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Old 08-09-2011, 05:36 PM   #151
Felix The Assassin
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Default Re: Economy

Fresh off the press, I knew the numbers were inaccurate, just really failed to grasp how ludicrous this POTUS is. Was hoping that at least something good could come from the last two years of excessive fraud, waste, abuse and economy meltdown.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...um-against-sp/
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Old 08-10-2011, 11:32 AM   #152
John D Harris
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Default Re: Economy

Quote:
Originally Posted by robertthebard View Post
If by entitlement, you mean I paid into Social Security my whole working life, and now that I need it, and Medicare came hand in hand with my Social Security Disability, then yes, I'm entitled to getting that money back, with interest. Medicaid didn't kick in in my case until I had both disability and Medicare running, so I guess I'm entitled to that too.

Here's the conundrum, you can't cut the size of government w/out cutting those jobs. It royally sucks for those people that have jobs in parts of government where somebody that already had a job could have done the work, but reducing pork in government means cutting jobs that weren't essential in the first place. It's just too bad they aren't basing these cuts on performance/qualifications instead of pay grades.

However, what this should do is motivate government to actually getting off their asses and creating those jobs, or allowing the people that actually do create jobs to do so. Of course, they could also do a sweep, and eliminate all the illegal aliens working in the US, regardless of what jobs. They could also penalize/reward businesses that are the most hit by illegals for using illegal labor. If they don't have a legitimate work visa, they don't deserve to work. I wonder what percentage of unemployed American citizens would be working then? We could also penalize/reward manufacturing companies for either moving out of the US, or staying. I can't see any way I'd object to a tax cut for a corporation that keeps several thousand Americans working. However, the penalty for manufacturing goods outside the US could be as simple as import taxes on the goods they now make outside our country. Don't want to pay the levy? Simple, re-open/open a factory here, and give Americans jobs making what are supposed to be American products.
I argee that American companies that manufacture outside of the country should pay an import tax, but they get around that by owning a foregin company. Here in Tuscaloosa Mercedes doesn't build cars Mercedees Benz USA does, it is owned by Mercedees but is concidered a seperate entity not a foregin company. I know it is backwards of what you are saying, but American companies do the samething. GM doesn't manufacture cars in Mexico a GM owned company does. That's how they get around it.
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Old 08-10-2011, 01:36 PM   #153
robertthebard
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Default Re: Economy

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Originally Posted by John D Harris View Post
I argee that American companies that manufacture outside of the country should pay an import tax, but they get around that by owning a foregin company. Here in Tuscaloosa Mercedes doesn't build cars Mercedees Benz USA does, it is owned by Mercedees but is concidered a seperate entity not a foregin company. I know it is backwards of what you are saying, but American companies do the samething. GM doesn't manufacture cars in Mexico a GM owned company does. That's how they get around it.
There should be no import tax levied against Mercedes for a Mercedes built here. In fact, they should qualify for breaks for building plants here, and employing Americans to staff them. However, a Ford Focus, for example, that is built in Mexico should be taxed if it's intended to be sold in the US. Any tax breaks that Ford gets for having plants here should be offset by taxes on plants they have outside the US. The goal is to make sure it's not cheaper to do it outside the US. This "We own it, but it's not us" loophole needs to go away.
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Old 08-10-2011, 01:58 PM   #154
Felix The Assassin
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Default Re: Economy

Quote:
Originally Posted by robertthebard View Post
There should be no import tax levied against Mercedes for a Mercedes built here. In fact, they should qualify for breaks for building plants here, and employing Americans to staff them. However, a Ford Focus, for example, that is built in Mexico should be taxed if it's intended to be sold in the US. Any tax breaks that Ford gets for having plants here should be offset by taxes on plants they have outside the US. The goal is to make sure it's not cheaper to do it outside the US. This "We own it, but it's not us" loophole needs to go away.
Why Ford, what about Government Motors who build outside the confines of the USA (Mexico), then bring inside the borders to sell?

Also, RTB too much haterade?
Quote:
Since 2005, the Ford Focus has been assembled in Wayne, Mich. Even though it’s built in the U.S., the Focus’ domestic-parts content – the amount of American-sourced parts in the car – has been decreasing over the years; it now sits at 50 percent for the 2009 Focus.
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John F. Kennedy
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The Last Shot

Honor The Fallen

Jesus died for our sins, and American Soldiers died for our freedom.




If you don't stand behind our Soldiers, please feel free to stand in front of them.
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Old 08-10-2011, 02:11 PM   #155
robertthebard
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Default Re: Economy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix The Assassin View Post
Why Ford, what about Government Motors who build outside the confines of the USA (Mexico), then bring inside the borders to sell?

