I can answer that question.

I actually have no problem with the hit point system, it can be pretty fun, when it fit. That's my problem. If this was a game about superheroes I'd be the first one to praise the system and do crazy things like jumping of buildings and walking in fire. But this isn't. We're supposed to be regular mortals, and they never gave us reasons to think we're more than that. Sure, you can learn to cast spells, fight with a sword etc. But you're still supposed to be a human, elf, dwarf or whatever. I can't justify the heroic system in this case, and that's what make me rebel against it. If the book gave us a reason and told us we were becoming supernatural entities for some reason I would have no problems, but it's not the case.

[Sir Krustin]

LOL about the dragons, I did the same thing with a party - damned near killed them all, too.

RIP Star Wars D20 - they're reverting to a HP system after using a combined HP/Wound system that fixes a lot of the problems a pure HP system has.

My favourite system is that used by Aftemath! - realistic, flexible, yet allows heroic roleplay. Despite it's title, it isn't just limited to roleplay in a ruined civlization, but the whole game is very well done. The system is pretty complicated, but plays fairly well once you get the hang of the rules.

[Luvian]

Originally posted by Sir Krustin: LOL about the dragons, I did the same thing with a party - damned near killed them all, too. RIP Star Wars D20 - they're reverting to a HP system after using a combined HP/Wound system that fixes a lot of the problems a pure HP system has. My favourite system is that used by Aftemath! - realistic, flexible, yet allows heroic roleplay. Despite it's title, it isn't just limited to roleplay in a ruined civlization, but the whole game is very well done. The system is pretty complicated, but plays fairly well once you get the hang of the rules.

Yeah, Dragons are hundred of years old, have the intelect of a genius and all that, but most DM play them like some stupid beast that just stand there and let itself get killed. At the very least it would try to run when it realize it's losing. Why would it stand there and let itself get killed? Most intelligent enemies should never fight to the death.

I did buy the d20 Star Wars core book I think, but I never played it. I used to play the Star Wars rpg before they introduced the d20 system. I really liked the crafting system of the old editions. I wish I had been able to play longer, we played it at lunch in high school and I think we only got something like 6 sessions of it.

I don't suppose the Arftermath! rules can legally be read for free online is it?

Edit: One thing that really get to me, in pretty much all pen and paper systems, is the lack of fatigue. You can keep fighting for as long as you like. Now in general it's for the best, it would get annoying fast having to track that all the time. But for duels and such epic fights, it's one of the most important element in my opinion.

[ 01-06-2007, 08:09 AM: Message edited by: Luvian ]

[PurpleXVI]

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on D&D, with the sort of system it has, it's the only way I can see it working, though... I suppose you could freeze HP gain at third level or so, still leaving it a bit heroic, but not insanely so. It'd mean characters could take a couple of hits, but more than a few strikes and they'd still keel over.

With that sort of thing, ambushes and surprise attacks would become far more important as well. It's a tempting thing to consider.

You should, of course, remember, that HP gain from con and D#'s is frozen after 9th level, then it's just +2 HP every level, so it really doesn't become as insane as the 100-200 dagger-stabs you described earlier. Maybe if you just did that after the first level, I could actually see that working. I'll have to try it in a game at some point, yet still leave the "epic" monsters with their high hit points.

And hey, D20? Get outta here, D20/3rd ed is the worst thing to happen to gaming. It's turning everything into generic mush just because it's an easy system. It even absorbed such things as 7th Sea.

Also, you may want to look at Alternity. It's got three sorts of HP: Stun, Wound and Fatal. The Stun HP, which results in unconsciousness when it's all gone, could easily be made part of some sort of stamina system. Same for the Unisystem with it's Endurance Points alongside the Hit Points. I think it wouldn't be unfair to rule that every round or two of melee combat or other really exerting fighting(Dodging back and forth while engaged in a firearms duel, high-G aerial dogfights, etc.) would result in the loss of a point of Stun/Endurance. It wouldn't be perfect, but I think it would make for a decent abstraction.

[Felix The Assassin]

Me tinks somebody is experiencing the effects of a delirium attack!