The "War" model

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Silver Cheetah: Yorick, could you just talk normally, please? There's quite enough high flown language as it is.

Huh? I am talking normally? What are YOU talking about?



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I am the walrus!.... er, no hang on....

A fair dinkum laughing Hyena!

[Diogenes Of Pumpkintown]

Originally posted by Tancred: Bush isn't just after the one man. He wants every international terrorist and every government that promotes, harbours or even just ignores the actions of international terrorists destroyed or reduced to nothing. THAT is the overall objective of Operation Infinite Justice. Once things are finished in Afghanistan, the armed forces will move on, fighting somewhere else, hunting and chasing and killing. Hell, that's not just a war. This is nothing less than a full-blown crusade. If a President says 'we are at war', that's a declaration of war, yes? A foolhardy one, a reckless one, an unnecessary one, a wrong one - doesn't matter what you think of it. It's a war alright - and if it isn't one now, it will be.

Hmmm . . . that is exactly what I am afraid of, Tancred.

[Silver Cheetah]

Originally posted by Yorick: Huh? I am talking normally? What are YOU talking about?

What's with the 'lest we forget' stuff?

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[John D Harris]

Originally posted by Yorick: You know what pisses me off about this? It highlights American arrogance. Are Palestine and Israel at War? Are the Ulster Unionists and the IRA at War? Are America so large and omnipotent that they are beneath "warring" a repressive government subjegating one of the poorest nations on earth and harbouring a militant religious sect with violent ends. I'm glad Bush has separated the Taliban from Afgahnistan, and Bin Laden from the Taliban. In earlier years the three would have been seen as merged entities and the "war" Diogenes is proclaiming as pure and "worthy" would have errupted. Much to Bin Ladens joy. The rules of Warfare change. WWI changed all the rules of combat, bringing trench warfare and minute land gains. Did we stop calling it war? Vietnam had a hidden enemy, rarely seen. Did we not call that a war? So the enemy is not merely a NATION. Well welcome to the new Millenium. The new Empires are multinationals with Coup D'Etats Colonies and Dynasties. The Emperor of a "new Empire" declared war on an Empire of the old school. I'm just glad the leaders have their eyes open to the reality of the situation, and are humble enough to take this seriously. All it will take is for the dissidents revolting in Karachi to grow (15% of the pop at the moment) and overthrow the government and we'll have an antagonistic, pro-Bin Laden nation with 40 nuclear warheads. Will that be "War" then Diogenes? Bin Laden will have two nations then. Remember the Golden rule. He who has the Gold rules.

Yorick,
Don't lump all of us "Yanks" in the arrogant, most of us are ready to deliever an "Olde fashion butt whipping" to whom ever is responsible for these acts of war.



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"the memories of a man in his old age,
are deeds of a man in his prime"

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Diogenes Of Pumpkintown: The crimes were committed on US soil. US law applies. The fact that Bin Laden conspired to carry out this plot on the US from outside of it does not save him under international law. The US would be entitled to go in and get him, by ordinary rules of law. Enforcing the sentence, if he was tried by court in his absence, which in our law he could be, could mean such things as possible assassination if that was the only way to enforce the death penalty, for instance. In any case, my whole point is simply that there is no need for us to go off half cocked screaming insanely and reckessly shooting up Afghanistan. Patience might give us much better results in the end.

Right, except that the middle eastern terrorists go on uninterrupted, the Real IRA continue on. Declaring War on the most disgusting cowarly ideology of modern times is a bold and proper step, and something the international community should have had the gall to do when it first appeared.

Regarding the "crimes on US soil" was not Nagasaki Japanese soil? Were they not Japanese women and children murdered? Convenient double standards Diogenes. The winner gets to do the labeling I suppose.

The soveriegn government of a foreign nation will not give up the said "criminal". It is against Islamic law to hand over a Muslim to non-Muslims, and we are talking about the most extremist interpreters or Islamic law!

What are you going to do? Let it happen again? Wait for chemical weapons to be used? A Nuke?

I am a pacifist. I don't sanction excessive violence. I have sung songs calling for peace and prayed fervently for it. But your twisting of terms infuriates me. A strong stand is not necessarily a violent one. I saw expressions of resolve, not expressions of destruction in Bushes speech to Congress.

But for Pete's sake let's call it what it is.


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I am the walrus!.... er, no hang on....

A fair dinkum laughing Hyena!

[This message has been edited by Yorick (edited 09-23-2001).]

[skywalker]

Geez!

The Hawks are beating the crap out of the Doves on this forum lately!

Tancred, you should read some of the propaganda you're writing!

Mark

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Silver Cheetah: What's with the 'lest we forget' stuff?

"We will remember them.... lest we forget" Is cited every Anzac day in Australia for the fallen.

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I am the walrus!.... er, no hang on....

A fair dinkum laughing Hyena!

[Yorick]

Originally posted by John D Harris: Yorick, Don't lump all of us "Yanks" in the arrogant, most of us are ready to deliever an "Olde fashion butt whipping" to whom ever is responsible for these acts of war.

I'm not John. I don't mean to generalise. I'm sorry.



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I am the walrus!.... er, no hang on....

A fair dinkum laughing Hyena!

[Silver Cheetah]

Originally posted by Yorick: "We will remember them.... lest we forget" Is cited every Anzac day in Australia for the fallen.

Gotcha. Sounded a bit weird out of context!



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[Tancred]

Originally posted by skywalker: Geez! The Hawks are beating the crap out of the Doves on this forum lately! Tancred, you should read some of the propaganda you're writing! Mark

I don't mean 'crusade' in a nice sense, skywalker. I took a degree in ancient history and I know what I mean.