Assisted suicides, Your oppinions?

[Stormymystic]

I was reading a story in readers digest about Oregon having assisted suicides, and I was wondering what you guys thought about it?

Me personaly, I belive it is morally wrong even if you are already dying, to take your own life, why not spend and enjoy your last days with your family, so they can remember you as a fighter? not someone who gives up because the doctor saidthey would die, I have known many termanaliy ill people who were given 6 months to live, live for up to 4 more years, so why take away that time with loved ones because you wish to die "with dignity"?

[Mouse]

Originally posted by Stormymystic: why not spend and enjoy your last days with your family, so they can remember you as a fighter?

And thereby hangs the nub of the problem. I have seen my grandfather waste away from cancer until he became a pitiful shell of the person he once was. There was no "enjoy" in his last months, only an increasingly painful and undignified deterioration.

We would convict a person who kept an animal in a state of suffering, yet we still insist that we take extraordinary measures to preserve human life, even when the quality of the life so preserved is bereft of any human dignity or rational hope of improvement and the individual expresses a wish to choose the time and manner of their passing.

I don't claim to speak for everyone, and these are my own personal views. I would also defend the right those whose religious or moral tenets militate against such a course of action to be protected from forced euthanaesia. Just as I would hope that those opposed to assisted suicide would respect my conviction that when or if I was faced with the inevitable end of my life, I could make the informed decision to leave this world in a manner, time and place of my choosing.

[Faceman]

The topic you are takling about if I get you right is Euthanasia (i.e. actively killing or assisting somebody in suicide to spare him from suffering in the last days of his life - e.g. someone suffering from AIDS)
Assisted suicide AFAIK deals with different issues. With people commiting suicide (mostly for health reasons) to escape from future physical or psychical suffering (i.e. somebody not wanting to live with a handicap) even if there is a high life expectancy left.

The difference as I understand it is:
Assisted suicide means only the person seeking death deems his/her life unbearable (for understandable reasons)
while Euthanasia means society oo a major number of people deem/would deem his/her life unbearable.

Euthanasia is indeed a very controversial issue especially with people who got terminal diseases that make them a mere vegetable for the last months/weeks of their life.
Here in Austria there is a movement of catholics (and the cath. church) which engages in care for such patients in their last weeks and tries to give them death in dignity without euthanasia.

Assisted suicide however (as I have defined it above and I am not quite sure if that is 100% correct) IMHO is close to involuntary manslaughter. Just because a person decides he/she doesn't want to live we can step forward and say: "I understand your situation" but we can't add: "and that's why I will support every stupid conclusion you draw out of it".
People who attempt suicide need help and not from a firearms dealer that isn't.

[ 06-14-2003, 06:01 PM: Message edited by: Faceman ]

[Mouse]

Faceman, I think you miss an essential point here. Suicide and assisted suicide are generally taken as diferent situations. Assisted suicide is generally taken to cover the situation where a person no longer has the physical ability to end their own suffering and by involving a third party, exposes that third party to the risk of prosecution for helping them to carry out their clearly expressed wishes.

In the UK, the case of Diane Pretty recently brought the moral dilemmas into the public domain.

I fully accept that this link may not give an objective view of her situation, but i defy anyone not to be moved by her story.

[ 06-14-2003, 06:16 PM: Message edited by: Mouse ]

My personal opinion, is that any terminally ill person should be free to make the choice for themselves. If they choose to end their life, then it should not be illegal for a doctor to assist them in making it as easy and painless as possible. A person should also have the right to include in their "will" a provision that if they become incapacitated and unable to make the choice, what their desire is. I think it is supremely cruel that we put animals out of their misery when they are clearly beyond help and in agony and yet force human beings to suffer some of the most god awful pain and agony all in the name of "being humane" .

That is just my opinion and thats what you asked for. If we want to argue the point...well thats not something I want to do right now...maybe later [img]smile.gif[/img]

You are right Mouse, it is a very moving story.

[Stormymystic]

I see your points, and although I wish I could agree with you guys, I grew up where my mother was always trying suicide, so my thoughts on even assisted suicides are that it is the "easy" way out for everyone unvolved I am not trying to start an arguement, just wondering why people would chose this, belive me, I do not like putting animals down either, but they do not really have a voice and there for are put down, I have seen dogs that should have been put down according to a vet because it lost 2 of its legs, now she is healthy and running on 2 legs, she has learned to cope, sp feel if a dog can cope with her indiginity of having only 2 legs, why can someone who has say Lou garrigs disease not learn to cope?

[Beaumanoir]

If someone is in constant pain, and feel they want release from the torture, i think it is morally wrong to let them live!!! If they have ,made it clear they want to die, then surely they can be given this.

Just a thought, is Assisted suicide looked on in the same way as suicide by christians? I know suiciders dont go to heaven, what about assisted ones?

[Mouse]

Originally posted by Stormymystic: I do not like putting animals down either, but they do not really have a voice and there for are put down, I have seen dogs that should have been put down according to a vet because it lost 2 of its legs, now she is healthy and running on 2 legs, she has learned to cope, sp feel if a dog can cope with her indiginity of having only 2 legs, why can someone who has say Lou garrigs disease not learn to cope?

Did anyone ask the dog if it's quality of life was what it would wish? When you demand of someone that they "learn to cope" with a particular disease in their particular circumstances with their particular beliefs are you not being arrogant in assuming that your impression of their circumstances take precidence over the sufferer's actual experience?

[Stormymystic]

Originally posted by Mouse: ]Did anyone ask the dog if it's quality of life was what it would wish? When you demand of someone that they "learn to cope" with a particular disease in their particular circumstances with their particular beliefs are you not being arrogant in assuming that your impression of their circumstances take precidence over the sufferer's actual experience? [/QB]

There is pain medicines now, no one asked me if my pain was to much to cope wit, istead everyone fought for me, and I passed the terminal state(no it was not cancer), and have lived 4 years past when I should have been dead, I would not change anything, I have my family and think og them when I say that my opinion is that to seek death is selfish, yes it would stop your sufferring, but would also cause everyone who loves you more pain in the long run, what if 2 weeks after you take your own life, they find a cure for your disease? how is it that I am arrogant? that I would rather live with my pain, knowing it might be the last day i have with my children? or is it that I belive that taking your own life is worse than takin someone elses? or that the person who helps you is in my opinion a murderer? am I a bad person because I think everyone should enjoy the life they are given for better or worse? and if I die then it will be with dignity because i fought till the end, my Grandpa also had terminal cancer. He fought it till the end of his days, 6 years past his 6 month term, and those were the best memories I have of him, so it is not out of selfishness I feel like I do, it is out of pity for those who have to accept that the person took their own life