All about fighter/thief

[Ultra Marine]

I've played elf FMT, elf FT, dc t>m...In all my T/F games, I've always used them as archers. And if they are casters then archer/caster. In rare times, find traps and open locks.

I've been playing around with dale keeper and found that a Half-Ling F/T (with str buff) has almost comparable saves to a paladin and ability to wear helm of defender. and a to hit bonus with slings.

Not bad i'd say but i have no experience using F/T as front line fighters or tanks. Does anyone actually use them? Are they any good at it?

[Aerich]

I have. It works ok on Normal and hard difficulty, but Insane (monsters do 2x damage and seem to hit more often) is a bit rough. Saves are good but HP are a bit low. Just about any character can have a good AC if you pump them with items, so you aren't doing too badly there.

The two downsides of a F/T tank are:
1) HP, because you split between 2 classes, 1 of which is the thief class (unless you go medium-high lvl dual at fighter lvl 9 or higher)
2) No spellcasting

#1 means that your F/T is slightly less durable than the standard paladin, and #2 means that the F/T is less versatile and has less self-buffs, thus less survivability, than any other mc or dc combo.

All of the above does not mean that you cannot use a F/T as a leader. It's comparable to using a single-class fighter without going over ** in any weapon. It's not ideal, but it works. Evasion is a handy ability in a tank, but it's not so handy that I'd want to use a F/T as a full-time leader - it'd be fine as a temporary first attacker against spellcasters, especially with speed boots and a dagger.

One last point; to my mind, the reason not to use a F/T as a tank is not because it can't work, but because it does not play to the strengths of the class, or at least does not do so easily. A tank is, by definition, usually the first targeted and most often targeted of your party members. That means it has to stay still so that pursuing monsters don't target other party members and force your party to break formation. That does not suit the F/T well, because sneak attack can only be used once per combat per monster, and cannot be used when the monster is targeting the F/T. On the plus side, a F/T with Evasion is ideal against spellcasters so long as they do not cast no-save spells like Magic Missile.

If I use a melee-focused F/T, I generally use it in the second row in a third-into-the-fight role. That way, it can buzz around between targets maximizing the damage it causes with sneak attack without breaking the defensive line (as most enemies will have targeted the two tanks before the F/T jumps into melee).

[ 10-19-2006, 02:41 AM: Message edited by: Aerich ]

[Dundee Slaytern]

Well, since I only played in HoF-mode, the few times I used a Halfling F/T as a melee fighter were stressful. [img]tongue.gif[/img] It is simply illogical to use them as primary tanks. They are however, viable as secondary melee fighters, after your REAL tanks and summons have engaged the enemy.

The main obstacle is their HP, as Aerich has pointed out. Additionally, while their AC can be good in the beginning( thanks to the Helm), it will not compare to a real tank that has access to personal buffs( Paladins, Fighter/Druids, Cleric/Rangers, etc...).

Cheers.

[Klorox]

You still get all of your thief-related bonuses even in heavy armor. I had a Gnome F/T who made an awesome tank. He wore heavy armor unless I knew the area was trapped (you can search, but not disarm in non-thief armors). If I started finding traps, I had some enchanted studded leather to wear.

Like I said, they make good tanks this way, but archery still rules the day in this game.

[Ultra Marine]

Ah... hit point ... that why my F/T die quick.

I'll stick with my F/M/T. Easier to survive compared to F/T. Number of kills is #2 compared to paladin. In another game my F/T kills is also #2. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Another small point i made there is saves. The halfling is best the gnome F/T due to +5 saves in paralysis. So if anyone wants to make F/T I'd say go halflings. Anyone agrees?

[Klorox]

While I'll agree that Halflings get better saving throws, Gnomes can get 18/xx STR, which is much more helpful than a 19 DEX, especially since we're talking about a Thief that's going to tank.

[Aerich]

A dwarf is comparable to a halfling or slightly better in terms of melee ability as a F/T because it can get a similar bonus against magic and can have non-enhanced 18/xx Str and 19 Con. However, they cannot wear the Helm, which is a point against them.

A full-time tank on higher difficulty levels needs at least minor spellcasting abilities, which is why a F/T cannot be a superior tank, no matter its race.