Also, RTB too much haterade?
No. As I stated, for example, I didn't pull any numbers from any website to say Ford is or isn't doing this along with GM. Ford was just the first company that jumped to mind. It doesn't matter to me what companies are or aren't. What matters to me is that companies that are are being rewarded for it. It's not limited to the automotive industry either, is it?
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Old 08-10-2011, 03:41 PM   #156
Felix The Assassin
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Default Re: Economy

Quote:
Originally Posted by robertthebard View Post
No. As I stated, for example, I didn't pull any numbers from any website to say Ford is or isn't doing this along with GM. Ford was just the first company that jumped to mind. It doesn't matter to me what companies are or aren't. What matters to me is that companies that are are being rewarded for it. It's not limited to the automotive industry either, is it?
Now your humming!
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The Lizzie Palmer Tribute



Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.

John F. Kennedy
35th President of The United States

The Last Shot

Honor The Fallen

Jesus died for our sins, and American Soldiers died for our freedom.




If you don't stand behind our Soldiers, please feel free to stand in front of them.
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Old 08-11-2011, 01:47 AM   #157
John D Harris
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Default Re: Economy

Quote:
Originally Posted by robertthebard View Post
There should be no import tax levied against Mercedes for a Mercedes built here. In fact, they should qualify for breaks for building plants here, and employing Americans to staff them. However, a Ford Focus, for example, that is built in Mexico should be taxed if it's intended to be sold in the US. Any tax breaks that Ford gets for having plants here should be offset by taxes on plants they have outside the US. The goal is to make sure it's not cheaper to do it outside the US. This "We own it, but it's not us" loophole needs to go away.
Agreed! About Mercedes, that's why I said I realize it's is in the reverse A foriegn company building here, verse a US company building in another country. It was an illustration of how the company builds the product without really building it, they own a seperate company that builds it. And yeah the lope hole needs to go away.

Alabama did give Mercedes lots of tax breaks and they are employing lots of good ole "bama rednecks" They just put in a second plant in the Middle of this economic down turn.... Mercedes Loves Bama rednecks, IRCC all new models will be build here in Alabama. When they come up with a new model they'll build another plant here. Huyndai and Nissan both said hmmmmm what the Hale is going on with Mercedes and Alabama.... They came down here and both built plants.
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Old 08-11-2011, 01:58 AM   #158
Timber Loftis
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Default Re: Economy

Look, we have BMW building it's new X3 in one of the Carolina's. I'm sure there are local incentives and whatnot, just like in JD's example of Mercedes. Local tax laws and perks can always be used to entice business -- look at what Ireland did last decade with the pharmaceutical industry.

But, truth be told, if we -- meaning us in the collective, as in, our nations -- worked as hard at harmonizing worker safety/protection and payment laws as we did at harmonizing our trade balance, it would all even out. For instance, if China had to meet minimum worker standards anywhere near the US/EU, then the siphoning of jobs would maybe not end but be less drastic. Why we want a "free trade" arrangements without making the other aspects of employment and industry equal boggles my mind -- it's not logically compatible.

And it doesn't just flow from the US to Mexico or China. Right now, today, there are IKEA workers in the US who do not enjoy anywhere near the benefits or wages that IKEA employees enjoy in Northern Europe, and it's making the papers regularly.

If you want "globalization," then you have to actually "globalize" all of these aspects. Then, perhaps, we could end what is ultimately an inefficient exercise in building plants overseas just to send jobs there, just to bring them back once those overseas areas start becoming more prosperous and start demanding more wages/benefits. True "globalization" means normalizing it all so the best usage of time, materials, and workforce is put to use, and if locale can become unimportant, then we will be free of this yoke of shuffling factories and jobs from country to country in effort to game the system.

Tax structures only compound the problem and are more gamesmanship. Let's take a hypothetical example. Let's say I'm BMW USA and I would rather pay US taxes: then I will simply keep all my profits in the US, pay US taxes, and pay out my dividends, bonuses, and perks to shareholders and officers. However, if I'm BMW USA and I would rather pay German taxes, then I'll just set up a licensing agreement with the German parent corp. that requires me to turn over X% of my profits to that corp., lessening what I pay in US taxes and shuffling it overseas. It's all a shell game, and, as with my earlier comment, a bit truer normalization would at least stymie, though probably never end, the shell game.
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Old 08-11-2011, 08:22 AM   #159
robertthebard
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Default Re: Economy

Those are the kinds of loopholes that need closing. If the company wants to be snippity and build elsewhere, then they'll need to pay import taxes if they want to sell products in the US, and won't that be tough on a US based company. The legal end of this is all mumbo-jumbo to me.
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Old 08-11-2011, 10:58 AM   #160
John D Harris
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Default Re: Economy

LOL Yeap this whole thing is a Shell game, and loop holes...

You're right TL about the othe countries not having the regulations we do, that can be solved in several ways:
1)Having them increase to our level
2)Us decrease to their Level
3)Combination of both of the above.

Each one of those ways has it's own set of problems and challenges.
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66:KIA 5008
67:KIA 9378
68:KIA 14594
69:KIA 9414
70:KIA 4221
71:KIA 1380
72:KIA 300

Afghanistan2001-2008 KIA 585
2009-2012 KIA 1465 and counting

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